It feels... Creepy. He acts like it's a pleasant chance encounter, which feels so wildly inappropriate it can catch me off guard. He either acts like we're old friends or looks at me with this strange look...that might be pity? I just try to stay even and to the point and give no small talk. Considering everything he's done to me, and said about me and to me, I wonder why would he even want to be my friend, let alone why would I want to be his friend!?!? I often remark that he's the worst friend I've ever had.

To be fair, I know he's not following me or anything like that. It's hard to articulate. I remember asking him what it was he loved about me, and I will never forget that he said it was how I loved him. That sums it up, he feels entitled to things he's not willing or able to honestly invest in. He has dropped certain comments to mutual contacts that are just... odd. He's even gone out of his way to make them uncomfortable for remaining close to me and suggested that I'm being manipulated by my friends.

Reading my words back here in black and white, it sounds so harsh, but it IS facts. This is one major part I am trying to heal within myself.

I'm sorry, but also relieved to see your post and that I'm not alone. I've had other people justify his choice and it really doesn't matter to me. It may have been an objectively valid choice at the time, but I also know for a fact that he has manipulated the situation. Two things can be true at the same time.

This is great, thank you.

I have nothing to say to him. Every time I start, I remember that I went into every conversation with painstaking empathy and mindfulness, even when I was trying to talk about how I felt utter disrespect and lack of true accountability... only for him to literally wait for me to stop talking so he could reopen his script of assumptions and accusations. Outright disregard for any efforts made to meet his expectations, then being gaslit -yes, I'm using this correctly AND appropriately, sir- about those efforts by being told I "never" did "anything". And when confronted about using that always/never language, I was being defensive because I should know what he meant.

Oh, just how well you can pretend to be caring and empathetic, but are always dishonest with yourself. I took the brunt of it, and the rarest moments of clarity when I could compassionately hold the mirror up to you which only emboldened your sense of entitlement and hardened your contempt. I became the dumping ground for all your self regret.

For all the years I believed in you and saw what you were hiding within yourself, you were gathering resentments and silently making judgements. For all the times it took every ounce of courage inside of me to bring up a scary sensitive topic, the way you convinced me I was annoying and belaboring the point. Of course, now we know just how eagle eye my instincts were.

Beware the smart ones who speak/write eloquently and learn therapy language. Artful manipulation that you'd almost admire if it weren't so sad and sinister. They hide behind good deeds and hang their 10 gallon hats on the notion that they didn't mean to cause any harm. Pay attention to what they say after the "I'm Sorry", because that's how they truly feel about your feelings and having hurt you. The authority with which they speak is a preemptive dismissal of your valid feelings. To admit causing harm, even unintentionally, is too painful. For every reason you're hurt, there's 10 for why they're justified for treating you this way.

As much as this hurt, I'm grateful for the opportunity to discover what I really want and need. Not to him, but to myself for seizing the opportunity. I would have stayed with him forever, tiptoeing around his moods and living of reaction. I could have written him off and played a game of "who's more hurt!?!?". I think my silence might be misinterpreted as having some element of longing and regret. My no contact is simple - detoxing and deprogramming. I have shed the weight of seeking his understanding, I have no desire to hurt him but I will never again be kind to him in any way beyond legal and ethical fairness. Clear eyes and heart will help me fight for myself. It's freeing to know that I could literally take the time that I need, and I don't have to care if he insults me for not deciding right away. There's nothing left to coerce me as I steadily work to debug our communication dynamic. Lest he risk showing his true nature, because there is no more "behind closed doors". It's MY circus now. 🥸

I'm so sorry. I don't know you but I'm quite furious on your behalf, that's just... gross and shameful of her. Hopefully this does bring some clarity, and that in itself is powerful and healing.

Ultimately you'll have to figure out what feels right to you, keeping in mind that the reaction may be anywhere from good to bad to downright manipulative. Ask yourself, what do I want out of this new version of our relationship?

Without knowing her or you, these are just some of my thoughts... Maybe she won't call until there's a next time, and in that case you can set the boundary then. Choosing not to reach out or follow up this time also sends a clear message, you literally owe her nothing and following up in any way might make her feel like she's still got you on the hook and leave you vulnerable to being hurt. It's ok to not respond, despite what they say to you.

But if you want to maintain some level of contact, you can try sending a simple honest text, at some time of day that's convenient for you both so that if she does need to chat you're both available. Try to avoid blaming or promising or stressing future contact. I suggest looking up Grey Rock method if you're not familiar.

Hope any of this is helpful, best of luck!

It sounds like she found someone else who was available sooner to talk to about whatever it is. If this were just a friend I'd be like, whatever, I'll talk to them next time we catch up. But since this is an ex I find it rather disrespectful and insensitive to you. I'd either ignore them going forward, or politely and succinctly set a boundary about communication going forward.

You're doing great, he's projecting all his insecurities onto you. He wants you to do for him what he can't do for himself.

I went through a version of this, but it was generally more subtle and over many years. I spent longer than I care to admit trying to give him what I called my "pound of flesh", a way to prove that I heard him and I'm working on things etc. So, apparently I prove that to him, but shortly after he turns around and gives up. Yeah.

I could have been everything he claims he needed from me, and it still would never have been enough. He treated my depression like straight people treated HIV patients in the 80s. He literally said he "couldn't be around it". Mind you, I have found my career and am very good and respected at it.

I could go on, my point is... Fuck em

James just wanted to have two girlfriends

There's a whole lot of "shoulding" from others and yourself, even in this thread which I thought would be more supportive.

Listen, sure, all these things are truly going to help, but the details of your life, how you got here, and the fallout of this relationship are important. You'll do no good going to the gym, buying into new hobbies, etc if you're forcing yourself and end up feeling zero net positive from it. Some people here might call that excuses. But just because we all have something in common doesn't mean we all have everything in common.

My personal experience, it took a loooooong time to first accept that they were gone, all while I absolutely poured myself into finding ways to fix it. Then it took me a looooong time to believe that I didn't want them back, all while feeling intense mourning of the life I thought we had. I blocked them multiple times, came back, remembered why I needed to block them, but still couldn't let go.

I spent 18 years of my life doing and feeling according to someone else. The moment I realized that I started to practice stopping shaming myself into all the things I'm "supposed" to do. I did gain those lbs, I did isolate myself, but all along the way I kept checking in with myself and slowly started reintegrating or starting new things ON MY OWN TERMS.

In breakups, I think it's common to feel this loss of control, like something was ripped out of us. It's grief, and we all respond differently. Well meaning people share things they've heard or what helped them, without actually listening. For me, I found a pattern in this relationship that mimicked what I experienced in childhood and it has been a huge insight to healing and moving on. But it took a lot of time alone, self reflection, and therapy to crack open that shell. Don't get me wrong, friends helped, but I also had to learn to trust and to do that, there was work I had to do on myself first.

Just remember, your best is ALWAYS good enough, and everyday our best is relative. Be kind to yourself and the rest will come through that.

Congratulations, thank you for sharing! We all need support and it's amazing that we have this space to help each other thru hard times... But wow, we need shares of hope, too!

Going through the end of a 2 decades long relationship in my 40s, and it's forcing me to face my childhood wounds that caused me to develop coping skills and behaviors that made it possible for me to endure prolonged abuse.

Today is the first day in a long long long time that I felt happy, then I saw your post. It feels like perfect timing to reinforce feelings of hope and help bring myself closer to finding ways to love myself.

I hope this doesn't come off condescending but you have more time than you know. Congrats on getting out ❤️

I feel for you so much, this is a truly awful thing to do to someone. You deserve to be accepted for the unique and special person that you are! Damn, he tried to exploit the fact that you were willing to do the work, but you showed him! I think he probably saw your inner strength and needed to control it before you woke up to his immature BS.

I also kept getting a list thrown at me and I really couldn't meet all of them but even the ones I did meet I never got credit for. No wait, he would berate me for the things I didn't do by saying, and I quote, I "didn't do anything", so I would be overwhelmed and confused and questioning my reality so I would bring up how I answered his complaints about some of the things consistently and he would say to me that I was making excuses and I should just know I get credit for those other things. I also sat through hours of really judgemental stuff he said about me and us and couldn't respond because that's what he requested. I tried so hard but now I see he's truly incapable of having an adult conversation about feelings. He's always got to monologue and be validated unconditionally.

I'm just disgusted looking back on all that, and how guilty I let him make me feel. I protected him and his image. In the end it simply isn't about being wrong or right, it's about respect and decency.

I'm so sorry, you deserved to be nurtured and seen during that time (and always for that matter).

When I needed to veg and recharge he would seem fine... But then some time down the line he'd throw an insult at me for just wanting to watch TV and that our major accomplishment as a couple was finishing so many series (despite having a pretty active social life and active outdoors). So then I started getting anxious when I was sick and needed actual rest, feeling like I needed to justify and explain my symptoms, which is odd for me because I normally mask well. But I was also so exhausted all the time and felt so confused all the time that I really needed the rest.

Wow yeah I went through this too. ❤️

I just want to say, avoid using any terms like narcissist or gaslighting with a person like this. They will use it against you. Stick to your I feel statements and enforce your boundaries when it's clear they're not willing to take your feelings into account.

I'm so sorry for your loss and that you had to endure that kind of cruel indifference from your partner.

Grief is different for everyone, the worst thing we can do for ourselves is ignore it or try to control it. I give you a lot of credit for taking the time you do to be with the memory of your sister. I think emotionally immature people can feel threatened by people dealing with heavy emotions in a healthy way. It takes a lot of strength to sit with those feelings.

Mine did a lot of things for himself then assumed I would just follow his lead, shamed me and called me lazy and fat in covert judgement ways (he wouldn't dare be caught saying it directly). He also unequivocally stated that he cannot be around depression. How do you think that worked for processing my grief? My god, the more I talk about it the more I am shocked with what I put up with.

Literally ignoring my apologies (and compliance) and labeling me as defensive and distant knowing that I would care about hurting them. I was "defensive" because he was behaving hostile without warning, I was "distant" because his behavior was harmful and I needed time to regenerate my strength. He still sees zero part he played in any of this and is doubling down that he's the victim.

If I brought up even the smallest thing he'd accuse me of being vindictive (projecting much?) and trying to ruin the mood.

I'm ashamed of this, but I was desperate. He had said to me repeatedly, as a justification for his behavior, that yelling was how they communicated at home and it's how they knew someone was upset and really needed to be heard. So one night I did it to him. I made a conscious choice to be as loud and imposing as he was to me. I convinced myself that if I did this, he would finally see I needed him, and that my acting so out of character would be a jolt to him.

It only caused emotional damage to him that hardened his resentment and ultimately used against me. Right, because my one night of verbal assault is equal to his repeated barrages of abusive yelling. I sincerely regret this action on my part, but I've read about reactive abuse and that helps.

That's messed up, I'm sorry. But seriously what the actual f*#&! What does that even mean? All it says to me is that he is inherently unable to empathize with another human being. Like they have some construct in their head about how people "should" be and if they fall short of that they're not worthy. Mine has that, when I was in mourning he had an idea of how my grief should look and when it didn't go that way he blamed me for not showing up for him during that time.

Oof I related to this. I got stuff like "if you don't shape up I'll never forgive you".

The therapist caught him once by explaining to him that he creates the situation he's trying to avoid. I saw it register with him in that moment but then he must have rationalized it away because nothing changed. I'm still an obstacle and left him alone.

They have to blame you because it would absolutely destroy them if they admitted they were not perfect.

My abuser was very careful with written words, but unhinged in person. I've repeated things he said to me and at best he's "shocked" he ever said that, at worst there's a wild but deeply rooted reason why he was forced to say or do it - always justified BUT makes sure he states how much he is aware and there is no excuse. Like saying I know you're upset but here's all the reasons why I can't care and how dare you insult me.

Oh I just read about emotional reasoning in an abusive person. "Because I feel upset about something is proof you have done something wrong to me".

I feel so connected to what you're sharing you don't even know. I feel sick to my stomach to think of how he portrays me to others. Primarily because the straw that broke the camel's back is a big secret and makes him look like a pig. When we were "working on it" he said so many awful things I was horrified. I pretty much feel like our whole relationship was a big lie because of how he revealed that he actually sees me - which is through an extremely judgemental lens. But now it makes sense, so much sense, and I recognize that I knew something was really off and blamed myself but it was really me avoiding looking too close at him because deep down I knew that once I was faced with it I would not be able to stay.

He tore me down and discarded me but the whole time played like I neglected him. I felt invisible, and crazy. I have been spending so much time trying to get external validation for my experience but I'm starting to realize the only validation I need is from myself (as I wrote this long reply lol still working on it). I realized that there's no magic phrase or anecdote or share that's ever going to make him see. THAT is what I am mourning the most. That no matter what, he is simply incapable. And not only that, he's still on this earth living in the belief that he was justified. And that he has no idea just how toxic and in denial he is, and that I spent so much time gently trying to help him (because I know that these behaviors come from a very fragile sense of self), but now he pities me. He was a coward and an emotionally unavailable person, and my patience and compassion was brave. I'm not saying I am perfect (something he exploited btw), but I'm not who he says I am. I think he projected the things he hates about himself onto me as a way to protect his fragile ego.

When I hurt him it became my everything to try and make it up to him but I was stonewalled, and yelled at when I tried to discuss it. He even yelled at me for asking clarifying questions. Yelling makes me shut down and I asked over and over again for him to stop and it never stopped. The amplitude of the reaction from him was the same intensity whether it was a big or small transgression. I felt condemned before he even addressed things with me, IF he ever addressed them with me (most often coming out in a fight and yelling). If I tried to stand up for myself because I felt I was being pummeled, I was slammed for being defensive and dismissive. because he shut me out so much I never got a good understanding of what he was asking for, so I did my best guess, which was ultimately wrong, and that's what he points to as the justification for his behavior and why he couldn't work on the relationship.

When he hurt me, if I let him know I would do a million contortions in my delivery to try to avoid making him feel bad or attacked. He would not respond well. He was not concerned that he hurt me. He would bring up something I didn't do as a reason why he was that way to me. I would always be coming out if that conversation apologizing. Then he'd love bomb me, tell me I was right and shower me with affirmations and general statements of validation, but nothing specifically addressing the issue. I now know that he was placating me to get me to comply, and had zero intentions of entertaining my complaints. He played the part of remorseful partner but secretly resented me. If I was too afraid to tell him I was hurt, I simply withdrew, I would never hold him responsible for a feeling I'm not addressing myself. I absorbed a lot, let a lot of things go, like really go, because I knew deep down where he came from and I gave him a lot of lattitude for that. I got zero of that back. If he was kind to me I believe it was genuine, but the Lizzo says it best: "why men great til they gotta be great". Then we feel selfish or too much when we're just asking for THE BASICS.

Ultimately he discarded me and I finally stood up for myself and his reaction was to deny he discarded me but that I was an obstacle to everything he wanted in his life. How could I want to be with someone who sees me this way? How could I miss them at all? Why does ANYTHING he says or does have any impact on me whatsoever?

I try to remember that my super power is love and compassion, it's not a weakness. I just need to learn how to direct that power inward, because I'm worthy of at least the same love and compassion and understanding and forgiveness that I offered people who did not earn it.

I relate to this, sounds harsh but he's dead to me. I will never make those jokes again, we will never be friends.

I'm going through the same thing, so I really appreciate your post. This past week I was reeling hard and ruminating over things he said. In my better moments I remember that I put too much weight on the things he said and did, that I know I am correct and that's all that matters. I have a problem with being overly self critical, I don't allow myself to feel what I feel because of how it might affect others. It's why I stayed so long, I didn't think I deserved better, the uncomfortable feeling I had about him was more than tolerable, it felt familiar and therefore comfortable. It's been so hard to unravel all that. I find it helpful to think of it like hooks.... And to be patient with myself. A quote/mantra from Melanie Tonia Evans that you might find helpful:

“I am sending love and forgiveness to myself for not being able to let go of who and what is not serving me yet. It’s not because I am defective, incapable or unable to do so. It is because I haven’t as yet gone within to unhook the parts of myself that I can’t let go of. When I do this, I will go free.”

There's so much going on here but let me just say, what happened to you is not your fault. When we grow up in dysfunctional homes we learn what we need to do to survive. I don't need to know the details to know you've done such a great job getting through all that. You're here and you're examining yourself for ways to find healthier connections and behaviors. This is hard, so hard. There are so many people out there who don't know how fortunate they are to not have to suffer through this. They will not understand, they will label us, and reinforce the negative thinking we learned growing up in an unacceptable environment. We started at a deficit, and we may be looking towards others to make up that deficit. That's so hard to accept because it means we have to accept responsibility for our behavior now when we were the ones wronged as children. It might feel like that betrayal from childhood acts out again in our adult relationships. We might choose unhealthy people because we are conditioned to tolerate unhealthy conditions.

If this person hurt and betrayed you, please know this is not a reflection of you. He was not your person, period. It doesn't matter one iota what he thinks or tells his parents, he's trying to protect his image and deflect from his shitty behavior. If he refuses to accept responsibility and take accountability for his part, you have no control over that - but you DO have the power to reject that toxicity. Find ways to distract yourself from him at all costs and focus squarely on YOU. You're worth it!!!!

Sounds like a Christian based therapist. Find yourself an individual therapist that's not religiously affiliated. Possibly event a trauma specialist (you could be affected by PTSD as a result of abuse).

If you're currently submitting to keep the peace, you definitely need someone on your side. When you start the process of leaving, he will feel threatened and he will take it out on you, he may even reject you. None of this is a reflection of you.

You have already made the decision that you want to leave. That's huge. Trusting your instincts is hard to do after you've been manipulated, they condition others to question everything and thus live in uncertainty.