My bf still says he's straight

Need Advice

I posted a few months ago on here discussing a guy I had been seeing for a little and how shit had gotten complicated. Long story short we're dating now but there's a kinda big issue..

My boyfriend still identifies as straight and doesnt want to explore his sexuality any further other than us I suppose. I should probably mention im FTM which makes this seem worse than it is but I know for 100% certainty he sees me as a man.

When we had the conversation that made us official he described his sexuality as, as long as there's a strong emotional connection gender no longer matters to him which is sweet and all but he just seems desperate to cling to the heterosexual label. He knows he isn't fully straight but says that "no one's straight straight".

I'm the first dude he's had feelings for I really don't want to force him to find a label but it gives a sense of security to me. He's also iffy about saying we're a gay couple and says "we don't need to label stuff" and to just "live in the moment".

My friends think I deserve better but I dont know. Any advice would be great to be honest..

in lgbtby GodOhEric

Bi-kes on Trans-it

313

97%

25d

NapalmAxolotl

359

Don't Pan-ic!

25d

I've seen cis guys do this to ridiculous lengths because of internalized homophobia - one of them literally told me "Sure, I go down on my male neighbor all the time, but we're both straight, it doesn't mean anything."

Explain to him clearly that by identifying as straight, it's bad for your dysphoria because it implies that you aren't a man. He should understand how this is important specifically because you're trans.

If he still cares more about pretending he's straight, then yeah, you deserve better.

GodOhEric

129

Bi-kes on Trans-it

25d

Yeah I'll be sure to sit him down and explain everything as soon as I can because this is taking a huge mental toll on me. Hopefully it goes well

Raeil

-36

Healing

24d

Explain to him clearly that by identifying as straight, it's bad for your dysphoria because it implies that you aren't a man. He should understand how this is important specifically because you're trans.

I never thought I'd see a day when a queer subreddit would have a top answer that effectively says "yes, you can force another person to change who they are because it makes you uncomfortable for them to stay in their current identification, and if they don't then they're the one in the wrong."

I get that there's a conflict here, and that it needs to be addressed so that a resolution can be found, but to immediately land on forcing someone to change how they identify as the only moral resolution is ridiculous.

factolum

24d

Who’s “forcing?” His ID is his own, but if OP is uncomfortable with how this is affecting him, the two of them should absolutely have a realistic convo. Maybe they break up! Maybe the bad discovers that he needs to push through some internalized homophobia and start IDing as gay or bi. Maybe OP decides he can live with the “no labels” status quo (though I doubt it). But OPs comfort is important here too!

OkMathematician3439

Trans and Gay

24d

What was bad a typo for? No shade, I just can’t think of anything that would autocorrect to bad (except dad which, ew).

-DragonFiire-

24d

BF, maybe?

OkMathematician3439

Trans and Gay

24d

That makes the most sense.

factolum

24d

Haha yes BF! I’m truly the worst at typos…

OkMathematician3439

Trans and Gay

24d

No worries.

Tara_Kitten

24d

Boyfriend's denial and internalized homophobia is having a detrimental effect on the relationship and on OP. The boyfriend doesn't have to label himself gay (he can be bi, pan, heteroflexible, etc), but he's pretty reluctant to admit it's a gay relationship.

Exciting_Rich_1716

Trans-parently Awesome

24d

Well, they are in the wrong. No one's changing "who they are", just how they label themselves. OP's boyfriend is already in a relationship with a man, he just refuses to call himself gay. That's problematic to a trans man who feels invalidated in this case. What's the issue with that? What's your solution?

Neverspecial0

24d

"I'm not gay, there's just this one single man that I'm into" seems pretty straight to me. If people really want to split hairs I believe they call it heteroflexible.

But f'real, the label police are really showing their ass. Same people are probably the ones that think a woman isn't bi when she's dating a man; just let people like who they like and stop cramming them into little boxes.

Reiko707

Trans-cendant Rainbow

24d

I think you two don't understand the situation fully

Edit: no, no one is trying to force straight people to be not straight here. DV me if you want, that won't make it true

Neverspecial0

24d

Neither does anyone else who isn't OP or this person

Reiko707

Trans-cendant Rainbow

24d

Sure, but I do believe you and the other commenter still aren't understanding the situation. Especially if yalls take away is that everyone here thinks you can force straight people to not be straight by pressuring them into it. That's just not what happening here

AminoFoxFriendly

Panromantic demisexual ^^

24d

We don’t try to force him. He says he’s het and at the same time he loves a guy. Yeah, trans, but I got, that OP identifies himself as guy. So if his bf considers himself a heterosexual, he literally means, that his lover is a woman. I’m not a trans, but i think it probably uncomfortable for OP, when your partner doesn’t take your gender identity seriously. Imagine, that someone don’t believe in your orientation for ex, doesn’t talk about it straightforwardly, but seems like he means that. It’s unpleasant. Or he doesn’t understand that yet. OP should talk to him bf anyway.

ActualPegasus

123

Blueberry

25d

It sounds like he's struggling with internalized biphobia but that doesn't excuse him to project it onto you.

If bisexual isn't right for him, there's also heteroflexible and queer. Regardless, the reality is that you're in an achillean relationship and he's not straight.

You just have to ask yourself if you're okay being with someone who's not out. I personally wouldn't be.

GodOhEric

Bi-kes on Trans-it

25d

I dont really mind being with someone who isn't fully out. He's mentioned if his friends ask about his relationship status he'll mention me and not dodge the question or use gender neutral pronouns or anything. He'll be upfront hes with a man kinda thing but eh it's really bothering me

ActualPegasus

Blueberry

25d

If you want to give him a second chance, I strongly recommend he get involved in achillean spaces to help him come out fully.

r/BisexualMen r/bisexualadults r/bisexual r/AskGayMen r/GayMen

are just options off the top of my head on reddit.

I completely understand though if you don't want something you have to spend countless hours on to make progress (especially as it's not guaranteed to work). Don't feel that just because you're his boyfriend that you have to "save him." He has to deeply want to "save himself."

SoloWalrus

Bi-bi-bi

24d

I have never heard the term achillean, that was an interested read. Im annoyed that in high achool they had us read Homer and it was never mentioned that achilleas had a gay relationship, seems like queer erasure. Certainly would have made english class more interesting.

Its also very interesting to me that we pick historical figures to describe our sexualities, feels so academic 😅.

sophia-sews

Ace as a Rainbow

24d

Thanks for the link, I'd never heard of achillean either, but I guess it makes sense to have a word like Sapphic but for men- same thing with the historical figures too lol.

Girl_Gin_Smash

24d

Labels aren't necessarily indicative of behavior. In the same way that platypuses are mammals but lay eggs, your boyfriend might be straight but just so happens to be in love with and attracted to a man in this particular context.

Trying to force him to change his label or identify is like breaking the Prime Directive. It's not your decision to make for him -- if he decides to change (or not change) his perspective on his lived reality, that's up to him and him alone.

willothewoods

Transgender Pan-demonium

24d

Labels describe behavior though, and I would be concerned if say a woman was dating me while insisting she wasn't gay for example. There's an extra level of fraught around this, especially since a trans person is involved, and the partner is a cis man. Like you're right, op can't force the guy to change anything, or even to address his internalized issues, but it still stands that a man dating another man, specifically a trans man, and insisting he's "still straight" is a huge red flag, and there's a real danger that can't be ignored that he may not see op as a "real man". And even if that isn't the case there's clearly some stuff he needs to work on, and op deserves someone who won't string them along in such a harmful way.

Girl_Gin_Smash

23d

I think whether this is harmful or not really depends on how the two of them interact with each other. I understand the concern about OP possibly not being respected as a man. But I contend that forcing one partner to change how they identify is only going to cause more issues in the relationship. It's different if he chooses to reevaluate his label, but that's his choice.

Like, if a gay cis woman in the 1950s spent her whole life married to a cis man and it turns out they get along really well despite their different sexualities, would we demand that she change her identity to be "bi" or "straight"? If a gay cis man has only ever dated cis women up to this point, do we force him to identify as straight because it's problematic for him to identify as something that doesn't match his lived experiences?

I think, as a trans person, it can even be empowering to be that one exception. To know that this person loves you so much that you're their "I'm straight buuuuut..." special person; that you break the ""rules"" of their sexuality. That of course depends on OP's bf actually respecting OP's as a man -- i hope that's the case for sure -- but I think that's a different matter from how the bf chooses to consider himself.

not_doing_that

Pan-cakes for Dinner!

24d

🤣 motion to call all straight people who fall for an exception platypuses

AdThat328

24d

I've known people who identify as straight but fall for someone of the same gender. It doesn't make them less straight as they're not attracted to that gender as a whole, but one specific person. It's a confusing world but that's why labels are silly.

glitterandrage

24d

Yeah I'm inclined to agree with this perspective. I don't think straightness needs gatekeeping, as much as queenerness needs validating. Only you get to decide how you experience and describe your attraction.

It can be really hard on the GNC partner's dysphoria. I think in that case, it's helpful to figure out how much of the discomfort can be personally worked through and how much is just an incompatibility.

factolum

24d

Self-ID is most of sexuality IMO. Remember those truckers who kept sleeping with each other and insisting they were straight?

Which is to say—your BF can label himself however he wants—it’s his ID.

But what’s important is whether you feel comfortable in a relationship where your partner will or cannot label it as gay. I know I couldn’t deal with/ that, as a treats woman.

The “let’s hot out labels in it” is also concerning—that’s kind of a red flag imo—so many guys use that, one, to get out of publically acknowledge being in queer relationships.

Does he introduce you as his boyfriend? Are you ok being in a “thing” that you can’t name? Is this long or short term?

Your comfort should be paramount.

Jiitunary

Lesbian Trans-it Together

24d

There's definitely people who identify as straight with an exception or gay with an exception. Their identity is valid. If you're sure he sees you as a dude, he might just be one of them

not_doing_that

Pan-cakes for Dinner!

24d

I’m with you. All the immediate “he needs to change how he identifies to make you feel better. If he’s fucking a man he isn’t straight” is really icky. Thats not something anyone but him gets to decide, and it needs to be on his own terms.

Thats literally setting yourself on fire to keep someone else warm. I know OP would never want that for his bf, so I hope they can find a solution that works for both.

Sounds like BF does everything ‘right’ (claims his BF in public, doesn’t hide his identity or pronouns, treats them like the man they are, etc) except their own identity, which no one else gets a vote on nor get to tell him it’s wrong

willothewoods

Transgender Pan-demonium

24d

*WAVING A BIG RED FLAG* Look, I don't know your boyfriend, and I'm sure he's a swell guy or whatever, but that's a log of baggage to unpack. Pardon me, but I don't want to see you harmed here so I'm going to be kinda rough on him. Lets just say I have no patience for the cowardice of cis men regarding their sexuality.

This is genuinely concerning behavior, that I've seen directed at trans women as well. Men dating someone trans to "experiment" or at least allow themselves an excuse for why they're "not gay though". And it's genuinely a refusal to examine themselves and come to grips with their own sexuality. Many men are into me bc I have a dick, but also tits. So they get dick without feeling like they fucked a man. Which like, yeah I'm not a man, but they actually want to fuck a dude. And with you, not only is he completely invalidating the fact that you *are* a man by refusing to interrogate his own sexuality, but he likely gets to rationalize it away as you being "man lite" which is DEEPLY transphobic, indicative of internalized homophobia, and also just gross. If he "100% sees you as a man" he should be willing to accept that he's into men, and therefore his sexuality is NOT STRAIGHT OR HETEROSEXUAL. I am genuinely concerned that he doesn't see you as a man at all, but just his "masc girlfriend" who lets him "experiment" with his sexuality safely.
"no one's straight straight" is hilariously on the nose for something someone who's repressed queer would say anyway. Like it's okay if he's pan or bi (I sure am) but he needs to grow the fuck up and face the music here. He does need to find a label for it, bc it is genuinely harming you to not acknowledge the form of your relationship and hide behind your trans body like a coward.
Your friends are CORRECT and you should listen to them. As far as I'm concerned, this man is not boyfriend material until he's able to finish growing up and accept himself here. He has a lot to unpack and you not only don't deserve to have to deal with that, but it's just NOT YOUR JOB. Being available to talk about it is one thing. But as long as he's allowed to hide behind his internalized bs, and you let him, he has no motivation to change, no reason to address the stuff he's repressing, and you'll just continue to be harmed by this.

Please stay safe, and take care of yourself first and foremost. Don't ignore your friends and talk to them more about this too. They clearly care about you, and you don't want to lose them. And please please please don't be afraid to dump his ass if he won't shape tf up. There are so many other people who will respect you and love you wholly for who you are, and with much better understanding of themselves and how they relate to you. I'm not saying he can't get better, but don't get stuck trying to "fix" him. The only person anyone can fix is themselves.

Sending hugs. I really, genuinely hope this goes well for you.

UnspecifiedBat

Non Binary Pan-cakes

24d

Honestly? I have a lesbian friend … who has a boyfriend. She just lovingly calls him "her exception“ and that’s it.

As long as he doesn’t devalidate who you are, doesn’t deny you are a couple in front of others, and sees you as a man, I personally don’t think there is any reason to pressure him into changing what he feels is his sexuality.

koolforkatskatskats

The Gay-me of Love

24d

But then she's not lesbian lol. She's pan. Lesbians by definition do not have a romantic or sexual attraction to men.

UnspecifiedBat

Non Binary Pan-cakes

24d

And she doesn’t. With only one singular exception.

Who are we to define someone else’s sexuality?

Sufficient_Sun_1224

Sexuality is a spectrum :) if your friend like women and men that’s okay

UnspecifiedBat

Non Binary Pan-cakes

She really doesn’t though. That’s really all.

She has one exception. Exactly one. No attraction to any man ever otherwise. Why do you insist to try and define her sexuality for her?

Temporary-Door5906

Bi-kes on Trans-it

24d

Let him identify how he wants to. If his identity makes you dysphoric, break up

Flareing

24d

I'm probably gonna pivot slightly differently than other people, but I don't think there is anything wrong with him describing himself as straight but with you as an exception. If he clearly calls you by he/him pronouns, calls you his boyfriend etc, then him calling himself bi/pan/whatever he wants his his own journey to make. I don't think there is anything wrong with wanting to be seen as a gay couple by your boyfriend, but that's also a process he has to go through and come to terms with.

On the flip side, if he describes his interest to you and close friends that are accepting as "gender doesn't matter if I have strong feelings for someone"... then I wouldn't call that straight either. If he tells other people he's straight that's probably just easier to describe than getting into the weeds of the explanation with everyone that might pry a bit. Especially if he doesn't seem himself as gay or straight but rather just loving someone he loves regardless of who they describe themselves as.

Ultimately it's your call, you're valid for wanting to be recognized as a man in a mlm relationship, but you know your boyfriend better than any of us do. Do you think he's sticking to being straight, or is he fluid and the labels just aren't important to him because they aren't important to his identity as a person?

Mrtristen

24d

The idea of a man identifying as heterosexual implies that he is dating a woman. There’s no grey area there. That is fact. Surely You can see how that would be disrespectful to a FtM trans person right?

Flareing

24d

Oh, for sure, that's why I mentioned that if OP feels this important to them, they aren't in any way wrong. There is nothing wrong with them wanting to be in a mlm relationship and have it voiced as such, I definitely tried to be clear on that part because it's something that is upsetting OP.

But that's why I mentioned if the boyfriend says they are actually straight. OP mentioned they describe their (the boyfriend) orientation as loving someone regardless of gender, and on another comment, they said that their boyfriend knows they aren't straight. If that's the case, then asking him to identify as gay isn't right because he's not gay. He's closer to something like biromantic and demisexual. Asking the boyfriend to declare himself as gay isn't respecting the boyfriend either in that case, because he has already described his sexuality as something i would declare is not straight. But I don't know if that was the case for the boyfriend, so I was hoping to get some discourse from OP tbh.

Sometimes we use different labels in different groups, if he has a group he's in that isn't accepting of trans individuals or non-heterosexual identities, then he isn't wrong for saying he's straight in those circles for his safety. If it is the latter, I see it more as him saying he's straight the way someone is bisexual might. Now if the boyfriend only tells OP more details about their sexuality and doesn't tell everyone else, that's more complicated. The boyfriend could be closeted, and learning to accept themselves, or the boyfriend could just be transphobic, in which OP doesn't need to stay with the boyfriend in either case, they don't owe anyone a relationship.

stimkim

BiT of a silly guy

24d

It sounds to me like he's more afraid than anything else. He's not misgendering you or anything like that, but the straight label does lowkey do that. If it were me I'd just give him a bit of time to have a think. You know what it's like to have that pressure to be cis/het, he's got that pressure too, he's just gotta work through that.

Scary_Towel268

24d

If you don’t want to be in a heterosexual relationship with a straight man then you need to go. This cishet man may respect your pronouns but it is clear sexually and romantically you are within a similar category for him as a cis woman. Many cis men are attracted to trans men on an AGAB basis and thus don’t see the relationship as queer or gay. Their attraction to trans men is not outside of their general scope of heterosexuality and fundamentally its heteronormative. Most cis men attracted to all but the most passing trans men are probably straight and if not see dating all but the most passing trans men as akin to a form of heterosexuality

If you want a queer relationship you need to find a guy that sees liking trans men as queer. This guy can’t do that either accept that or don’t

Most cis men dating trans guys are straight they just have a heterosexuality that expands to anyone with a natal vagina regardless of gender identity. That isn’t an exception or anything they are just straight but not willing to misgender their partner

fallenbird039

Trans-parently Awesome

24d

He a chaser that probably is still seeing you as a woman. This is practically a meme it so common for Trans men and mascs to have happen.

Yourfatherisgay1987

24d

I had a fwb like that for a while. Both of us male but he refused to say he was gay, or even bi. We were never an official couple bc he didn't want to come out and be in public with me. It sucked bc I came out in hs before him and he decided to stop associating with me.

But back to your post, he sounds pan. The "gender doesn't matter of I like you personally" is a common thing among pansexuals. However, he could also just want to go as unlabeled. I wouldn't pressure him about it, give him some time. That's something I wish I had done

RogueStalker409

25d

If hes with you…and hes straight..umm…somethings up

GodOhEric

Bi-kes on Trans-it

25d

He knows he isn't straight he just won't drop the label ykwim??

RogueStalker409

25d

Then i wonder if hes afraid poor guy

Fantastic-Friend-429

Ace Pan-cake🥞

25d

Maybe he’s like straightsexaul but multiromantic

Split attraction model baby!

GodOhEric

Bi-kes on Trans-it

25d

I've never heard of those terms before but who knows maybe

Spieler2301

| Trans | She/Her

24d

Correct me if im wrong, but i wouldnt say he is straight. Besides, him changing how he identifies is obviously now the only solution. OP can also leave the relationship if it keeps taking a big toll

living_around

He/Him

24d

This sounds like the typical denial of someone who is afraid to be bi/multisexual. It's a fact that some people are fully straight, just like some people are fully gay. When someone thinks everyone is actually a little bi, they almost certainly think that because they're bi and wrongly assume that everyone is feeling what they feel. If gender truly doesn't matter to him then he's not straight by definition, because gender absolutely does matter in a straight person's attraction.

Internalized homophobia is stubborn. He may have to work through it on his own. Whether you want to be around for that is your choice, but personally I wouldn't want to date a guy who refused to acknowledge the non-straightness of our relationship.

AminoFoxFriendly

Panromantic demisexual ^^

24d

I had that period, just try to wait for his coming out, he’ll probably got his orientation soon

koolforkatskatskats

The Gay-me of Love

24d

No there are people who are straight straight, and there are people who are gay gay and people who are bi bi. When people say that no one is 100% anything they're speaking from insecurities and are committing erasure. I don't care if it's straight, bi, or gay, erasure is erasure.

He either is straight straight, which means as he's dating another man, it's probably not going to work out between you two. Or he leans more towards straight, pan, or bi. Then he will need to workout what that means. But him calling himself straight isn't going to help any party.

PolarStar89

23d

A whole lot of people are "straight straight". Unfortunately ;)

Has he told his friends that he's dating a man?

Somenamethatsnew

Lesbian Trans-it Together

24d

I would get out so fast, if I was with a girl that said she was straight in the end that would mean she didn't see me as a woman, and I would not be able to be with someone that is both transphobic and can't see me for who I am

elf533

24d

Just love him - unless you don't want to

honesttitties

24d

I’m curious of OP and the BF’s age, because if they are younger than 25….I really hope OP just gives their BF some patience and grace.

Demisexuals may often feel “as long as there is a strong emotional connection, gender no longer matters.” Or it can also be that the BF is pansexual. Labels aren’t indicative of a person’s feelings. There are many who know they are not completely straight, and are still figuring themselves. So they may have no desire to or may hesitate to put labels on themselves out of fear and wariness of mislabeling/misrepresenting their identity. But that doesn’t necessarily mean they still identify as straight. It’s not that black and white, it’s literally a spectrum!~

Personally to me, this sounds like one of those cases. And it doesn’t sound as if the BF is staying in the closet or misgendering OP. I think the BF’s lack of labels to self-identify should not invalidate the fact that BF knows how they feel about OP.

JX_Snyder

Pangender Fusion

24d

I saw in OPs first post asking for advice saying they met at school around two months before making that post, also saying that the boyfriend has identified as straight for 18 years. So they’re like in their late-teens—early-twenties

Fantastic-Friend-429

Ace Pan-cake🥞

25d

He seems a bit trans phobic and homophobic of himself

baltinerdist

Bi-bi-bi

24d

Assuming you haven’t, would he still date you if you had bottom surgery? Has he ever or would he ever date someone with a penis?

If the answer to both of those is no, his sexuality is likely more rooted in his preference for downstairs parts he wants to sexually interact with. Which might not mean much (we all have that preference) but would cause me to doubt whether or not he truly sees you as a man.

StrangeMulberry4288

23d

You got to be what you want to be, he can call himself a banana if he wants. Why do you care?

RUaVulcanorVulcant13

24d

If you don't feel misgendered by him he can identify however he wants.

Boh_777

24d

Let’s not discount his feelings here he may be going through a lot trying to accept himself and you and the world around him. Cut him some slack no offence but dating trans people is a new thing for the world and it’s hard for some to comprehend and digest only an idiot would take offence to that.

willothewoods

Transgender Pan-demonium

24d

"It's hard for people to *comprehend and digest* trans people existing re their own sexuality" Nah. He's a grown man, he can get over it and deal with himself. It's not even taking offence at this point for me to have an issue with that. People can and should do better, and while I'm happy to give a little grace, some things are simply not in my best interest or safety to have grace for.

Moderator removed comment

25d

GodOhEric

Bi-kes on Trans-it

25d

I suppose so but it doesn't take away from the dysphoria and insecurity it gives me. It's just an iffy situation to me I dont know

primordialscream

25d

If I'm honest, I see this exact scenario very often on r/ftm, and it tends to turn out the same way. Someone posts about their partner still identifying as lesbian/straight and a few days/weeks/months later they update because their partner did something that finally showed them without a doubt that they didn't see them as a man.

To be blunt, if you are early in transition or have not done anything medical yet, he likely does not see you as a man. It sucks, but somebody who won't call your relationship gay, won't stop calling themselves straight, etc is telling you pretty clearly what they think of you. You absolutely deserve someone who treats you better.

GodOhEric

Bi-kes on Trans-it

25d

I'm really hoping that's not the case because outside of this hes a really good boyfriend to me and has never once implied anything like that. It could just be internalised homophobia like other comments have suggested but I don't know :(

primordialscream

25d

It could be, but you need to talk to him and he needs to be completely honest with you. Even if he's a good boyfriend otherwise, do you really want to be with someone who doesn't respect your basic identity?

GodOhEric

Bi-kes on Trans-it

25d

Yeah I'll be sure to talk to him when I can about this all because it's affecting me a lot, I do feel he respects me and sees me as a man it's just... complicated??? I don't know

willothewoods

Transgender Pan-demonium

24d

I wanna boost this, bc I said something similar in my comment, and as a trans person myself who is dating a trans man, this is the first thought to come to my mind. That he doesn't see op as a man at all. And is just hiding behind op's trans body as an excuse to experiment, or continue refusing to acknowledge his own sexuality.

"somebody who won't call your relationship gay, won't stop calling themselves straight, etc is telling you pretty clearly what they think of you." RIGHT ON THE NOSE.

ChloroformSmoothie

Lesbian Trans-it Together

24d

I didn't realize it made you dysphoric/insecure; from your post I assumed you were at peace with it and your friends were just being rude about it. If it makes you insecure, talk to him about it.

superhotpork

25d

No, that would mean they do not see them as their correct gender. Or they aren’t straight…

ChloroformSmoothie

-1

Lesbian Trans-it Together

24d

So I'm not lesbian then?

Neverspecial0

-1

24d

Just roll with it; your friends are being pedantic.

Icy_Appointment_7296

24d

Don't you dare gaslight this man, his friends are right. If your partner's behavior is making you dysphoric, that's something you bring up and get addressed, not just "roll with".

Neverspecial0

24d

100% sees me as a man

Don't want to force him to find a label

Advising someone that it's fine is not at all gaslighting. Do you know what gaslighting is?

Icy_Appointment_7296

23d

If you read through the rest of the conversation on here you'd see it's a little more nuanced than that - and if you've been around long enough you know how things like this can end. Eric described it as a big issue and that there's dysphoria attached to it - when that's going on, that's not something to just "roll with" those are things you address with your partner or just - head out over if they don't respond.

You're focusing on bits of this post without seeing the big picture and being disingenuous. It's better to find out the reason why now. You're advising someone that things are fine when it clearly isn't. You called his friends pedantic for - supporting him?

Gaslighting or not can we agree that that sucks?

CranberryBauce

-1

24d

Genuine question, what's wrong with him identifying as straight? If that's how he sees himself, isn't that okay?

Scary_Towel268

24d

I mean sure but straight cis men seeing relationships with trans men as heterosexual does have implications for the trans men in that relationship(ie they may not be able to get support in gay male spaces because they are in a straight relationship and thus are alienated from typical support spaces)

CranberryBauce

24d

I fully understand that, but doesn't this also go both ways? Wouldn't it be invalidating to push someone to identify with a label that doesn't resonate with them? I'm wondering if there's a middle ground where the needs of everyone involved can be satisfied.

Scary_Towel268

24d

I mean if you’re a heterosexual cisgender man and actively remaining or pursuing relationships with trans men then getting upset that your heterosexual identity isn’t being validated is just plain odd. I think most cis men see trans men as an extension to their overall attraction to cis women which is fine but I don’t see why anyone has to validate that because if you’re actively pursuing trans men as a cishet guy then you need to square that circle not expect a trans male partner to validate your heterosexuality

If cishet men don’t want their heterosexuality questioned they can just date women and leave trans men alone. That or be honest about how they are actually integrating trans men into their sexuality. If they see sexual and romantic relationships to trans men as heterosexual and see themselves as straight then that’s fine but has its own implications

Ultimately I just wish cis people would make up their minds about how they see us as sexually so we could all be on the same page

CranberryBauce

-1

24d

I understand your point. However I question how much of this applies to the post? We don't know if he pursued OP, we don't know how OP identified when they first got together. If OP wants to stay in this relationship that's absolutely a valid choice, and maybe OP and his partner can discuss the specifics of their relationship.

Scary_Towel268

24d

In OP’s history he mentions this guy knew that OP was a trans man when he met him and pursued him for hooking up. This is a situation where a cishet man willingly pursued and hooked up with a trans man. In that scenario, he chose to do that because he views attraction to OP and trans men like him as part of a heterosexual thing. That’s his deal and not OP’s problem

As I said, as a trans man, I have never met a cis man who was attracted to trans men in gay way so I see all of them as straight-ish by default. That said I don’t think it is any trans man’s job to coddle a cishet man actively pursuing him because he sees all AFAB bodies as available to him. Sorry but I don’t think cishet men need to be supported by their partners for doing what is normative cishet male shit, excuse my French

CranberryBauce

24d

I certainly don't think they need to be coddled, but I do see the value in respecting everyone's self-perception and the way they identify. There's also something to be said for how we as a society view sex. I don't want to speculate on OP and his partner's sex life, and it's genuinely none of anyone's business, but I wonder if their sex resembles heterosexual sex and if that affects the boyfriend's self identification? Maybe he's panromantic but leans more heterosexual in a specifically physical way? I don't know. But I do wonder if there's a genuine middle ground so that everyone involved is satisfied.

Scary_Towel268

24d

I mean he’s just straight as are most cis men who fuck trans men.

And the middle ground is for us as trans men who are pre-op or not passing enough to understand that we don’t exist within cis male sexuality in a gay way. We either embrace that or we don’t but this is a straight cis man and straight cis male views on trans male bodies and their perceptions on our sexual capabilities is the deciding factor in the relationship. Cis men have the power in the relationship and their attraction and understanding of sexuality will decide whether the relationship is queer or straight. In this case, OP is a man in a heterosexual heteronormative relationship with a cishet man. He’s essentially a straight woman sans any of the privileges

Ultimately OP has to decide if he’s okay being a heteronormative relationship with a cishet man and all that implies as a trans man. Will he be willing to not pursue certain transition steps to maintain his partner’s attraction? Has he accepted that he will never experience being lusted after as a male or have a mlm relationship?

Ultimately OP will have to decide how much dysphoria he is willing to put up with to make this work because as trans man with a cis man he isn’t in a queer relationship and his partner while respectful of his gender cannot and should not be expected to be attracted to him a one male is to another

Also let’s be real if we were all about accepting self perception then these cishet men wouldn’t be pursuing trans men to begin with. They pursue trans men because they don’t give a shit about that trans man’s perception of himself as a man. They know he has a pussy and/or tits they desire and that’s all that matters to these cishet men and society as a whole

OP’s partner is a straight cisgender male and their relationship is no different than any other heteronormative relationship between a cishet man and someone that cis man views as female

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