Moderator removed post
This. If one is versed in modes and impacts of actual societal collapse, dwelling on politics and the supposed differences between parties is a fool's errand. They are all as bad as each other, just in slightly different ways. No politician ever has questioned economic growth and whether it's even possible, let alone desirable.
Many years ago I was heavily invested in left-wing politics, but in recent years I realised many in that crowd just exist to dwell on imaginary conservative boogeymen. Here in Canada, it's the Liberals (I know, not really left-wing) who are systematically removing civil rights and spiralling fast into totalitarianism. Instead of approaching this objectively and calling out the attacks on speech, movement and fundamental freedoms, the left side of the spectrum is pointing to their created boogeyman who doesn't hold power anyway. It's become quite clear to me that the attacks on speech and online discourse are designed in a way that will be used against anyone aware and warning about imminent and ongoing collapse going forward.
As for the US, I don't have a dog in that fight, but I find the compulsive and pathological trump derangement syndrome to be repulsive, classist and elitist. I'm convinced the professional managerial class, who are largely useless in a collapse scenario, are just lashing out at the people who possess valuable, resilient skills and are (rightly) pissed off at being abandoned by their government. Doesn't mean I like the orange man, but at least he didn't start any new wars and can form a semi-coherent sentence, but the reactions to him are absurd and hyperbolic.
That's a very long way of saying you're doing it right, building resilience and meeting people where they are is key. You don't have to agree with people on everything to build resilient communities with them.
you need to make friends with communists and anarchists
I am an anarchist. Communists are just as bought into expansionist narratives as capitalists, and generally not collapse aware, in my experience.
I'll probably get downvoted for this, too. Let's see how stuck in left-bubble politics and reactionary defense of such the supposedly collapse aware people are. 🍿
No politician ever has questioned economic growth and whether it's even possible, let alone desirable.
I think that is sort of what led me to my current stance. "Policy" on either side is not going to meaningfully impact our predicament. No one is thinking radical enough/ no one is going to willingly give up modernity. And yes everyone is distracted by things that are far less important, surely by design.
I definitely think trump presents a far worse potential outcome in the short term, and would not recommend anyone vote for him. We're fucked long term either way, and adding to an already polarized environment is not going to help. So I will quietly vote.
I have been fighting against it too long and I'm finally realizing it's not worth it. It's been fucking up my ability to meet people where they're at, like you said. That's going to be more important than ever.
"It's been fucking up my ability to meet people where they're at"
This is the part that forced me to change my views. I realised through experience that ALL of the division is created to keep the wheels on the death machine and keep us distracted and feeding it. I was indoctrinated enough to think conservatives wanted me dead for being gay, and other ludicrous things that just weren't true. I learned that most people are actually just decent and want to be left alone without feeling like they're trapped in said death machine.
I'm not in the US, and I'm an immigrant to Canada from Europe, so I must ask what is the "potentially far worse outcome" from Trump? Obviously I understand that as a US citizen you/people in general would lean to domestic issues, but I largely look at the state of the world and how that fits into collapse scenarios. I'm not saying you're wrong at all, I'm genuinely curious. I know he's unpredictable, and a boorish conman, but his personal views on social issues aren't nearly as bad as people make out - he's essentially a NYC liberal in that regard. My concern lays with wider existential threats. Right now we are facing down a nuclear confrontation, it's FAR worse than we're being told, and that's all on the empty shell Biden and the neocons pushing him, not to mention the other wars ongoing or brewing. There's an argument to be made that these events are inevitable in global collapse, that resource wars in the form of hybrid or nuclear world war were already baked in, and the rest is just timing, but I'd be interested to hear your thoughts.
From an outsider looking in perspective, my entire life I've watched the US government wage war globally and coup whichever country they desire to get resources (mainly oil). Now we're in the endgame, there's nowhere left to colonize and everything is running out. Nobody of any political stripe will ever acknowledge that, and like you said, the differences between them are a hair's width. Liberals/Democrats pretend to care about "climate", like we can just reduce converging global crises into a singular environmental issue with abundant techno-fixes and "human ingenuity" (eyeroll) while maintaining the god of growth. A false promise of progress and faith in "technology" by sustaining the unsustainable is the narrative adopted by seemingly everyone, all the time.
I haven't voted for many years. I always said I'd vote again for the first politician who says "economic growth is neither possible or desirable". I feel like we'll all be eating radioactive cats by the time that happens.
It would be nice if the cowards who downvoted this could post some kind of rebuttal or analysis of where I'm wrong, but I fully expect that won't happen. As I've discovered is common in collapse aware circles, an attachment to left-liberal politics clouds judgement and presents a reactionary aversion to grappling with the facts.
To those still clinging to such narratives, you're not better than anybody else, your "side" isn't righteous or virtuous, in fact it's where I see the most obvious signs of fascism emerging. The only real difference between the false dichotomy you've bought into are that liberals are much better at hiding their attempts at totalitarianism, whereas conservatives are overt about it. Being brainwashed by the media apparatus designed to keep the machine rolling will do that .
Sounds like you haven't paid much attention to what Trump has been up to from 2020-now. Has little to do with politics anymore, the dude has nothing to lose because he is going to prison, that is, unless he gets into office.
What do you think a narcissists (by definition) plans to do in a position of power when he has nothing to lose, everything to gain, and a flurry of sycophants waiting for his instructions? Read the court documents, look at the evidence, listen to the judges, the phone calls, the text messages, the emails, the recordings. Look at how they are attempting to counter argue what he has done. They have no ground to stand on, he is toast, but he is likely going to win.
This is not derangement syndrome anymore. I despise both parties, but I have eyes. Don't listen to the news, look at the sources. This is going to get bad, regardless of who wins. This is so far beyond just politics.
Quite the assumption. You seem to have been blinded by the fact that forces within permanent government despise any kind of populism and especially trump. There's so many of these cases now, so many attempts to bring him down. Obviously I don't doubt he's a conman and real estate guy, I'm sure he's been involved in many crimes in that regard.
That said, the stuff they're using against him now is obvious lawfare and an attempt to subvert the will of the people and prevent him being elected. It's incredibly transparent. Trump is a disaster for the permanent war and security state, at least from their view (not mine).
You're vastly underestimating the forces at work here and the lengths they will go to in keeping the neocon plan going. You think they can't drum up multiple court cases? Look at Assange. Just look at how close to nuclear war we are after only 3 years of biden. I have no doubt whatsoever they'll grassy knoll Trump if they think they need to.
Looks like the PMCs found my post and don't like the truth. They're the people to watch out for in collapse scenarios. As is very apparent from Canada, they're the most likely to become little authoritarians when faced with true calamity they don't have the skills to deal with.
I'm a disabled (on SSI), white, assigned male at birth, queer but in a hetero-passing relationship. I'm terrified Trump will not only win but that Republicans will take the senate and keep the house and start stripping benefits from disabled people. They would also completely reverse course on climate, not that I think Biden has done nearly enough. It keeps me up at night. Watched the SOTU live. I don't think Biden did terribly given who he is and what he has to work with. Gonna be another utterly terrifying election year.
i'm afraid even if Biden wins shit is going to pop off. these maga dudes go nuts when they lose. jan 6th happened after their last election lose. johnson is still speaker of the house and SCOTUS is compromised.
Valid fear. Tens of millions of them are convinced they can only lose if the other side cheats, and that violence is the appropriate answer.
I think it's a bit of a stretch to assume tens of millions. Maybe a million, if that. It's a small subset of people that are actually that rabid. They're just extremely visible bc they never shut up.
4 in 10 Republicans think political violence may be necessary Edit: 2/3 say Bidens's win was illegitimate. https://www.npr.org/2021/02/11/966498544/a-scary-survey-finding-4-in-10-republicans-say-political-violence-may-be-necessa
It’s a serious concern. I’m expecting all kinds of congressional shenanigans if Biden wins, and probably some violence in the capital next January.
If Trump wins? I’ve seen the Trump 2025 directives. They’re out there: conservatives are not trying to hide it. I fear for the future of this country, and the world.
I’d also expect the red states to implement as much of the Trump 2025 agenda as they can locally if Biden wins, along with a rise in domestic terrorism. Those states will band together to sue the bike administration on any sweeping changes they want to make for change, healthcare, etc.
I hope I’m wrong, but we’re probably looking at a furthering of the conservative agenda, even if Biden wins. It will just happen more slowly.
I agree with you. The conservative agenda has already been slowly implemented in various parts of the country. I think if Biden wins, red states will be ready to do everything they can to become even redder.
I don't think the Biden administration wants any sweeping changes I don't think they want any departure from the status quo whatsoever.
Did you not listen and comprehend Biden's SOTU last night and his speech in Pennsylvania just today. Just look what Biden has done in the past 3 years to put people to work and bring manufacturing back to America I am not a cheer leader for Biden but the facts are the facts. 45 just wants to be an Autocrat Dictator like his buddies' Putin and Orban and not just for a day.
Wake up for Gods sake.
I’m clinging to the logic that TFG is not gaining voters—he’s just not. That dark mass of cultists just can’t be growing. Yes, they are believers, but their numbers are shrinking every day. Also, the Dems are vastly better organized. How many Republican women will vote for something else strictly on the Dobbs ruling? How many rich IVF users saw what happened in AL and are pissed?
If the unthinkable happens, we hunker down and concentrate on holding on to our community. That prep happens every day. I keep in mind learning the sorts of skills my Great Depression elders knew were useful. Chaos comes and goes but the day to day is about helping where it becomes obvious.
I’m clinging to the logic that TFG is not gaining voters
You're forgetting something incredibly important that has personally affected every person in this country since Biden took office: rising costs.
Inflation has absolutely skyrocketed in the last four years. You and I may know that Biden had virtually nothing to do with that, but tons of voters, including voters who didn't vote previously, have experienced their rent increasing 30+%, the cost of their groceries doubling, and their wages staying the same, and the president is the only concrete direction they know to direct that anger.
People who were privileged enough to have no dog in the fight before are experiencing a difference that is both personal and significant enough to now care and take action.
It's a terrifying thought, but right or not, I think a LOT of people are going to be voting with their wallets this year, and those wallets are going to vote for Trump.
On stripping benefits from disabled people… Honestly, anyone who isn’t a straight white conservative male is going to have a hard time if Trump wins.
I agree. I just mentioned my particular situation cos OP asked.
Felt that.
Biden’s policies on global warming have Been full speed ahead with it. Reversal would be great but won’t come from Trump!
Biden hasn't done nearly enough on climate but it's not comparable to what Trump would do. It's the difference between letting a little pressure off the gas pedal and flooring it.
exactly
Biden's IRL puts the largest amount of money toward addressing Climate Change in our history and that or the world. Yes a drop in the bucket but it's a big start. 45 and the Right? They wound even acknowledge human amplified climate change even exists and would kill the IRA day one.
Just read what's in the Inflation Reduction Act. The money is being spent now. That's a fact.
Biden has done way more on climate than anyone gives him credit for. Biden has bad pr
I think Biden has a good chance of being re-elected but what worries me is what lengths Trump and the Republicans might go to try and do a power grab!
I really have no idea.
Both candidates and campaigns are so horribly weak and flawed, I think anything could happen. Trump clearly doesn't have the energy he had in 2016 and his legal issues seem to be catching up with him. Biden, on the other hand, may have cost himself the election crossing a red line for a lot of Democratic voters with Gaza.
Either of these assholes could lose.
What red line did he cross?
Arming and publicly supporting genocide.
Genocide Joe vs Dementia Don...
Yikes. Sorry gaza Dems but that's a silly redline. You think America is going to disavow Israel in an instant after they are attacked like that? Did you not see how we kept keep on keeping on after khashoggi with the Saudis? This is Israel we're talking about. Our power arm in the middle east. I'm surprised Joe has spoken out against Israel as much as he had tbh. Gaza Dems do realize the other party in America would love to level Palestine right?
Reagan ended an Israeli attack on Palestine with a phone call, forgive me for thinking it's bad that Joe is further right than fucking Reagan
Did Israel just have 1500 people murdered and some slaughtered? Anyone who thinks this could be easily solved is not very smart.
And again gaza Dems... you do know what the Republicans think of Gaza right?
don't have to be that smart to realize that murdering 13k children won't bring them back
Agreed but things are not that simple. None of the Gaza Dems ever seem to talk about what Republicans would do for Palestinians if in power. Do you think Trump's state of the union would talk about those 13,000 children like Biden did last night? Do you think we'd be trying to send them aid? Not that lip service means much but some Republicans are on record wanting Palestine gone.
he sends them aid while bypassing Congress to send Israel weapons. he is doing worse than nothing, he is lying to our fucking faces. threatening to not vote for him for it is the only fucking language he speaks.
We've given Israel weapons forever. They are our geo power arm in the middle east. We're not going to let that go quickly.
"He gives them aid".. yes good. Meanwhile you do know most (all?) Republicans would give Israel all they needed to wipe any Muslims they want off the map right? That's so much worse.
It's a shitty situation. Removing the US from it, both Hamas and the idf are terrible. Hamas should be wiped out. Israel should stop stealing land. There's a lot of support for both in their respective countries.
This is starting to change. Their are no simple solutions. Way too many variables we do not know anything about and happening behind the scene's. War is horrible no matter what side you are on.
Hitler killed over six million Jews in WW2. That would sure make me paranoid and over reactionary after their slaughter on October 7th of last year by HAMAS. HAMAS has vowed to wipe out all Israeli Jews now using the innocent Palestinians as a shield.
Let's focus on the blame pointing toward HMAS who started this slaughter of innocents while they hide in their hundreds of miles of rat tunnels under the Palestine citizens.
Dang I was down voted before my page could refresh.
You get an upvote from me. Now I will get downvoted but ask me is I care.
I was banned from world news for saying both Hamas and the IDF are horrible. 🙃
War is shit. Six million Jew's were slaughtered by Hitler in WW2. I am not a Jew but if I were an Israeli Jew I would be so paranoid before and after 10/7/2023 I can see how an overaction would seem rational. No question it as gone way, way too far due to their leader. However, HAMAS started it. They knew the IDF reaction would elicit and how the world would react to that. All the while HAMAS hides in their hundreds of mikes of rat tunnels running under the Palestinian civilians, hospitals and such.
Everyone needs to keep in mind HAMAS wants to wipe out Israel full stop. Look at our reaction after 9/11.
Remember also.
"There have been between 280,771-315,190 Iraqi civilians killed by direct violence since the U.S. invasion."
The above is not directed at you.
Yikes. Sorry gaza Dems but that's a silly redline.
If genocide isn't a red line, then what is?
You think America is going to disavow Israel in an instant after they are attacked like that?
What is the point of having military and economic leverage in the Middle East if we refuse to use it?
This is Israel we're talking about. Our power arm in the middle east.
It's not a "power arm" if we refuse to actually use our influence for anything. At that point it's just a complete giveaway. It's stupid. It's spending all the money and resources on diplomacy and then refusing to actually use it for anything good. Weak and short-sighted.
I'm surprised Joe has spoken out against Israel as much as he had tbh.
You shouldn't be. Obama was far more critical of Israel, so is Harris, and so are many members of Biden's administration -- some of whom have publicly resigned over his handling of it. Biden's support for Israel seems personal and ideological.
Gaza Dems do realize the other party in America would love to level Palestine right?
Are you suggesting that they're going to vote for Trump? I doubt that. I think most of us will just stay home in November.
By this definition was the Iraq war a genocide on our part?
We do use our influence? Israel had growing relations with Egypt and Saudi Arabia. That why Iran is helping Hamas. They don't want that.
I don't think it's personal. He's called Israel out for this. If he was all about Israel he wouldn't have done that.
I don't think they'll vote for Trump. But not voting Biden in a close election like this is a vote for Trump. You're actively helping the party that would to wipe out palestine with zeal.
By this definition was the Iraq war a genocide on our part?
I didn't define genocide or mention Iraq. You're flopping all over the place here.
We do use our influence? Israel had growing relations with Egypt and Saudi Arabia. That why Iran is helping Hamas. They don't want that.
Great. When we start using that influence to stop a genocide instead of arming it, let me know.
I don't think it's personal. He's called Israel out for this. If he was all about Israel he wouldn't have done that.
I don't care.
I don't think they'll vote for Trump. But not voting Biden in a close election like this is a vote for Trump. You're actively helping the party that would to wipe out palestine with zeal.
"Is" carries more weight than "would" in my book. If the Republicans want to take a turn at defending this mess, I'll be just as happy to note vote for them, too.
It's not flopping. I mean to say we support a lot of terrible things. The economy is built on terrible things. Every person in America is supporting genocide and worse every day indirectly. America is not going to about face 60 years of Israel support. That's the state of things and at some point you have to work within that frame work.
Using that influence for good... this is America we're talking about. We're one of the 'better' super powers and we're still terrible. See Khashoggi. We literally have audio of him being cut to pieces but still carry on with the Saudis.
You don't care? Ok.
Republicans won't just defend this mess. They cheer for what Israel is doing. Good job helping them out. That'll help children in Palestine.
It's not flopping. I mean to say we support a lot of terrible things. The economy is built on terrible things. Every person in America is supporting genocide and worse every day indirectly.
Sure. I get that. I'm just saying direct support for explicit genocide is where I'm drawing a line. If you have a different line, good for you. That's why we each get our own vote.
America is not going to about face 60 years of Israel support.
I never set the bar there.
That's the state of things and at some point you have to work within that frame work.
I don't, actually. Biden is the one running for election, not me. Electoral politics is the framework he has to work in. I'm just a statistic. And guess what? If you publicly defend war crimes and genocide as a Democrat, you will bleed votes.
Republicans won't just defend this mess. They cheer for what Israel is doing. Good job helping them out. That'll help children in Palestine.
The Palestinian children don't give a fuck about who is cheering for anything. They care about the bombs dropping on their heads. I could give a fuck about the optics. I'm not voting for anyone who is not willing to use our military aid to force some restraint and accountability. Not an about-face, not abandoning Israel, or any of the other strawmen you've put in my mouth -- simply using our massive influence to end the bombing. That would be enough.
> The Palestinian children don't give a fuck about who is cheering for anything. They care about the bombs dropping on their heads. I could give a fuck about the optics. I'm not voting for anyone who is not willing to use our military aid to force some restraint and accountability. Not an about-face, not abandoning Israel, or any of the other strawmen you've put in my mouth -- simply using our massive influence to end the bombing. That would be enough.
Biden has spoken pretty directly about the innocent people there and sent aid and admonished Israel. "The kids don't care about the cheering" By cheering I meant the Republicans will actively work to increase the bombing and remove the aid while never mentioning their existence again. Good job staying home and not voting.
Been
You deserve whatever happens to you
Same to you.
Then you be responsible for allowing American to turn into an Autocracy if 45 becomes 47. Did you know 45 is hosting and meeting with Victor Orban the Autocrat of Hungary right now in his golden Mara Loco in Florida? The Orban that is buddy buddy with Putin. Yes the Putin that is in Ukraine to wipe out the imaginary Nazi's. Well the Nazi's are real here in America flying their flag along with the MAGA's.
Is that the America you want? Well I don't so vote blue or lose all your freedoms my father and his father fought for in WW1 & WW2.
The problem is that for some of us, an actual genocide matters more than a hypothetical dictatorship.
S then out war in Iraq after 9/11 was not geocide as well?
"There have been between 280,771-315,190 Iraqi civilians killed by direct violence since the U.S. invasion."
When did I bring up, much less defend, the Iraq War?
Their you go being cute again. Let me be more clear for you. Why are you so concerned about ~30,000 dead in Gaza not by American troops, but say nothing about the 280,771-315,190 we killed or caused to be killed in Iraq. It's called and analogy.
funding and supporting a genocide thats killed over 30k innocent people including tons of kids is "a silly redline?"
i hope you realize how sociopathic that makes you sound.
The silly part is that by not voting for Biden and helping elect Trump by not voting at all, if he does win you're actively making Palestinian lives so much worse and much more in danger. Biden has publicly admonished Israel & fought for aid to Palestinians.
You do know what the Republicans think of Palestine right? It's not an unknown, let's see what the other team might do for us situation. If republicans get elected there will be no aid, weapons to Israel will increase.
youre putting words in my mouth. where did i say that im not voting for biden? i am quite sure i will drag my ass to the ballot and vote for that motherfucker in november simply due to how much worse trump is.
but do not mistake that for support of genocide joe in any way. our two choices are both horrendous--one just quite a bit more so than the other.
Ah sorry most Gaza Dems are advocating for not voting. Other than Israel I think Biden has been pretty great. And he's obviously very coherent after watching last night's state of the union.
The left has proven itself just as open to misinformation as the right... Crazy times.
What misinformation?
Thinking that Biden is somehow supporting a genocide, for one. Very easy to spot yet many have fallen. No critical thinking on the other extreme either.
Ooh I thought you meant my comment.
Yeah. It's a shitty situation. Biden is in a no win position. The world is not black and white.
Kashoggi was cut to pieces with a bone saw. We have a recording. But no large contingent of politicians is going to advocate for cutting ties with Saudi Arabia and causing cascading issues. It sucks but here we are.
"Publicly" Show me the text.
The "support" I care about is the weapons, money, and repeated obstruction of international law. How about you?
Don't be cute or intentionally dumb. I asked for the quote of anyone in the Administration saying " I support geocide" in Palestine. It is not as simple as you make it out to be. No I do not support killings of over 30,000 humans regardless of their ethnicity. I do not support Hitler killing over 6,000,000 Jews in WW2. HAMAS intentionally started this on 10/7/2023. Now they hide in their hundreds of miles of rat tunnels under the vary humans that are being slaughtered by the IDF trying to them, HAMAS out so that HAMAS does not wipe them out as they have consistently professed to do.
Don't be cute or intentionally dumb.
I'll talk to you however I want to and you can fuck off if you don't like it. I owe you nothing. Clear enough?
I asked for the quote of anyone in the Administration saying " I support geocide" in Palestine.
I don't care what you asked for. I told you what I meant by "support" and I don't plan on my repeating myself. If you don't like it, again: feel free to fuck off. Reddit has a block feature. Feel free to use it any time.
No I do not support killings of over 30,000 humans regardless of their ethnicity. I do not support Hitler killing over 6,000,000 Jews in WW2. HAMAS intentionally started this on 10/7/2023. Now they hide in their hundreds of miles of rat tunnels under the vary humans that are being slaughtered by the IDF trying to them, HAMAS out so that HAMAS does not wipe them out as they have consistently professed to do.
Good.
You just don't give a fuck for fuck's sake.
Do you give a fuck about this factoid?
"There have been between 280,771-315,190 Iraqi civilians killed by direct violence since the U.S. invasion."
Early 30s female in Oregon, low income but in college right now. I think regardless things will get bad. Trump wins, it's GG. Biden wins, we may have something much worse than Jan 6, better planned, learned from mistakes, angrier than before.
I am working towards getting financially stable in hopes to invest in some precautions. Going to get gun training here soon, I've gone shooting before but never any formal training. I want to be set up to help my family and friends that may need it in the future. Large portion of them are neurodivergent/have a disability/low income. Trying to rip through school to get a stable income, save as much as I can, build a farm, all that kinda stuff.
Our best bet it to create communities if we can, regardless of whos in office, things are likely going to get bad, states will turn, house/senate is unpredictable, cop cities being built. I'd rather be seen as a bit paranoid but prepared than be completely blindsided.
Try and get stability and prepare, or make allies with people that can.
As someone that's under the LGBT umbrella, buying a gun.
Buy more than one
If Biden lost to a different democratic then that would probably be good. If he lost to Trump, I'm OUT. I'm fleeing to Canada to live with my cousins there. I'm a nonbinary trans afab person and I don't know what will happen to my rights if Trump wins again, and I'm not sticking around to risk it. I don't like Biden, but it would be more dangerous for me and other trans people and minorities if Trump won.
No, and keep fighting.
Keep fighting the genocide.
Keep fighting for abortion access
Keep fighting against xenophobic border policy
You know, all the shit we’re fighting Biden on right now
The interesting thing about fighting if Biden loses is that liberals will join us in the fight. Right now, liberals are justifying the genocide in Gaza, justifying the ethnic cleansing on America’s border, justifying the lack of access to abortion, on and on.
When Trump is perceived to be behind those things, they will briefly pretend to care about them, which may open a window for progress.
But probably not.
So we’ll keep fighting
Will liberals join in the fight over all those things if Biden loses? I'm not sure.
One thing is for sure if Biden loses it's in some part because after he got in office the Dems decided to let a virus rip that disproportionately kills and maims the poor people, non-white people, disabled people, and other disadvantaged groups that tend to vote Dem.
You’re right about one of the many reasons he might lose.
A lot of the libs around me were posting multiple times a day about kids in cages, right up until it turned out Biden had more kids in cages than Trump and they pivoted to “well what are we supposed to do with them?!”
I imagine they will go back to protesting it if Trump says something publicly about it, though if he doesn’t you’re right they may just let it lie.
Time will tell, and I use “will” there because Biden is actively throwing this election away so we’re almost certainly getting Trump
If Trump rounds up all the leaders of the Dems and shoots them it would be their karma for:
1) dropping precautions/NPIs and letting COVID rip and killing 100,000s and disabling millions with this virological weapon unnecessarily since Biden took office
2) supporting the horrific monsters known as the Zionists (ethno-fascists) who carpet bomb the homes of millions to rubble and then bomb and machine guns the survivors when they're scrabbling for food and water. Any one who supports the genocidal evil that is Zionism is evil and deserves awful things.
Fuck Biden, and fuck the Dems, never forget, never forgive, they should lose forever and vanish from the face of the fucking earth for this despicable shit:
I really think a lot of Dems underestimate how many disabled people there are and how many are done with them as a result of this. Especially since there's more disabled people now than there were before.
Like, how many people that trusted Biden's covid policy and got long covid as a result are gonna vote for him again? Probably not many.
I also think that if a lot of Dems really get rounded up and shot by Trump in 2025 it's 100% the Karma of Dems gung-ho supporting the Zionist ethno-fascists committing what is so far one of the biggest and fastest genocides in nearly 50 years outside of Africa (everything is more messed up on a different scale there sadly) and probably the fastest genocide in 40 years or so. That and letting COVID kill and disable millions. Now I don't like it, and it won't make anybody's life better, but there it is. If you're going to support absolute monsters like the Zionists who carpet bomb cities into rubble and then machine gun the survivors when they're looking for food, then maybe you sow what you reap when you lose power to domestic fascists and get mass murdered? I dunno. But probably Trump will only kill poor non-whites, not Dem elites. we'll see.
I generally do agree with you that it's their fault, they don't seem to care that a horrific and highly visible genocide is (very reasonably) a hard line for many folks. I can easily think of a few dozen stomach churning images I've seen in the last few weeks that I don't think I will ever be able to unsee (plus the ones I didn't look at but have heard about from others), and the majority don't even pretend to have a problem with it.
They either don't know or don't care that the blatant indifference to human life (+ all the obvious lying) has been profoundly radicalizing for a number of people, and I suspect a majority of those people are folks who are already left of center.
Not to mention that if Jews in Palestine can kill everyone else there with the world’s support, it gives hope to MAGA Christian white nationalists they can do the same to minorities here…
Biden will win for the same reason he won last time: the Trump-haters vastly outnumber the Trump fuckers, and they learned their lesson about showing up to vote in 2016 and 2020.
As Trump's repulsive orange flesh begins to appear more and more in the media closer to the election, the haters will recall their visceral disgust towards his presidency and haul ass to vote against him.
It's how he lost his reelection. The haters showed up.
I didn't vote in 2016 (was on another continent and the media had me convinced the "lesser of two evils" was a shoo-in) but I will never not vote again. I'm not the only one.
Their approval/disapproval ratings are virtually the same right now, according to fivethirtyeight Trump is actually better off than he was. Do not underestimate him, nor his cronies working the polls. No republican has won the popular vote in over 20 years.
A lot of election workers are scared, they are getting a lot of death threats, and guess which side is getting the brunt of it? Also, many states removed mail in ballots, making it much harder for working class and disabled people to vote.
Do not write him off. I am hoping for the best, but it's not looking good. Even if Biden wins we still have many challenges ahead statewise.
I don't know if approval ratings are a good judge of who people are going to vote for. I've disapproved of every president I've voted for or against.
Agreed, same, any polling is inherently flawed, and our government doesn’t base winners off popular vote anyways. I’m just trying to say, be vigilant, don’t assume we’re likely to be safe. A lot can happen between now and Election Day and regardless of who wins we will still not be “safe” depending on what state a person lives in, how house/senate votes go etc.
I also might just have “trauma” from 2016. Nearly everyone I knew was so sure that Hillary would win. I didn’t want to ruin it for them, but now…
You're right - I actually should say Trump is absolutely winning unless we all vote.
By default Trump wins.
We need record numbers again and can't get lazy and presume the winner like in 2016.
I really really hate being an “alarmist” but it’s certainly not outside the realm of possibilities. Biden barely won in 2020, and that was primarily due to trumps horrible Covid response. I’ll never forget 2016, almost everyone I knew was so sure she’d win.
See I kindly disagree here, and I haven't really seen anyone make this connection but it's my theory on Trump - all politicians cater to their base, right? Sure.
But Trump was the first US President who also openly, obnoxiously, maliciously, and relentlessly mocked and insulted the other side.
He was too fucking stupid to be diplomatic enough to serve his base without flagrantly trash talking everyone else.
It didn't occur to him to bring all of the American people together and find some unity or common ground.
He made everyone who didn't vote for him out to be a moron (hah!) and created his own enemies - basically challenging the masses to vote against him. It worked!
I will never not vote for Trump's opponent again. I would proudly choose a Taco Bell spork to be our next President over Donald Fucking Trump lol. I really have faith that the majority feels the same, but we will see.
A republican hasn't won the popular vote in over 20 years, that's the issue. Trump IS wildly unpopular as a whole, but that doesn't matter because of the electoral college, when vital states have bad actors working tirelessly not to fuck up like they did last time. They removed mail in voting, so working class & disabled people will have a harder time voting in those states, there's a lot of factors at play. Election workers are fleeing due to constant death threats. They are doing everything in their power to suppress the vote. Just saying, I won't get my hopes up.
The polls can be a good place but I find the betting markets are much more accurate predictors. Something about people willing to put actual money down on the result tends to mean other factors get accounted for that polls miss. They predicted trump would win 2016 when the polls showed he'd lose for instance. Sadly, the market currently has trump in the lead.
My mom mentioned something about that back in 2016, actually completely forgot it existed and now I’m doubly concerned 🙃 fuck. Any idea how it looked in 2020?
They were also much better at predicting trump. I believe they had him at 6 to 4 after the first presidential debate and 5 to 1 coming into the election day. Which is still low odds considering what actually happened, but also not 0 like the polls suggested. 1/6 is still an unlucky roll on the dice, but not impossible.
The online statistician fivethirtyeight had an excellent run up on the 2016 election I was following, he corrected for a lot of pollster results and had his prediction at 25% chance for trump, which at the time was scandalous amongst the predictors. I hope he does a similar live analysis series in this runup.
Thank you... "the lesser of two evils" is a stupid argument which always puts the most vulnerable people at even GREATER risk.
I think 99.9% of people that enter politics are self absorbed power-hungry greedy pieces of shit.
Trump is all these things, except add in rapist, misogynist, criminal, grifter, traitor.
So yeah, I'll take "less evil" - and I'll definitely vote.
Young voters who couldn't vote in 2016 or 2020 don't have this experience.
The uncommitted vote in Michigan, Minnesota, and NC is a big warning bell, and it's mostly young voters and Muslim Americans
My worry is Tim Scott as vice president. That could be very bad for Democrats.
I think Biden wins, but I'll finally (I'm 60) get passports for myself and my family this spring. I may well want them anyways, but if Trump wins, and things go really bad, I want that option, and I've wanted to get one for ages anyways.
Where would you go?
That is a problem. Short term, drive into Baja California, Mexico is pretty relaxed about Americans there, I might retire to Portugal or someplace else cheap? I don't have any good answers.
I will vote for Biden, but I fear Trump will do anything to win. If he wins, I’ll have to keep living day after day and just chat and pray democracy stays intact, then we can move hopefully move on in 4 years. Remember to vote in local elections too.
Too early to predict but the polls are bleak for Biden. He barely won in 2020 because of COVID, he needs to drum up enthusiasm to win this time.
I tend to think that people are just exhausted by American politics and are not paying attention yet. Once we get closer, the public will rally to vote against trump. At least I'm desperately hoping so
I worry we’re gonna be in the shit once ai generated voice/images/videos start us down targeted political propaganda.
Yikes! Invest Nvidia like my relatives did and at least you can make money off that AI shit I guess!
I also don't see the uncommitted/ independents voting for Trump, they saw the shit show we had last time. But I see lots of apathy among people so if we don't get good turn out in general but Trumps base get riled up and come out in numbers Biden won't squeek by this time.
There are reasons to be hopeful. Both Trump's campaign and the RNC are in a terrible financial state. Dem infighting is high but the Republican machine is deeply flawed in a way the Democratic machine is not. It really is necessary to have a functional political apparatus behind you.
You'd hope so, but negative campaigning almost never works, it just makes people not vote for the other guy, doesn't make them vote for you.
Early 40s mixed-race female in Texas. Biden will probably win the popular vote overall; I would not be surprised if he also legitimately wins the Presidency. Now, if Republicans try to overcome that with an attempted coup/insurrection again, I am not sure. Regardless, I will still be here in Texas as I want to stay close to family, as my immediate family and many of my relatives have moved here. However, I am also looking into getting my tubes tied in case things really go south.
The myth that electoralism is the be-all-end-all of political action is how we got in this mess in the first place. I don't expect Biden to win. Maybe that will help mobilize some liberals to get off their high fucking horses and learn what direct action is. The trajectory remains consistent no matter which demented fool occupies the highest office in the land: we're headed for ecofascism and imminent collapse thereafter. Both major party candidates agree that anybody under the age of 70 can go fuck themselves sooner rather than later.
When Trump won in 2016, my immediate reaction was "Time to get to work." I knew the government wasn't going to help my community, so if they won't then who will? Turns out that work has still been necessary under the Biden administration, even moreso because myopic liberals convinced themselves everything was okay once the orange man was out of office. Should he find himself back in office, we'll still be out in the community.
Between the guy actively aiding and abetting genocide and the guy who tried to cause an insurrection, I'm not feeling optimistic either way.
Let's not act like the issues with Israel are a Biden thing vs simply being an America thing. I'm not saying it's good, or I'm happy about it, but this has been a consistent theme of American foreign policy and having Biden vs anyone else would not make any difference (with the possible exception of Bernie). The same cannot be said for Trump and insurrection/fascism.
Bernie was anti ceasefire and all the politicians that people thought would stand up for the ceasefire didn’t. Democrat party is right of center and they’re willing to oust people from the party if they don’t support Zionism. There is no party further left for them to join instead that’s more aligned with the views of the American people.
Polls this early don’t mean shit. Yes, I believe Biden will win. We need to vote to make sure I’m right.
Democrats keep winning special elections. There’s hope from that.
No, I do not believe Biden will win. Conditions are not like they were in 2020. People forget Trump got Covid just before the election, and that made him appear weak and foolish.
Now what I’m about to say is in no way blaming Biden for the conditions. I am simply describing the current conditions, and want you to understand that Americans are simple and have a very short political memory. Since 2020 however, in spite of the pandemic “subsiding” we are embroiled in housing crisis, ceaseless inflation, and MULTIPLE wars. Directly involved in combat in Yemen, facilitating a genocide, and closer to war than we were even in the Cold War.
The enthusiasm for Biden despite what the media may say is not there. There is an enthusiasm gap. Things do not look good for Biden in swing states such as Michigan. Minnesota even. It’s an electoral college game let’s not forget.
I feel there is an over 50% chance Trump may win. I do not want this, obviously. I am not enthusiastic about either option, honestly. But we cannot let our fear and horror cloud our judgments. If there’s truly a chance that he can win, we must admit it and prepare, mentally and physically for that possibility.
Do not downvote me because you’re upset with the truth and are afraid of a second Trump term (which we should be). If you disagree with my analysis, please explain to me why you disagree with. Ignoring reality and sticking your head in the sand because you can’t handle the discomfort is what led to all of the conditions that gave us Trump. This type of blind liberalism will be the death of America and hand us directly over to the fascists. You should be ashamed
!RemindMe in 9 months, I’ll leave this comment there for posterity
I upvoted you because fuck the echo chamber. I'm honestly not sure Biden has it either tbh....
Thank you for understanding where I’m coming from. People assume by saying Biden is a poor candidate in poor standing, I am somehow aiding Trump. That is dangerous, what actually aids Trump, is ignoring reality and not speaking truth which may allow/push the democrats to actually change their positions. Say what you will about polls at this point in the cycle, but no Democratic incumbent candidate in modern history has polled as poorly as Biden right now. Over 100,000 people in Michigan voted Uncommitted in the primary. That is unprecedented. With this trajectory, it does not look good. And they have the capability of running another candidate. It almost feels as though they are being this incompetent to continue their role as controlled opposition to serve the wealthy ruling class/corporations.
u/SettingGreen I believe you are absolutely right and that the DNC is making a Hillary Clinton-esque mistake here, with another potentially disastrous outcome at stake. Biden is clearly divisive and not a strong candidate yet the party is not even entertaining other options seriously and they are relying on their hubris of assuming they have this in the bag because he is the incumbent. I do not have a good feeling about this at all. But either way, the DNC wins - if Dems win the presidency, then status quo for the wealthy/ruling class one way and if they lose the election, then they can start using fearmongering email campaigns to beg for donations to "fight" against whatever nonsense the next administration comes up with. The wealthy/ruling class will make money either way but the general public will bear the brunt of everything, particularly women and marginalized communities - people of color, LGTBQIA, etc
A similar number of Michigan dems voted uncommitted in President Obama’s 2012 primary. I hear you, but I really don’t think the Michigan protest vote is unprecedented.
Most people saying he's doing a bad job are straight up lying or have been misinformed. It's frustrating, because you are playing to a logical yet feelings oriented base, and it is assisting fascists take over the planet. Biden does not have a good pr team but he's been one of the best presidents possible. r/whathasbidendone.
I think there are some things Biden is doing tangibly awful things with.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2024/03/06/us-weapons-israel-gaza/
The climate approach is so piss poor. The IRA was good. The infrastructure act was in theory, but states are using the money to mostly invest in roads and expanding them, with minimal investment in public transit infrastructure. Studies showed that the increased use on these roads due to the bill will emit more carbon emissions than if he didn't pass anything at all.
I do think he will win.
I just cant believe that enough woman (let alone men) would choose abortion restrictions and all the anti choice and handsmaids tale actions they want.
Or anyone that gives 2c about the climate
All the elections since Biden’s last win have been strongly in favor of dems… down the ballot. People are not happy with maga and taking away rights.
Maybe i have false confidence… but I’m going to keep it till election day and not worry about
Ten years ago I expected riots if Roe v Wade was overturned, but apparently most American women are okay enough with it to protest a little and then just shut up.
I think people in general are just so exhausted. Repubs are actively stripping people of their rights and they are aggressive and blood thirsty about it. Everyday it gets worse. Project 2025??? They are banning rights with such ease and the only thing we can really do about it is vote. It's just a lot. I don't blame women for not protesting more.
Well the electoral college means my vote is meaningless for president in NY state so no worries!
I don’t think they thought it would actually be overturned. It was very popular over all.
Now though…. Woman are fired up and voting. Young woman too. And they should be pissed.
They showed up at the ballot box. It’s one reason that Democrats have had a lot of unexpected wins in elections lately. Source
Trump SAd somebody, defrauded New York City, defrauded a child's cancer charity, incited an insurrection, and shared classified documents with those who didn't have clearance. He's a racist, transphobe, sexist and a Christian Nationalist. He destroyed farming states like Iowa. He cut taxes on the wealthy. He outsourced oil production to Saudi Arabia
The Republican party is already taking away women's rights.
The rate of sexual abuse related pregnancies since Roe V Wade got overturned has been astronomical.
Biden passed the PACT Act, CHIPS Act, Inflation Reduction Act, Insulin Cap, Student Loan forgiveness. Believe me, I understand that Biden has his flaws but he's not a fascist who supports hate groups.
I understand that the Israel conflict is an issue and the US influences these things, but the president isn't the fucking leader of other countries.
And don't forget that Trump moved the Embassy in Israel. Don't forget the amount of drone strikes in the middle east in his 4 years.
If Trump wins because people decided to protest or die on the hill of their convictions, you only have yourself to blame and I will blame you for being so fucking selfish.
Your rights and your country are at stake. Don't throw it away if the result is having no rights left.
Mid 30s Male in a centrist Hispanic, Black and White, working class neighborhood in Chicago.
My unpopular opinion is that the US elections do not matter in the slightest. We won't plunge into civil war either way. Neither candidate is any good on war or an climate, and we'll continue on our collapse path regardless of the election.
I'm a long time supporter of outsiders within and outside of the two party system. I've supported Ron Paul, Bernie, Tulsi, Jill Stein and other Greens. I will continue in that tradition
Mid 30s black male here....I fucking get it and agree SOOO much.
This is a fair stance. Obviously Dems are somewhat better (not actively pushing climate change denial at least), but you're right that they're not doing nearly enough. I'll still vote dem as often as I can because there are some in the party that take climate change seriously, and a Dem majority is far far more likely to enact meaningful change on climate policy. But it's extremely easy to get disenchanted with the lack of political action from even the party that claims to take climate change seriously.
Thanks. Also my presidential vote doesn't matter much in this election. I've lived in WI and NC where not voting Dem mattered more. Obama managed to carry NC without me but Hilary didn't carry WI. I continue to be disillusioned with the Democratic Interventionist Warmongers. It's only been in the past few months where they've been operating the same with the mask off. I'm old enough to remember how leftists opposed the WTO, World Bank and globalization many years before the right adopted that stance.
I think I have gotten more moderate with age but the dems have been moving further and further right faster. Dems abandoning the working class in the last decade didn't help. Sure the Dems are better on taxes and worker protections than Republicans but not by much at all. I've had better jobs than in the service sector but I've mostly been in the service sector. If that paid a decent wage I probably would've settled for a job in it and possibly started voting Democrat.
Thank you, I am so perplexed by watching Americans yoyo between red and blue with each candidate being a worse expression of a broken system. Cornel is OK.
The upper class elites have done an excellent job setting up the system this way and perpetuating it by feeding propaganda to the uneducated to get them to vote against their own interests.
Yes it's very sad to watch. It must be said that they have buttressed this with legislation and a formula that leaves almost nothing out. Generally speaking, when things get like this there is no reform, we probably just have to watch it fall.
Obama was a lot better than Bush on issues other than war. American culture is insular and often incurious. Americans also often cheer for one or a series of college and professional sports teams.
Well yes, it's positive Roman and Byzantium isn't it.
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2mo
I really didn't lean Hillary that election and I'm a leftist. That Trump anti globalization and anti war stuff was in an era where we didn't know how much of a lier and how fucked up Trump was. I'm glad I didn't vote for Trump though. I knew he was too racist back then. His war record is the issue he's best compared to the others post 9/11 but he's so much worse in every other way.
Some will have a nice privledged position to watch the rest of us suffer.
Obviously being white, male and even cis-het will help.
God help the rest of us.
There is no god and humans are the worst species. Jewish Israelis use the Holocaust as an excuse to commit a genocide against Palestinians. The shit just goes round and round, hopefully we extinct ourselves before we extinct every other organism on the planet.
Duuude. Figure of speech.
Try living as a non-privledged person in this country. You might have a bit more kindness to offer, a bit more forgiveness to offer.
Yes, there are awful humans out there. But you cannot live like everyone is like that. That leads to pain.
I’m Black, disabled, poor, and trans. There is no lesser evil in U.S. politics for me and my folks, I don’t think Biden will win, his policies have been extremely harmful for people like me and it doesn’t matter to me one way or the other who wins. We will still have the same fight we have always had against fascism. Blue or red, fascism marches on in the U.S. enabled by the very people who think voting for any evil is harm reduction and not harm redistribution that historically gets handed down over and over again to my communities so others can feel “safe”. Some people have just had the privilege to ignore it the past 160+ years. Will continue to do the work of dismantling these systems, hunkering down, and helping folks survive.
Republicans are already trying to reduce veteran's health benefits. It's not like i can get insurance with all my issues. Plus I have a uterus, so probably dead if Trump wins. Both my teens are transgender, but have passports. So I'll try to get them into foreign colleges as quickly as possible.
I don’t think Biden will win. I think most people are not actually politically engaged, so all they’ll think is “2016-2020 pretty good, 2020-2024 bad ☹️” and vote trump
My long term plan is not to stay in america, and that doesn’t change president to president
I don't see Biden winning at at all. Maaaaybe if they replace him with another dem, but even then I think the party has made it very clear it does not represent anyone left of center and people are noticing this more and more and rallying around 3rd party candidates (though probably not in an organized enough fashion for any one of them to win).
Idk how old the average age of this sub is but I'm 29, all of my friends and peers are politically active and previously consistent voters, and not a single one is willing to vote for Biden ever again. It's not just one issue either-dismantling covid response+refusing to acknowledge covid, approving the Willow project despite massive pushback from young people (and record drilling in general, and all the Zionism, the vile racist rhetoric around immigration, cop cities everywhere, etc.
Maaaybe if he kicks it and they run someone else, but even then I kinda think the dems are done.
u/HistoricalLibrary626 THANK YOU for mentioning the dismantling of Covid response and the refusal to acknowledge Covid. No, we didn't beat Covid - they just are gaslighting the public about it and systematically taking away any tools we have to be able to protect ourselves or even to be able to gauge how fast it is spreading, even though people are continuing to die from it and are being permanently disabled from long covid. I remember when people made fun of Trump for saying "if you don't test, you don't have cases" and yet no one bats an eye when Biden's administration has done exactly that. The CDC telling people they don't have to isolate and can go back to work while still positive (and likely shedding virus) was just the last straw for me. It's so infuriating
Theres a lot of people that cannot and will not vote for Biden again.
There are so many cases where he seemed to choose a path to get political points, rather than implement a long-term solution. The forgiveness of student loans is one. Sure it helps some people out, but it makes the problem worse in the long run. There was simply no plan.
Same thing with the IRA. It was mostly rebates and tax incentives. There's no new "space race", no addressing many things like plastics pollution etc.
Also, trumpeting how he is a proud zionist is not a good thing. Imagine if Obama said he was a proud "Black Panther". But Biden has elevated zionism to a full racist belief system. Even Trump did not go around calling himself a racist like he was proud of it.
A lot of those things are straight up lies homie, check where you get your info from.
Be at peace. I know Trump is scary, and I'll be horrified if he wins. However, Biden is a despicable corporate tool and the eventual outcome will be the same either way. The problem is not only systemic, but inward folding, inexorable and necessary. I know it'd be painful to see it accelerate with Trump, but you must know that none of these problems will be solved by the dems, and voluntary internal reform has crawled away and shat itself in the corner. I'm sorry, I'm on the other side of the world and I feel the tremors from here. Best of luck and look after yourself.
I still believe there's a small chance of a progressive uprising from within the democratic party, leading to a reformation and reorganization of the party.
Nah AIPAC pays to kill that potential any time it happens
I don't. However, it's not my place to not make room for that. I think the beginnings of that can and will happen, but the system itself will skew the outcome.
The beginnings have already happened, with Bernie making some noise the last few election primaries, as well as the congressional progressive caucus slowly growing.
And what was the outcome? The system snapped into place and we got Biden. It was hypnotic and surreal to watch. I remember following it with people and then saying, "wait for it wait for it, almost time, annnnd, bang." The system was barely stretch tested at all.
You're not wrong in some ways, but we disagree about whether or not that constitutes "the beginnings." If you expected the progressives to rise up in a few short years and be successful, without the establishment fighting back, then I'm not sure what to tell you. The congressional progressive caucus continues to grow steadily. There are a lot of us progressives out here, adding more as gen z continues to turn 18. I'll be very interested to see what the 2028 presidential candidates look like.
I acknowledged in my first comment that the beginnings would. I knew to pre-empt that, because it's a very important aspect to this. Nobody can stop the stirrings of change, but the system in place knows how to and has mechanisms to dilute, assimilate and redirect such energy. The progressive caucus is sitting in its corner like a good boy and any who wish to be progressive are welcome to go sit in the corner with them and read from the script. Following this through to the unmaking and remaking of a system is a different beast entirely. For me, this is on par with our governments declaring a climate emergency but nothing changes.
I do think Biden will win. I think all but a small contingency of cult like followers are completely fed up with Trump. Diehard Republicans may still vote for him anyway, or maybe not vote at all. Now, whether Trump will accept the results is obviously another huge question to be determined.
I don’t know what I will do if Trump wins. Other than for obvious reasons my mental state for awhile won’t be a positive one. We’re a lower middle class white family of 2 disabled kids. We’re in a pretty good position now, but if things go more towards full fledged fascism, I’ll be way more anxious. Mostly I try not to worry about it but just keep an exit strategy in our back pocket in case. And try hard to convince everyone I know to vote.
What’s sad if that if Biden wins without a more organized insurrection trying to overthrow the election right after, all we get at most is a brief reprieve before next political crisis.
Biden has dropped below $3 for the win for the first time this election cycle on the Australian betting websites. Trump is still odds on favourite though.
Nothing will happen if either win. The ruling elite will still rule. Presidency is middle-management.
Sleeping on it, I think there could be concern that Biden might lose because under 40 left-leaning people have never been entirely practical but they and a lot of the country are completely impractical now because of the mass insanity of moral absolutist environment created by social media, identity politics, and cancel culture. All that stuff has it's place but to me it feels like a huge % of Americans don't know how to think or talk about anything political except in moral absolutist terms....
And morally the Dems' unwavering support for the Zionists' horrific and historically massive campaign of genocide and ethnic cleansing in Palestine unfortunately puts them on the same level morally/ethically as the GOP with their support for proposed campaigns of genocide and ethnic cleansing in the USA (unless you think Palestinian lives are of less value than Americans).
So all these people who can't approach politics practically know the Dems and GOP are morally equivalent, even if not practically equivalent, and maybe they won't recognize that practically it's better to at least have the genocide happening somewhere else to people you don't know. So this is why I think I Biden could lose.
Also the Zionist genocide in Palestine has not only further radicalized some to the left, it has radicalized the right in America to believe that they too can massacre their enemies with support and no interference.
It seems his SOTU speech has started the process of shoring up the democrat base. If he can do that as well as he should, and show the spirit & nous he did in the speech, He's in again. Reason is: Trump is not going to win over enough independents - in fact he is showing them how unfit he is every day. Money on Biden.
You know what?
Fuck Biden and fuck the Democrats.
They vocally and materially support absolute fucking monsters, the Zionist ethno-fascists who are bombing the homes of millions to rubble and then bombing and machine gunning the survivors as they struggle to search for food and water.
They deserve to lose and honestly if all the Dem elites get rounded up and taken to camps by Trump it's probably their karma for this shit -- not to mention letting COVID rip and killing way, way, way more people with that biological weapon since Biden took office:
Okay, but if Biden and dems lose, they won't be the only ones to pay for it - our entire country will backslide into absolute fascism and we'll all pay for it.
Then the Dems shouldn't have been so dumb about Gaza and actually understand that the past 5 months have radicalized a significant chunk of voters
I’m not a US citizen, but the global ramifications of a Trump victory will impact us all.
He will withdraw US support from Ukraine, and decimate NATO, which will lead to a European-wide conflict. He will withdraw support from Israel ( not a bad thing), but this will, however, result in a full scale Middle East war. China will use his term to take over Taiwan and extend their influence further into the South China sea, destabilising the region, and placing US strategic allies at risk while he does nothing. Thought supply issues were bad during COVID? Conflict will break the global logistics network. Medications will be in short supply. Vehicles, parts, electronics, food etc etc will all become difficult to source.
Domestically, he has stated his clear intentions to remove women’s right to choose and will make abortion illegal, and contraception difficult to obtain.
Education will be targeted as a means of control. Books will be banned or burned. Teachers can expect severe punishment for teaching ‘subversive’ ideas (e.g. One state is already seeking to have teachers who use Trans kids preferred pronouns registered as sex offenders).
Minority groups overall will be in great danger, and can expect extreme marginalisation, and potentially face deportment, internment, ‘re-education’ or even execution. LBGQTI, immigrants, the disabled, veterans, the homeless, and Jews will all be targeted.
The filthy rich will grow even richer, and the poor will suffer further. Basic services, pensions, and resources will be either eliminated or reduced. He’s expressed his disdain for Veterans, so you can expect VA will become almost impossible to access.
TLDR: If he is elected, brace for an Authoritarian ruler looking to decimate US democracy, and inflict chaos on the world.
No one knows at this point. One thing is clear to me. We have a black and white choice in November.
Choice one is about saving Democracy. Biden came out last night and today wit the gloves off, wide awake and throwing round house punches to the gut of his opponent.
Choice two is about America turning into an Autocracy. In fact 45 is meeting wit the Autocrat Victor Orban of Hungary right now in his Mara Loco in Florida. He told Putin "Do what ever the hell you want to do to NATO members that don't pony up their share" to NATO
Here is the data:
"A record number of NATO nations are set to meet or exceed the alliance's spending target, but other members are still falling short.
NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg said 18 nations were expected to spend 2% of their gross domestic product (GDP) on defense in 2024 - up from 11 in 2023 and a six-fold increase from 2014 when only three Nato allies hit the spending target.
The expected increase in defense spending also means European NATO allies as a whole will collectively spend 2% of their combined GDP - worth $380bn - on defense for the first time."
Clear and simple choice. AT least for this third generation veteran.
he will 100% win, theres just a lot of noise and shitty polling.
I DONT CARE ANYMORE
I think that he will lose. Being in Canada, this shouldn't have direct effects on me, although food prices might wiggle and food quality on US imports will falter, and the Canadian dollar might change as well. I fear for literally most of my social sphere, who are firmly rooted in the US, and who are mostly queer.
If Trump wins, I'm leaving the country. Not because I'm all that worried about my safety or anything, but because he's going to collapse the entire country at minimum economically. It's also the point at which I officially give up on the US. If we're stupid enough to elect Trump twice... there's just no hope. I'm out.
Does it even matter? What's the difference?
Sooo... I'm guessing you're a hetero cis dude, and probably white? Because the difference to the rest of us is literally how much personal freedom we may lose.
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2mo
Omg wtf
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I think I might finally be to the point where I'm done investing emotional energy in politics. Yes, I will continue to vote blue, but the political polarization is what is likely to make things worse in the short term.
My strategy is the same either way, build community and get better at interacting with people I disagree with. Continue learning to grow food and teaching my children to be resilient.
I'm speaking from a place of privilege tho, so YMMV.