AITA for changing my grown son’s room into a room for my granddaughter?

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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:

1) changing the room 2) this is his room and was his entire life

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Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.

NTA. You don't need to maintain a shrine to your grown son.

Your needs changed, and there is a valid reason to change his old room into a room for Zoey. He lives an hour away, so how often does he rely stay there?

NTA

Your son feels entitled to a place where he doesn't live. He moved out. He lives elsewhere. He pays taxes elsewhere. He pays rent/mortgage elsewhere. He doesn't live there, he doesn't need a room.

That being said, if he sleeps there 2-3x a year, can't Zoey spend the night in Kathy's room (or Kathy in Zoey's) for those few nights, so that Michael can have a little privacy?

Absolutely NTA. Not only is he and adult who does not pay rent, he wants to tell you who can live in your house?

He's family, but a houseguest not a resident. It's not his room, it was his room. Many if not most people don't have a childhood bedroom to return to; that's completely reasonable. You could have made it your office, workout room, or sewing room.

His throwing a hissy fit shows that not only is he immature, but unempathetic. He seriously has no feeling for this child, who will now be his niece?

Arrange your house as you want, including who lives there. If he has such a problem, he can find another place to stay when visiting. I hope it doesn't come to that, and this is just him being resistant to change at first but still reasonable ... but some people feel that entitlement.

He should tell that no-good, freeloading two year old to crawl to the local gas station and start begging for quarters. Maybe he can even write the sign for her considering, you know, she doesn't know how to write. Or perhaps he can meet you in the middle, and find a nice, gently used UHaul box that the child can live, sleep and play in. They're making some pretty sturdy ones nowadays. With her young knees I'm sure the arthritis won't kick in for a few good years. And for work...I mean if those children could sweep chimneys during the great depression I see no reason why Zoey can't get her act together and start sweeping. Maybe your son could whittle handle down so it can fit into her tiny hands.

NTA obviously. But if your son is going to try to reclaim "his" room that he pays no money for, then he better chip in solutions to rehome this 2 year old because a 25 year old needs his woom to sweep in. Like honestly, I love the entitlement to be catered to at 25 but the two year old is on her own. Whatta man, whatta man, whatta mighty good man you've got there.

NTA. I could see if your son was 18 or 19, in college and planning on coming home for the summers. But at 25 and established in his own home/apartment, he has no need for his childhood bedroom.

Aww I loved that you called her your granddaughter

Sorry, but you don't need your sons permission to make changes in your home. When he comes and visits, he can sleep on the couch or get his own hotel room. You don't need to feel bad at all. Your son is the asshole.

NTA at all and please don't feel like you are. Let me tell you something: at one point in my life, I was Michael. My mom took in my 3 cousins when I went away to college. They needed my room to accommodate our growing family. I had my own apartment, and I rarely visited back home because of my studies.

Michael is acting really immature. I'm sorry but I as an 18 y.o. understood that my mom needed the room. Michael as a 25 y.o. should understand as well, but instead he's being really selfish.

JFC what a childish reaction.

NTA

He wants you to boot Kathy and Zoey, who are helping you financially, so he can hold onto a room he doesn't use except for maybe 4 or 5 nights a year? Not to mention he only lives one hour away?

Is this in Europe or the UK? That's the only reason I can see the "distance" being a problem for him. Most Americans drive two hours one-way for a good daytrip, not just to see family on Christmas, then we go home. An hour is nothing.

He is very entitled to stake this claim. I'd tell him the only way that's happening is if he pays you what Kathy has been. He'll whine that it's "not fair" but he'll back down.

NTA

He’s being ridiculous. He’s a grown adult who doesn’t live at home. You’re allowed to re purpose any room in YOUR house.

My old bedroom is now a den that my parents use as a tv room. There is a futon for the very rare times we spend the night. But it’s not my house - my parents can do what they like.

NTA - Michael is a grown adult. He doesn’t need a bedroom at mom’s house when he no longer lives there.

Oh no your son needs to get a grip and grow up. You are NTA that baby is an orphan how incredibly selfish of your son. My son moved out a year ago his room is now my pc room because he doesn’t live here. I honestly can’t believe what I’ve just read

Nta my parents sold their home and live in an rv now. He is not entitled to a room at his mommy’s house forever. You have the space you have and you need to make things work for the people actually living in the house. If he has to get a hotel room when he visits then that’s just the way it is. He needs to start acting like a man and stop throwing a tantrum like a little boy. He should be ashamed of himself too trying to put your sister and that sweet kid through more bs after such a loss. His sister is grieving the loss of her best friend still I’m sure and being thrown into becoming a mother suddenly. And that poor girl just lost her mother and has no father around either.

Your son is being an entitled brat. He has no interest moving back home yet he thinks you're obligated to keep a dedicated room for him in your house. That's a big no. He's not paying your bills, he's not visiting on weekends, so why does he need a room of his own?

NTA.

NTA

Your son is delusional, he wants her to move out? He can kick rocks. 

Still, I would approach this from a place of empathy for him and say how you realize this is probably not about the room itself, but how he feels isolated and separated from his family.  He doesn’t feel as close with everyone anymore and this is basically a tangible sign that he never will be. 

This is not anybody’s fault, it is just life, things change, it’s probably the first time it’s really hitting him, which is why he’s behaving like such a baby. I’d also emphasize how proud you are of him for whatever it is he does, he has a job, his apartment, he is clearly doing something right. 

He probably doesn’t view his apartment as “home” though, and so by removing this “home base” from him, he feels untethered.  

You can ask him to come home and spend time with everyone more often so he has stronger relationships with you all, but absolutely under no circumstances will he be keeping that room.  

You can help him make his apartment feel more like a home. Give him some stuff from your house to make it special, if that makes sense, a clock from your house, a lamp, whatever, just a little bit of home. 

 You can also ask him why he thinks a child who has lost her mother should make sacrifices just so a grown man can have his childhood room the way he left it?  Why does his childhood get to remain intact when the actual child in front of him is having hers ripped apart? 

Instead of helping with that, he wants to make things harder… for a child. I’d suggest therapy at that point if he doubles down, but hopefully he won’t.

Once an individual has a primary residence outside the family home, they do not get any say on how another household operates. He's lucky OP isn't charging him storage fees.

Why is the son being so petty, anyways? This poor little girl lost her mother. She needs people to make her feel secure. He sounds like a giant baby.

You are definitely NTA😂 your son will get over it.

NTA

He doesn't pay the bills. He doesn't get to throw a fit when something changes.

Give him time to pick things up that he wants to keep but like you said, he doesn't need the room. Zoey does.

NTA - My kids havent moved out yet (they are not adults) but they know that this home isnt going to be a shrine to them when they leave. In fact, they know that my spouse and I could potentially downsize after they are gone. Point being 0 adult children arent owed a room in their parents homes for the rest of their lives.

He's a full on, grown ass man who has his own place and he's salty about a bedroom in a house he doesn't plan on moving back into? Um, no. Grow the hell up, buddy!

NTA do whatever you want, and remember one small detail: it's YOUR HOUSE!!! He has no claim whatsoever on any room in your home anymore. Period.

NTA - It’s your house. He’s a grown man. You’re not throwing his stuff in the street presumably. He can come get what he wants. You’re trying to do right by a sad little girl. He’s being childish.

NTA !

You are a good person to your daughter and to her daughter !

Michael can stay at a hotel for a few nights when he comes to see you !

NTA. He should be okay😂

NTA- even if your daughter was not paying the bills, your son does not live there so why does he need to room for 2-3 times a year. I never understood adults who get upset at parents converting their room into a guest room or whatever the owner decides.

NTA. 

I’m not sure it’s even necessary to have had the convo with him until right before he came to visit.  

Box up all his stuff and let him take it the next time he visits. 

NTA your son is being immature and selfish. He shouldn’t have a say in the matter. He not only doesn’t pay to live there but barely even visits. You said so yourself he comes maybe 2 or 3 times a year. So Kathy and the little girl are suppose to share one room even though Kathy paying to live there and the room is vacant for almost the entire year. Outside of the maybe 2 or 3 times a year Mike visits? That’s wild and unreasonable. He needs to grow up. He didn’t care about the room until it was gonna be used for something else. He doesn’t really need the room obviously.

I honestly can't understand grown ass adults crying over a room in their parents house when they move out and never have any intention of returning back "home" to live. When I moved out of my mums' home, my brother had my wallpaper stripped and painted by the time the sun set that same day. I found it hilarious. I've only ever slept at my mums twice since, and that was over 20 years ago. The room has had many different uses. Of course, my mum would let me move back in if it was needed, but the room stopped being mine once I left home.

Hopefully, Michael is having his last childish snit when facing the loss of his childhood bedroom. Kind of understandable, but exhausting. Maybe it would have been nice if he could have been asked, strictly as a formality so he could have closure in his mind, but life doesn't always wait for that. Hope everything works out. NTA.

NTA. I imagine this is more him grieving no longer being a child and maybe feeling a bit dissatisfied. Maybe he can come visit at some point when he's ready to be kind to Kathy. 

NTA I don’t understand this. My mom redecorated my room a few months after I moved out.

This is your house. You need the space. It’s weird that he feels a room needs to remain empty except for 2-3 times a year.

NTA

I moved out at 17 and within a week my room had been turned into my dad’s office. I was a bit annoyed because that meant that I couldn’t move back in, but I never felt like I had ownership over what they did with that room.

Your son needs to grow up.

NTA. If he want the room, he needs to pay 1/3 of the mortgage. You have done nothing wrong.

He may feel sad that there is no room that is 'his' at your house but as you stated, he said he will never be moving home. Let him know you understand that but he doesn't get to decide what happens in a house he doesn't own or live in.

NTA. It WAS his room, then it was an empty spare room, now it's Zoey's bedroom. You could have changed into whatever you wanted ten seconds after he moved out. You don't need Michael's permission to rearrange the rooms in your house. Box up anything he may want and give him a deadline to pick it up or it's gets donated. What he feels is irrelevant since he doesn't live in your home. Explain to him that he has no say in how you run your household. Your household runs smoothly as it is and you shouldn't let Michael's opinions trick you into thinking otherwise.

NTA - It's not his room. It's YOUR room in YOUR house and he has no say about what happens with it because he doesn't live there or help pay the bills.

NTA. It’s your home, you’re the one who lives in it and pays the bills. You did him a curtesy telling him. One that I think is warranted btw; I remember coming home from college after being gone a week and seeing that my mother had completely transformed my room already. But he doesn’t live there, and has no plans to. You can’t live your life based around his sometimes visits. That’s ridiculous.

Tell your GROWN ADULT son to get a grip and grow up!!!

NTA - I am so sorry that you somehow raised a son who wouldn't cheerfully give up a room he doesn't need for an ORPHANED CHILD.

Your grown adult son can pay you monthly rent to keep his room the way it is. Why should you keep the room of someone who doesn't live there anymore the way it is, when you NEED the extra space?

He's a grownup now. If he wants his own room, he can get a hotel room.

NTA and stop asking your adult son permission for what you want to do in your own home. He's being horrific and needs a reality check. Don't ask him. Be the mommy he needs to help him accept his adulthood and tell him that you are taking over your house. He can either come get his things, put them in storage, or you will get rid of them in two weeks. Do not let him whine or bully you. Assert your ownership of your own home. He sounds like more of a toddler than the actual toddler in this story. And every bit as selfish as a toddler who doesn't yet realize that other people have real emotion and they aren't the center of everyone's world.

NTA and he is ridiculous.

My daughter moved out at 24 to another town with her fiancée, 100% independent from us. I told her that if anything happened she could certainly come home, but that I would be turning her bedroom into a guest room/vanity room within a few months of her leaving.

There was no drama and she took everything she wanted with her, the rest got tossed or donated. I redecorated and repainted, and now I have an extra closet for my out-of-season wardrobe instead of storing it in the basement.

I’m gonna go against the grain and say NAH.

Obviously give the 2 year old the room. But he’s allowed to have his feelings about losing (what I’m guessing is) his childhood bedroom.

Like yes he’s been moved out for a while but it’s a string of memories and a link to his childhood. So I definitely understand why he’s upset. And I’m sure he’ll come around and not be angry about it.

But at the same time you definitely need to give that kid her own space.

Always being able to go home to family doesn't mean your family has to keep your childhood room perpetually kept as an untouched shrine reserved for the 5 times a year you come home & stay the night.

It's confronting for everyone the first time you come home & see "your" room isn't your room anymore. But adults shake that off & move on.

His physical room isn't/wasn't "his entire life". His experiences were his life, not the physical confines.

NTA

Why does he have a right to a room in YOUR house when he is hardly ever there and doesn’t pay any bills? Ridiculous.

NTA. Even if the granddaughter was not in the picture, it would be totally normal to change his old bedroom into an office or guest room. I get that it can kind of be a reality check to realize your childhood room can be gotten rid of but it’s one that most adults face just fine. My Mom downsized to a smaller house after we all fled the nest. Some people end up renting out rooms to supplement income. It's weird to keep a room for someone who doesn't live there.

I go with NAH. 

It is your house and you can do as you please. 

Your daughter is a capable woman. You could leave her for alone with the child and the business for a couple of days and go see your son. 

Because you should have a conversation with him but maybe face-to-face would be better. So you can figure out why he is opposed. 

There are lots of reasons why he is upset. Some are selfish others I wouldn’t think of as selfish.

Two that I could imagine are happening here:

1. The room was always at the back of his mind as his safety net. If he lost everything else there would still be his room at his mother’s house waiting for him. A place where he knew it would be alright. And now it is being pulled away under his feet.

2. Privacy. A pull-up couch in the living room even with something to separate it from the rest of the room, still grants no true privacy. Same for a day bed in his mothers room (there aren’t many grown men who are excited to spend the night in his mothers room). Where would he go if he needed some alone time to decompress? And for this another compromise could be that your daughter gives up her room for those three nights a year for example. Even if she pays bills and he doesn’t. 

But most of all have a proper conversation where you tell him that he can say whatever he feels about this situation without being interrupted, judged or anything. That you will listen with an open mind and you will considered it. I am sure you would do this all anyway but it never hurts to communicate it properly beforehand.

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I have 2 kids: Kathy (29F) and Michael (25M). Kathy lives with me , pays a portion of the bills and has no plans on moving out anytime soon. We have our own business that we operate out of our home. It’s easier for her to live here and it’s great because I have help with the bills. Whereas, Michael lives about an hour away for work and has his own apartment. For awhile, I kept Michael’s room as is. He’s shared several times he has no plans of moving back home as his job is in the city he moved to.

Kathy had a very close friend who has a 2 year old daughter, Zoey. Friend named Kathy her daughter’s godmother as well as guardian should she pass. Unfortunately, that happened 6 months ago. Kathy’s friend was a single mom, so Kathy was granted custody. At first, Zoey was sharing a room with Kathy as she had extreme separation anxiety. However, she’s now ready for her own room. As our home is a 3 bedroom. We don’t have anywhere else to put her.

When I told Michael what we were doing, I said I’d get a pull out for the living room or I could get a daybed for my room when he visits overnight for holidays. I know rooming with your mom isn’t fun, but I want to give him options.

He’s mad that I gave the room to Zoey. He says that was his room. I said I understand but he doesn’t live with me. Kathy does and pays bills. She’s even paying more now because she feels she’s using more resources with Zoey living with us. I’d feel different if Kathy and Zoey were moving out soon but they’re not. At this point, Kathy plans to adopt Zoey. I want to help her. My mom helped me raise my kids, her mom helped her, it’s in our culture to have a multigenerational household.

Moving isn’t an option. I can make the space more private for Michael when he spends the night (a divider in the living room). But as he usually only sleeps her 2 or 3 times a year, it just doesn’t feel practical.

I said if Michael ever needed to move home permanently, we’d make something work. And I’d also help him with his child if he was in this situation. He says he doesn’t want kids. I said that’s fine but this is the situation at this moment.

He feels Kathy should move out. I said I’m not kicking her out just so he can have a room the few times he spends the night.

AITA?

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Nta he moved out! It's not like he's living in a dorm and at home part of the year.

NTA.. It's your house, it's your room to do with as you please... Your son is 25 and lives on his own.. What is wrong with him?

It’s not his room! Did he help pay the mortgage?

NTA

Michael doesn't live there or pay the bills. He doesn't need his own room when it's better used for the people who actually live in the house.

NTA you kept his room as it was for longer than most parents would and do not need his permission to do anything in your home. I've commented about this before, but when I moved out my dad turned my room into his storage room for all his fishing equipment within a month. It is the only room in the house with carpet and I'm deathly allergic to fish so I will absolutely never be able to move back into that room. I've never felt any type of way about that because it's my dads home and he can do anything he wants with it, I'm an adult and it's on me to find solutions to any life obstacles that come my way (I actually joke about it because my dad made sure to tell me when I moved out that my cat was always welcome to come back to live with him, but he didn't say anything about me 🤣). Do what makes sense for you and your daughter, your son will get over it.

NTA. It's not his room, it's yours, because it's your house. Sounds like your kids have some codependent tendencies.

NTA. The people who live in the house, especially the traumatized child (and soon to be his adoptive niece!), get priority for room assignments. Not to mention, living an hour away there really isn’t a reason he couldn’t go home to his apartment and sleep in his own bed (seriously, some days it can be more than an hour to get from my house on the NE side of the city I live in to my friend’s house on the SW side).

Your son is being astoundingly selfish in the face of your daughter and you trying to do right by this child. I could understand if he thought your daughter was taking advantage of you financially, but it sounds like she pays a disproportionate share of the expenses, so that’s not the case. So frankly, you need to tell to keep his opinions to himself.

NTA. Your son is an independent adult with his own living space. You do not owe him permanent, inflexible, perpetual, free space in your home.

Sure, it would be great if we all had infinite spare rooms in our homes, but that's not reality. Our needs change, & that room is better served being used rather than remaining a shrine to your son's childhood.

I'm not unsympathetic to his feelings, though. Change can suck, especially when it's something sentimental like a bedroom. Maybe you could take him to dinner & reassure him of your love. He's entitled to feel a little angsty. Growing up is hard.

BTW, I woke up to my younger brother moving into my room as I was sleeping the day after I came home to tell my parents I had a job & was moving out. 😂

NTA

He should have taken all his stuff when he moved out or realized that you were going to use that space as needed. Michael is being silly.

NTA 

He's being a brat.

NTA. Your son is being ridiculous.

Any chance Zoey could sleep in your daughter's room with her, on the rare occasions when your son is staying over? I can see why he would like to have privacy when he's staying with you. A roll away bed, toddler bed might fit in Kathy's room.

NTA. He doesn’t live there and only lives an HOUR away. I commuted that long to my job for 15 years. You do what is right for you, your daughter and granddaughter.

NTA. He doesn't even live there anymore.

NTA - Michael doesn't live there anymore. He doesn't contribute to the bills there. He is a grown man with a home of his own.

NTA

I’m of course assuming that if there was anything sentimental he wanted that he had a chance to grab it but the room isn’t actively serving anyone and it can serve Zoey. It makes perfect sense that she would get her own room now since she will be living with you unless Kathy decides to move out.

NTA He’s a grown man with his own home. He’s lucky you kept his room for so long. As soon as I moved out, my dad took over my room for his larger office and mom made his former (small) office into her walk in closet. I couldn’t have cared less, because well, it wasn’t my room or home anymore and they could do whatever they wanted with their rooms. And so should you!

NTA. It isn't your son's house. It is your house and you can do as you please with it. It's great that you can and want yo help your daughter and her new addition.

NTA - it's your home and you're making a kind and practical decision. Zoey is your family now and she needs the room, Michael does not.

NTA. He moved out, has no plans to return, and doesn’t visit often. The fact that you haven’t already turns his room into something different is impressive. If he wants his own space to be reserved for him he can pay a portion of the rent for it but since he’s not he gets no say 

NTA

NTA. He doesn't live there- end of subject.

NTA at all. You are doing the absolute best to accommodate everyone in your life.

What a joke he is! He doesn't live there and he is going to tell you to have his sister move out because he wants his own room when he visits 2x a year. You know you are NTA. Hold firm to your plans. You also benefit from your daughters company and now a small child. You will love it.

NTA I decorated my room specifically for my niece when she visits my parents. I sleep on the sofa. I'm an adult and don't need a room at my parents house.

NTA. Michael is an adult living in another city. He can't expect you to maintain a Shrine to him when you have a toddler in need of space.

NTA- time for baby boy to grow up and get real.

Easy NTA. Rooms go to people who live there first, before they are made into offices or guest rooms. It isn't his room anymore, and it hasn't really been his room for a while. He is an adult with his own place and not paying towards the home.

Nta he doesn't live there. He needs to get over it. 

Your house, your rules 👍

Your son is being ridiculous. Why on earth would he expect you to maintain a bedroom for him at this point?? NTA

NTA. When I was in my 20s, I explicitly asked my father to turn my old bedroom into a room for my brother's step kids. This is ridiculous.

What. I'm sorry, but; world's biggest eye roll to your kid. There's literally no reason for him to be upset about this. Show him this post and tell him to think long and hard about why he's so upset here. Was he hoping to move back in--is he secretly in danger of losing his job? Is Kathy the golden child and he's tired of her getting more consideration than him? This is just really weird. 

NTA, Michael needs to grow up.

NTA needs change and this is what’s going on now. I let my kids stay at my house as long as they need to if they’re between jobs or places to live. It’s not our family home we moved a lot when the kids were growing up and I divorced their dad almost 10 years ago but they prefer to come to me most of the time. I also have two stepsons who are just like my kids. They all know this is there house too but someone may need to crash on the couch.

NTA. That WAS his room. Part of being an adult is letting go of your childhood.

NTA at all. Michael is being unreasonable with expecting his childhood room to be left as is and left open for his very limited visits home. All of your reasoning is sound. It’s your, your daughters, and now your grand god daughters permanent home. It has to function for you, not potentional guests. Heck, when I moved out of my parents house they had my old room converted to my dads office before I was out of the driveway.

NTA. You have no reason to keep the room as a shrine to your son. He doesn't live there anymore. He has some maturing to do

NTA.

We probably come from very different cultures (it is generally frowned upon to have multi-generational households in my country), but we can agree on your son behaving in a very entitled way.

For context: when my parents decided to turn my room into a general hang-out room for themselves, I went over and helped them clean out any stuff I left there and rip up my old carpet.

Not sure why he feels so attached to that room, but it is exactly as he says it: it was his room. Past tense.

NTA, it hasn't been his room since he moved out. It was your guest room and he was your main guest. Now it's Zoey's room. It wasn't his room before he was born, it wasn't his room after he moved out and it won't be his room if y'all decided to move. He's a grown adult who doesn't live there. He can't tell you what to do with YOUR guest room. Maybe he's just feeling left out of the family and is using the room as a way to express that.

Your son is a bit of a "Me, me, me. What about ME?" Time to grow up, son. You're NTA and its okay if he's mad about your decision but you don't have to engage in further discussions about it with him.