I think we’re nearing the end of the road, friends.

I need more “you came for my marriage and you came for my bathtub” drama

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The “good old days,” before eating bows off cakes, rape allegations, etc., we had Naked Wasted. There has always been highs and lows. Dubai and new New York offer lighter drama but people don’t watch it because “it’s boring.”

IDK. First, as others have correctly pointed out, Housewives has always had these dark elements. Second, some of the franchises are still delivering top-tier TV:

• The past season of Miami, for example, was amazing. It made me both laugh and cry, but nothing ever felt fake or overproduced. And it brings the lifestyle porn.
• SLC’s campy ridiculousness is really fun to watch, and they rebounded from a bad season (3) with season 4.
• We’re seeing an OC renaissance, IMO. Last season’s low-stakes feud over Heather’s IMDB page was classic old-school Housewives silliness.
• I’m actually loving Dubai this season! Fully acknowledging how problematic Dubai is as a place, the cast has really been bringing it. It’s light and fun and silly, and I look forward to more feuds over things like who was closer to Beyoncé during her concert.

Anyway, I didn’t intend to write this much, lolol. Maybe it’s just that I’ve had a shitty week and I’m in need of positivity, but I think there are still a lot of bright spots in the Housewives universe!

There is not a darker era than S1-3 of RHOC, so I really don’t agree. S2 of RHOBH deals with domestic violence & Taylor’s husband killing himself before the season airs. Naked Wasted happens in S4 of RHOC. 

Imagine if, in 2024, we had episodes where: Nene tries to get Kim to do blackface, Jill sends her daughter to fat camp, Luann tells a girl that losing weight is easy if she wants to model, etc etc. 

Is modern Housewives really darker than Brooks faking cancer and telling Brianna’s husband to hit her? Or Vicki telling Kelly that David hits Shannon and then outing it on national TV? Or the Atlanta ladies starting a rumor that Kim Fields’ husband is gay?

Any of those plots are going to receive insane outrage today over being “too dark” and, like yeah, they’re dark. Housewives is dark. It was and always will be. 

Also, “false rape allegations” happened in 2016; I wouldn’t lump that into the modern era. 

You're just looking with rose colored glasses. These women have always been terrible... early RHOC was disgusting in it's racism and the amount the f-word slur was thrown around on nearly all franchises in the early years was insane.

We almost had a Real Housewife beat to death and then her husband committed suicide.

Real Housewives isn't going anywhere anytime soon.

I think the difference is less about what OP has pointed out but more about the authenticity of the show.

Vicki wasn’t screaming about a family van to go viral or become an “icon”- same with Heather having a meltdown about the bow. Now, it seems a lot of what is done across franchises are manufactured drama, rented houses and/or reads that they rehearsed in front of the mirror. (And they out on merch to sell immediately when the episode aired)

Whenever I see posts like this what comes to my mind is the homeless man downtown holding the "the end of world is here" sign, but, and I'm not a optimist person, the history of the world and The Real Housewives are just beginning 😶‍🌫️

Housewives has never been light and family oriented lol

Ramona turned into Ramona.

Because it used to be fun to watch rich people be stupid. And then like the world happened, and then we had Covid on top of that and we saw how awful these people actually are in the real world. And it became way less fun to watch rich people be awful in a time where so many people are struggling, the fun excessive excess and wealth just became gross.

And that’s not even counting all of the nasty shit that those women do to each other

there are posts like this every few weeks and i always wonder if we've been watching the same shows from the beginning. its always been dark and nasty ETA: people ITT have pointed out tons of scenarios that imo rival/usurp the darkness of what led to kenya getting fired

I feel like this post is really dramatic? I feel like the new seasons of housewives are overtly produced, but that's reality tv as a whole. Like another poster pointed out there's A LOT of good seasons of cities that have been happening just as much as bad ones. I feel like it's always been that way – some cities having great seasons and others having a slug.

Let's talk about the SLC's campiness was last year... the Big Little Lies meeting on the beach, Lisa and Monica's fight at Whitney's sound bath... I think that's some FUNNY stuff.

The goal now seems to "create drama to get screen time" game.

Even RHOBH's Taylor's huband was something that happened, it wasn't done for the cameras (far from it, she though she would be safer with cameras around). Even Reality Von Teese wasn't constructed for show, it was discovered and then revealed. Same with Scandoval. It's crazy because it happened.

But the stuff conconcted for the camera feels inauthentic and not interesting. RHONJ with the Melissa's Old Nose was the most extreme example--put damaging information out onto social media so Theresa can talk about it on camera.

Done.

I agree with your sentiment, but I think it’s more about the lack of authenticity than anything else. Back then the crazy moments were real, organic, generally unorchestrated (at least by the cast) and that made them captivating to watch. These days, everything is calculated to be a ‘moment’. To be a tiktok sound, a meme, a hashtag. There’s no way housewives can return to what it once was, because that world is gone.

The shows have always featured very dark themes, crime and fake wealth. The only difference is looking back through the rose colored glasses of nostalgia.

SLC, and Miami recent seasons have been top tier and would rival the “glory days” of the show and ratings have picked up with the last season of BH being the highest rated since 2014.

I think it’s more about what viewers crave and expect more than anything else. Back in the day there were bad things also but we watched those things shocked and horrified, now some of the people that committed these things are looked back on as icons. How many comments do we see saying bring back Danielle Staub when at the time she first aired people were horrified by her antics, now she’s a misunderstood queen 🙄. Viewers crave the crazy now, it’s going to drive more and more. When every episode isn’t complete chaos people are whining about how boring it is. I read comments and at times feel out of place bc people seem to love all the terribleness. And the women and productions follows all the socials, they know what people claim they want and are constantly pushing to give it.

Hey! We still have Miami

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You guys are so negative. You are looking for reasons to dislike housewives, it’s either too heavy of drama or it’s too boring is what people say. People are still watching so I’m sure they will still be recording and airing shows

Doing my 500th rewatch of rhony right now and I absolutely love Simon and Alex!

I wonder if a lot of the issue is that so many of the casts don't have an actual connection with each other. My favorite seasons were early Atlanta & Jersey where the women had known each other pre-Housewives. I feel like the drama feels more genuine when they're not just "co-workers".

I love the chaos and I personality hope bravo stays on this trajectory. As long as it’s legal, I’ll watch it

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I think we’re entering the era of one-off shows (aka the valley) that either hit or miss and live on based on ratings.

The problem with HWs is they’re committed to certain cities so if a cast fizzles out and there’s no great local women to replace them, Bravo is SOL.

I think they’re realizing they need to be more nimble with their shows so they have the flexibility to pivot when needed.

I can't believe how many people on here are misunderstanding dark moments. There's there were things that happen but most of those things were just life events. And some tragic Yes obviously. But what we're seeing now is really evil stuff to each other. I think the fame and the money has gotten so deep embedded in these women that don't do anything at any cost to destroy the other person. Hear me say this destroy someone. We didn't have that kind of thing in the early days.

The jersey fight this week was so MTV I couldn’t take it. Also no one likes Jen but I miss delulu charity events and galas. Danielle can’t host one of those, KR was not reimbursing herself for hers

Tell me you don't watch Miami without telling me you don't watch Miami.

I think this is why I'm enjoying Dubai so much. It reminds me of the old days of RH with the lavish parties, petty little squabbles and lifestyle porn

Miami is still good ‘I didn’t scroll far down enough’

Silex.. those heady days of s1-3 RHONY. Oh yes!

I would say the ultimate girls trips are now the best of the housewives. The most real and fun with no fake bs.

It’s turned into a show about a podcast, about an IG post, about a brand sponsorship. Bravo needs to put an embargo on no podcasting, media posts, or outside interviews during or about upcoming seasons. The glory days were all before social media. Now they have to have an after show before the reunion for you to even understand what’s going on. It’s circling the drain continuing this way.

This is the result of social media and all the blogging and shit.

Totally agree. Late Stage Reality TV is no fun. I can’t imagine what may rise from its remains.

I agree we're nearing a weird end to what these Bravo shows look like but I think, like a lot of the other comments here, I can't agree that it's because of how "dark" the shows are.
OC, BH, and many early seasons of NJ and ATL had very real and truly scary plotlines for the people on screen. It was a different time though -- can you imagine if Lauri and Lynn's children had had instagram followings? It could have ended both worse and somehow.. sadly... maybe better. Today actually the plotlines are much LESS dark than they used to be, because there are too many eyes on the stars for things to go so far off the rails. So it's hard to see but there are two sides here really.

The parasocial connections the fandom has with the stars is what is ruining these shows. We speculate ad nauseam about "production" based on, like, DeauxMoi and shit released by stars outside of filming... it's dumb. The way we relate to the shows now has become gross and made the stars grosser BECAUSE OF OUR ADDICTION TO OUR PHONES. If we put down our little screens and only look at the main screens we will be fine. But no. Can't watch Bravo (already mind numbing TV) without fucking Wordle and Instagram open on our little magic boxes, telling us all the extra tea we can't suck up from televised Bravolebrity fighting. It is our own fault my friends.

It’s NOT enjoyable anymore. I used to watch Housewives religiously it’s too hard to watch now

Same. I could've written this post...

You said it. I miss Alex and Simon too.

All while Andy Cohen virtue signals

I feel like we need more women who understand this is just a tv show and they have something else going on for their livelihood. The problem is those women don’t last long or they don’t care to do the show.

I think BRAVO is going to pivot out of Real Housewives land and transition into other programming soon. They've been trying to diversify into other programming, but nothing is sticking. I do think in 5 years, the Real Housewives universe will be very different than what it is now. Real housewives literally built what Bravo is today, they'd be foolish not to start finding other programming. I also think reality TV has just changed so much and is changing rapidly with social media that Real Housewives might be changing what it was to something different, Idk what, but I feel like BRAVO is in the same situation disney's in. They both relied heavily on franchises, but outside influence and audience taste is changing and they don't really know the next step, but they need to think of something.

I know. I am nearing my end. Miami is my only hope left.

The original concept was SO good. We all wanted to know what "life behind the gates" was like. We all wanted to know how the fancy CA women lived. And then it turned into the Tamra and Vicki Mean Girls Are Us Show and .... here we are.

RHOMiami gives me hope

Yeah I realized I’ve just stopped watching all of them. And I used to be obsessed

I cannot stress this enough: BRING BACK MELBOURNE!!!

I need Janet, Gamble, Gina, Chyka, and Jacqui back on my screen yesterday.

• fighting about book publishers and titles
• whether Jacqui really saw Gina’s grannie or a demon
• there’s a new sheriff in town
• the height of rudeness by bringing your own champagne glasses to a party
• “sally, she can go fuck herself. But I know she’s grieving and I do feel bad for her”
• “who the FUCK is Pettitfleur???”

These were the ultimate messy and petty queens 👑

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I don’t think it’s solely the housewives to blame for the franchises turning dark. Bravo used to document upper class women and their inner circles with their lavish parties, frivolous spending and petty fights about etiquette and who stole who’s hairdresser.

When fans on social media started to heavily get involved I feel like Bravo started to put pressure on the housewives to “be more entertaining” or lose their spot. So we’re getting an influx of veteran housewives and newcomers doing too much and trying to up the ante every season so they don’t lose this platform as a source of income.

The fans, the network and the housewives have become too aware of filming and how they come across and that will ultimately be the downfall of the housewives and really all bravo shows.

And people called the women on season 14 of The Real Housewives of NY boring for arguing about not eating enough, stealing phones, etc.

I already do miss it. 😞😩

Yeah i think it’s over.. re-runs forever

I miss the early seasons. That magic is so gone now. Between everything being formulaic and setup - and the social media fakery influence - it’s just not possible anymore.

Agree 100% with every thing you’ve said. It’s sad and true 💔

I feel like Bravo realizes the same thing and that's why all these spin-offs are taking place. The Valley, H.O.V, Traitors, UGT, I also wouldn't be shocked if we had another version of Crappie Lake

These shows need those authentic joyful moments again, now I think most casts are more image conscious and performative and have missed the point of the show

I feel like we need Housewives cities that aren’t mega developed and touristy. I’d love to see some smaller wealthy communities that aren’t as well known and maybe aren’t used to production crews and TV shows being filmed there. People in smaller cities and towns tend to know each other more so the dynamics could be more authentic in terms of friendships. Idk if that makes any sense but I feel like it’d put more of the “real” back into the housewives again lol

Sometimes I think maybe we need less franchises. More cast switch ups too. Like there’s so many franchises to follow now. A lot of the women stay the same throughout the seasons and between all their social medias and podcasts and articles we just aren’t as invested anymore.

Hot take...the housewives didn't change, we did.

I think since the 2008, there has been a lot of change in the values of people who tend to watch reality TV. If you look at the polling data in the US, there is all kinds of shifts in attitudes and demographics since 2008 and especially since 2016.

Between 2008 and 2016:

• The supreme court recognized same sex marriage
• The Me too movement highlighted sexual violence in the industry.
• Black Lives Matter started after a string of killings and has had a sizeable impact on how White voters view race. Many more voters today openly admit racism exists.
• Trump
• Obama was the first black president
• We've had a string of high profile shootings between

To me, it seems like the viewers of Reality TV have shifted their views and want reality TV to do the same but there's something of a hard truth here. I would argue, that reality TV is specific to the moment in history when it came out, in the early 2000s. And like all media, the ethics and mores of the time can be backed into it. Reality TV is meant to be shocking, dramatic, larger than life....it's the reason you are watching it and not a documentary or talking with a loved one.

You can make distinctions here and there between say, Housewives and Bad Girls but they are both more similar than they are different. And they both are closer to Shahs, Chrisleys, Love Island and whatever other reality TV show you are watching. They are hyperbolic representations of drama between people.

Kenya pulling out revenge porn is not surprising considering Phaedra's mess, Kandi throwing out Nene's stripper past, Nene throwing out Kim's business, and many other things from other franchises.

My surprise isn't that we see the women behave this way, it's that viewers again and again profess moral outrage and very typical Reality TV behavior

It was a damn good run though!!!

I think with Candiace, Kenya, Monica, and soon to be Jen Aydin getting fired, Bravo is going to move away from “volatile” personalities. While I understand the need for a code of conduct, these types of personalities are essential for maintaining conflict. Wouldn’t be surprised if the entire franchise shifts to a more PG, manufactured, surface-level vibe of new RHONY. Def an end of an era, but not for the reasons you listed.

Yup! Just like old bravo phases out (Rachel Zoe, Bobby & Whitney 👀👀👀, whatever Jeff was doing…flipping out?) it seems the OG HW bubble is bursting. They are def playing with new flagships with the Valley and adding after shows to VPR & SH. Trying out WH. It will be interesting to see what OG HW cities stay or will we keep getting HW adjacent shows like Girls trip.

Don’t forget about season 1 & 2 of rhobh Kim and Kyle’s limo fight and Taylor’s abuse coming out!

what is the false rape allegation or who should i say

Miami is my favorite. And SLC is my 2nd fave, even though last season ended like a staged play with Heather.. the older ones started to annoy me for different reasons..

Ramona was always like this. We’ve had substance abuse on every franchise (Bethenny’s boyfriend died of an opioid overdose, physical abuse on RHOA and RHOBH at least, prison and deportation on New Jersey, financial ruin on every franchise, etc etc. bravo is not darker now than it ever was. It was always like this.

I think it’s a franchise that always has high highs and low lows, you mention a lot of recent dark stuff that have happened but remember in the early days of Housewives we had a suicide, domestic violence, gate crashing the whitehouse! Real Housewives has always had issues because… it’s a reflection of real life.

I think it’s the social media usage as well. We know way too much about these people and their lives, good and bad. When they were just characters on TV, it was light. Now that they’re people IRL and we see their lives outside of filming, it feels icky. However, RHOSLC is keeping me around. I love that group hahaha

Do you think if another network created a similar but different style of show, that it would become popular as this frenchise?

beverly hills was the first and only show to have "super rich" castmembers. and maybe the dubrows. but housewives has literally always been about class/status delusion, that's what makes it good.

Just like I miss Alex and Simon.

they were the poster children for this!

I agree. In general Bravo has gone far too dark.

Season one of RHOC - Shane Keough uses the f slur on TV. I rest my case.

I could not have said it better and you said everything I've been thinking. Those of us who've been around from day one and are obviously older missed those days. Those who are younger audience and just really joining in don't know what you're saying and defending the insanity today.

Everyone's saying Dubai seems light I must be missing something I watched it for a few minutes and I was stressed. Just his caddy just his calculating just as stage just as planned and it's only the beginning it'll get dark it will get evil.

I’m just now watching Sunday’s episode of Jersey and I’m so glad it’s on pause. It needs to never come back. I’ve never liked Teresa and that dislike grows with each passing season. This is really not a likable cast. I like a couple of them a little bit. They are vicious and not fun petty! Please exit stage left.

Agree. Past its sell by date.

I was seriously just thinking about making a post like this.

That’s fine for you… I still like it and will continue to watch it

I don’t understand why they have to be all plasticky. Why can’t we have a RH of Portland, Austin, or Berkeley.