I don't understand how a hot dog isn't a sandwich. Same for tacos. I'm for the big tent interpretation of sandwiches.
Language (and to an extent, human thought) is heuristic. We don't define sandwiches by strict criteria and prescriptive definitions. A bit circularly, what people think of as a sandwich is what counts as a sandwich.
So while a hotdog can be considered a sandwich in one locality it might not be in another.
A bit circularly, what people think of as a sandwich is what counts as a sandwich.
See also: Why irregardless exists in the dictionary.
If someone said "hey let's go get some sandwiches for lunch" and they took you to a taco joint, you would be pleasantly surprised but also very confused.
No, no, no. Sandwiches are tacos.
Same
Let me explain. A hotdog is only one slice of bread folded in on itself. A sandwich is two separate pieces of bread that were cut. A taco doesn't even use bread. In fact they almost always use corn tortillas, which, although a carb-y substance, is not bread. Tacos are not sandwiches. Hotdogs are not sandwiches. They are merely cousins on the food taxonomic tree.
Could you make a sandwich with cornbread?
What if you sliced the hotdog bun all the way through?
A taco can use a wheat tortilla, but I don't think wheat is even necessary.
Getting into the weeds about types of bread cuts or corn vs wheat just excludes perfectly good sandwich-type foods from the sandwich conversation. Let all the cousins uncles and aunts of the sandwich world in for a big sandwich party!
Ah, but you see, hotdogs are actually tacos! which means they are sandwiches?
Hot dog? Do you mean a frankfurter sandwich?
You mean the dachshund sandwich?
You mean a sausage sandwich?
In this context, I completely agree. Any strip mall trying to prohibit a taco shop from opening clearly has their priorities out of whack and deserves some legal smacking around.
The strip mall owner and the restaurant owner are the same person.
The issue at hand is that the owner bought a property and proceeded to turn it into a strip mall. However, he never got it rezoned from residential to commercial, and the project wasn't legal. He tried to do the rezone afterward, but neighbors were against the project and the city was pissed that he tried to do an end-run around them. They denied the rezone.
He went back to the city later and said OK, I signed a deal with the neighbors. We agreed that only certain kinds of restaurants are allowed and we also will obey some other restrictions like no alcohol or outdoor seating. The city said "ok, fine, as long as you adhere to the deal." He then proceeded to try and open a taco restaurant. The neighbors then said "hey, that's not allowed under the deal!" But they negotiated a new deal that let the whole thing move forward.
But then the city pointed out that, actually, you have to get our permission first. The city council approved a rezone under the original conditions, not the amended ones. The planning commission told them to either not move forward with the taco place or go back to the city council to add a new exception to the rezoning deal.
The owner chose the third option - suing the city and arguing that tacos are actually sandwiches, so it fit the deal in the first place.
This is going to be interesting with strip mall non-compete clauses. We have a six unit strip with a Firehouse and a sit down Mexican spot. I'm sure Firehouse at least has a contract clause not allowing the owner to lease to "sandwich shop" competitors
When I saw the headline, I assumed it was about non-compete
An Indiana superior court judge's ruling isn't likely to convince the rest of the nation that a taco is a sandwich. It could cause a little chaos if a sandwich shop wants to kick out a neighboring Mexican place or vice versa, but in most of the country it's not going to lead to a court case the parties care to litigate.
FWIW I think he's wrong in the way that matters: what the parties wanted and intended a term to mean in lieu of a firm contractual definition. Failing that you might look at common parlance. If I look at DoorDash right now I see sandwich shops, burger places, and Mexican as separate top categories. I think 99% of people are going to wonder what's wrong with you if you agree you'll bring sandwiches and show up with tacos and argue they're just sandwiches. The judge let himself get overly technical on the question of "what is sandwich?" Stuff between bread? Yes. "Sandwich shop" as generally understood and almost definitely intended by the parties at the time? Clearly not. Bad ruling, but I digress.
The result will be tightening the definitions in contracts. People will argue about it, and a few of them will argue about it in court, but only the lawyers will profit off this one in the end.
sandwich shops, burger places, and Mexican as separate top categories
If my DD page is a typical one, there is odds the same place will show up in all 3, and possibly not really qualify for any. DD's tags are so terrible.
See also: McDonald's shows up under pizza and Mexican in mine. And no they are not offering either.
I mean, I'm ideologically as anti-zoning and pro-taco as it gets, but... this dude seems like a proper piece of work.
He should be forced to sell Tortas too, at the very least.
I mean, I'm ideologically as anti-zoning and pro-taco as it gets, but... this dude seems like a proper piece of work.
I work professionally in local politics/land use now, this type of guy is very common. Zoning is very frequently misused, but man a lot of people really regret not having it when they need it. There are so many developers who will just shrug their shoulders and open a landfill next to a wedding venue that's been operating as a small business for 40 years. Never mind that it just destroyed the wedding venue's business because no one wants to get married next to a pile of garbage. It's only really an issue when communities use zoning to suppress all types of development, rather than channel it to places that sense with traffic, sewer/water connections, and compatible neighboring land use.
This is a regular occurrence across Indiana. Developers ask for forgiveness rather than permission and they always get away with a slap on the wrist. It's often up to the neighbors to save the day by calling out any construction before it begins, or even worse, demolition. Just recently there was an old historic barn in Indianapolis that had three separate demolition crews hired to tear it down across a single day, seemingly with the goal of "if the first one gets caught, the others can tear it down." Luckily the neighbors stopped it, because the barn is cool AF. If they had succeeded they would have paid a fine that the developers definitely just budgeted in.
I'm going to need a ruling on some carne asada fries too.
I shall be the custodian of the evidence.
Well he sounds like a gem.
As much as I do like his original business - and I still hold their 5-years ago green salsa in my heart as it's not been the same since the pandemic - the stretching of truth he's gone through is just tedious and dumb and annoying.
I don’t see why any reason why tacos shouldn’t be sandwiches. It’s ingredients on bread.
Or corn tortillas.
A tortilla is a flatbread, no matter what it’s made of
I thought to myself how can corn be bread, then I laughed lool
Corn bread? Now you're just talking crazy talk!
What's next, corned beef? Put that on your corn bread with some corn cheese to make yourself a corn sandwich? Get a side of corn chips and wash it down with some corn soda?
And what about dessert? Caramel corn?
Why isn’t it bread? Explain to me how flatbread using maize flour doesn’t count
Are Doritos and Fritos considered bread? After all they are tortilla chips.
Doritos are like pita chips. They are chips made out of pieces of bread.
Or pretzels. You can make gigantic soft pretzels that are definitely bread. Or you can make little tiny crispy ones that are chips.
And there are those little Gardetto rye chips. And the tiny loaves of bread that really crunchy that they sell in the cheese aisle.
And crackers are unleavened bread. Cheezits cheesy crackers sold in the chip aisle
The difference between a chip and bread is more preparation than ingredients.
Now that I think about it... should cornbread even be considered bread? It's more in the same category as pancakes, and I wouldn't call that bread.
Cornbread is practically an unglazed pound cake fr
Now that I think about it... should cornbread even be considered bread? It's more in the same category as pancakes, and I wouldn't call that bread.
tf are you calling corn bread?
When I make corn bread, it's a loaf of bread. I slice it like bread, then butter it, like bread. The next day, I put the slices in the toaster and make tiny toast from it. Sometimes I'll take the stale corn bread, cut it into cubes and oil it up and bake to make croutons, or mix it with sugar, milk, and eggs to make corn bread pudding. Though, I think most people make it Pac Man style in a cast iron skillet.
I mean, yeah a lot of good corn bread has tons of sugar it in, but to be fair, most of the white bread Americans eat is so loaded with sugar that it's classified as cake in other countries.
Where I'm from, corn bread pancakes are johnny cakes.
Cornbread in my household is made in a cast iron skillet.
The bread comes out like a pound cake and it's sliced like one. If you tried to put it in the toaster you'd just have a crumbled mess in the bottom of your toaster.
A taco is a hot dog, and a hot dog is not a sandwich
There is no element of a hot dog that is not a sandwich. Its meat and other toppings in fresh bread. It is a sausage sandwich, with a specific style of sausage.
Hot dogs are a type of taco. Not all tacos are hot dogs.
A hot dog is an open faced sandwich in which the singular bread extends and wraps the filling slightly
A taco is just a wrap with smaller bread and a wrap is a jus a burrito
But is a hot dog a sandwich, or a taco?
I love everything about this case
Why should there be so much red tape in the first place?
Big Sandwich is getting too powerful in this country.
Big Sandwich is nobody’s hero.
I think the strip mall rule was that only sandwiches could be served in it. Therefore turning the Taco and Burrito into a sandwich so they could open there?
And if wraps count as sandwiches, there’s zero reason not to include them
But what are tortas then?
Open face club
Delicious
So is this why so many taco trucks?
Shenanigans beget shenanigans.
That's a sandwich style taco.
Hot dogs are American style tacos.
Ok, see this is the kind of discourse I want to see hashed out :D
I think we need a constitutional amendment on this.
Then corn dogs are American Wellingtons.
wellingtons are british style cordon bleu
Cordon bleu is just a French hot pocket
You motherfucker. You've finally answered the question. I can finally die a satisfied man.
I'm pretty sure the Reagan administration declared hot dogs to be vegetables
A sandwich-style Mexican-style sandwich?
All tacos are sandwich styles now.
What about the huarache??? Is that just a Mexican-style Reuben style sandwich????
That’s the Mexican shoe-taco which is classified a sandwich now because of this ruling
And a flauta?
These rules were decided years ago. cuberule.com
ETA: I do want to say this website went off the rails since I saw it.. I feel like it was a decade ago... maybe it was a different site.
Forgive me if I may, the cube rule sets forth that a key lime pie is a quiche, and a slice of pumpkin pie is a toast. At what point does a sliced quiche become a toast? Is it once sliced it, it becomes two toasts?
And what of the Apple pie? It becomes a taco when it’s a slice, but surely it’s a calzone when whole?
It needs revision. Deep dish pizza is still quiche when sliced, a whole pumpkin pie is quiche, but a slice of pie is toast?
It's severely outdated. It's already been 4 years since the discovery of hypersandwiches nested within salads. https://youtu.be/vJZsH8Dsf8U?si=MK7QAQYQvB0KIsGp
category: toast. example: sushi
also, category: sushi. example: enchiladas and pigs in a blanket. (example sushi item not included: actual sushi)
I enjoy arguments about silly stuff but the cube rule sucks. There's glaring holes in it, like how sushi isn't sushi, or a club sandwich is a cake. It only got traction because the name and diagrams make it look well thought out. I'm in it for arguments that make you go "This feels really wrong but I can't see a flaw in the logic", not arbitrary BS.
Well, apparently no one thought to submit this evidence to court. Court ruling supercedes meme.
Please, tell him of the torta de tamal.
If she's not a Torta no me importa!
And a cemita
Torta's are in shambles
Am I just a joke to you?
- Tortas
Fun fact: In Hungarian torta is the word for cake.
It's also the word for cake in Spanish everywhere but Mexico lol
Torta really just means layers at the end of the day and boy do I love Mexican layers
You mean a Mexican burger?
Now we know why California and Texas were aligned in Civil War.
If they didn't want chain restaurants why didn't they just make that the rule?
Because that also has semantic nuance in it.
Most people think of "chain restaurants" as things like McDonalds, Taco Hell, Red Lobster, Cheddar's, etc.
But what about a local restaurant with two locations? Is that a "chain"? Technically, probably, but I think most people wouldn't group that in with Taco Hell. What about three locations? Ten? When does it become undesirable because of its chain-ness?
This thread has a disappointing lack of "torta reform" jokes.
I mean they pretty much are if you think about it from the purpose perspective. It's using a starch base to house ingredients so that they can be eaten by hand.
I fully agree with this even though it sounds goofy to put it that way. Especially within this context where it would allow sandwich shops but not a taco/burrito shop in an establishment.
Yeah, this is one of those posts where it sounds stupid when you just read the title and don't watch the video.
Within this specific context it should definitely fall into the "sandwich" category for being allowed to exist in the space.
So a hotdog is a sandwich?
And an ice cream cone?
A hot dog is just tubular bologna. If you didn’t slice bologna, you could make a big hot dog.
That is one big hit dog
Then slicing hot dogs is just making tiny bologna slices.
For all intents and purposes a hotdog is a sandwich. The debate over that little bit of bread that isn’t fully sliced is stupid. For example you have open faced sandwiches that only use one slice of bread but nobody says they aren’t sandwiches.
Same with sub sandwiches, they are also a hinged bread (not all the times), and you still call it a sandwich.
Just think of it as anything that is handfood, food that doesn't require a plate or bowl or utensils to eat. It doesn't matter if it is a sandwich, that is where they made their mistake trying to be specific, it's just "handfood".
open faced sandwiches that only use one slice of bread but nobody says they aren’t sandwiches.
I would say they aren't. However sandwich is a very loose term. I have a friend who calls a burger a sandwich which I also disagree with. It really depends on our cultural history what we deem to be a sandwich or not. for me being between two slices of bread is important. If you use a bread roll, for me it is not a sandwich.
A hot dog is actually a very soft taco
But a corndog is a loaf
Corndog is the same family of calzone, hot pocket, empanada, etc -- a wellington
Which I believe are types of dumplings.
Yes
What's meaningfully the difference between a hotdog in a bun and a hot dog between two slices of bread (which I think most people would definitely consider a sandwich)?
Ice cream cone is cold soup served on an edible bowl.
Hot dogs are sandwiches, yes.
Don't forget sushi!
Sushi is sushi but Nigiri is a taco?
Yes, a hot dog is a sandwich
A hotdog is a German-style sandwich!
I mean, would you consider a sub a sandwhich? A hotdog is basically that but with worse bread and worse fillings. (fight me)
A hotdog is a taco
You might even say a hotdog is a wiener that is sandwiched between two sides of a bun.
In respect to the law they were ruling on, they ruled a taco shop was more like made-to-order sandwich shop than a fast food restaurant.
Is a pie a sandwich? A sausage roll?
A sandwich has the starch on 2 opposite sides. A taco has it on 3 sides, with the middle side facing down, so you can use ingredients that wouldn't work well in a sandwich and would spill out the sides.
They create a rule to keep out fast food chains and sue a locally owned restaurant on a technicality.
Just raise the rent to an absurd number like all the other scumbag landlords and save the taxpayers money.
Strip mall owner is the taco shop owner. See https://old.reddit.com/r/videos/comments/1cvx3fu/tacos_are_mexicanstyle_sandwiches_judge_rules_in/l4t9346/
/u/blazze_eternal - "This came to me in a dream"
Seriously, this has zero at all to do with fast food or scumbag landlords... he IS the landlord, and the owner of the taco shop.
A lot of you need to read up on the Cube Rule again.
Pigs in a blanket = sushi
Oh, that’s not the problem. I’m also fine with poptart = ravioli, and I’m definitely with cheesecake = quiche.
The problem is classifying that a steak = salad.
That’s the fucking structural/ingredient anarchy that we should be focusing on combating.
You're absolutely right, its madness.
CLEARLY steak is by definition, Meat Toast.
This dogmatic thinking will lead us to ruin
You are free to interpret the nature of rice as you wish.
I KNEW steak was a salad!
The cube rule is just rage bait. Toast is second-cooked bread, not a particular layout of starch, and everyone involved knows that.
Not only that but toast, taco and bread bowl are all homeomorphic, meaning that a taco is toast until you fold the taco and, if you drop it, it becomes toast again.
A stupid joke that gets repeated seriously and we should all be above it.
Idk if Indiana should be weighing in on Mexican food
I’m in a crowded bar, anybody wanna explain the context/effect of this decision? I know I’ll forget to come back to this thread.
little strip mall had a rule limiting businesses to only sell hand made sandwiches in order to keep national franchises out (for some reason?)
local taco joint was denied entry because they didn't make sandwiches, judge said they did so now they can make their tacos in peace
Fuck yeah
But like that doesn’t even work does it? Subway is still a hand made sandwich…
Very stupid rule to begin with
give it a listen, it didn't make sense to me either but maybe i heard it wrong
I didn't like thinking of them as "Mexican style sandwiches" but I support this ruling 100%.
i guess a torta would be the real mexican sandwich but honestly i could go either way with this ruling. feels like splitting hairs here and it's all just made up words anyway.
rule limiting businesses to only sell hand made sandwiches in order to keep national franchises out (for some reason?)
I wonder what national franchises they meant to exclude? Sit-down steakhouses? KFC? Panda Express?
Subway, McDonalds, Burger King, Wendy's, etc. all make sandwiches.
Fun fact: In the US, tomatoes are legally a vegetable.
Where are we on milk soup, most commonly known as cereal?
So that settles it for hotdogs too then I take it
Your move, hot dog non-sandwichers
since we are on the subject, i've always wondered ... is Onigiri the Japanese version of a sandwich?
by version i mean equivalent.
its handheld, its compact, it can be a snack or main meal,
it is a base with a filler and can have toppers/sauces
Closer to an empanada or calzone imo. Starch fully enclosing something else.
Yes, because we should listen to Indiana about what a taco is. /s
I will be referencing this legal ruling in all of my future discussions about the sandwich alignment chart .
Ah yes Indiana the authority on Mexican food!
A historic day in the field of law
But tacos were in existence before sandwiches!
Haters are going to hate but let me say that sandwiches are American-style tacos
Only if you fold one slice into a U
American? You really gonna do the 4th Earl of Sandwich dirty like that?
He's been adopted postmortem.
I hate Indiana
And thus the seed for the next Civil War was planted.
Mexican style shawarma
Cool
Indiana? Objection! This judge is out of his jurisdiction.
In Indiana, this is important.
Dammit! Now I want tacos!
Taco Tuesday out.
Mexican-style sandwich Mondays in.
Sandwiches are American style tacos
I often make my restaurant meals in tortillas ( tacos) instead of ciabattas, panini, or burger buns because the others is too much bread
the gall of this man.
From my point of view, the Jedi are evil!
MY TAX DOLLAZ!!!
Would be fun to hear the judge chime in on the grilled cheese subreddit topics
I hope you realize, this means that bologna sandwiches are...tacos
This contradicts a 2006 Massachusetts ruling: https://stuartkaplow.com/legal-library/real-estate-law/court-rules-burrito-not-sandwich/
So,.. McDonalds is technically an "American-style sandwich outlet?" I'm sure they'd argue that their filling between 2 pieces of bread is not a simple sandwich. They'd argue that their burgers are on burger buns, making them not sandwiches, which would counter this judge's rather weird judgement.
Uh oh. The state of Massachusetts ruled a couple years ago that “A sandwich is not commonly understood to include burritos, tacos, and quesadillas”. I guess the Supreme Court is going to have to settle this now.
This tracks. I once lived in Southern IN, where a saucy meat hoagie is called a “Stromboli” smh…
I kinda get that you dont want national chains in a strip malll but the rule about sandwiches is a dumb way to do it. Even though I do think the taco place should go in, I disagree with the reason I here by refer to the cube rule of food identification https://www.reddit.com/r/coolguides/comments/ri0kvs/the_cube_rule_of_food_identification/ .
So if I put peanut butter and jelly on one slice of bread and then fold it over instead of adding a second slice, that's not a peanut butter and jelly sandwich, that's a taco?
holy fuck is that a good argument and good question.
No that's a turnover. Tacos are on flat breads; If someone ever offered you a taco in a big puffy bread envelope you'd ask what it was. Also tacos are supposed to at least intend to be open; A folded pbj is closed.
Homie needs to officially rule on hotdogs next, settle that shit once and for all.
or is sandwich a mall-taco?
Have you ever wondered the answer to the big question: "How many sandwiches are in a salad"? Well, now you can find out.
sounds good 🙌🙌🙌
Written and fact-checked by The Editors of Encyclopaedia BritannicaLast Updated: Apr 1, 2024 • Article Historyclub sandwichSee all mediaRelated Topics: French dip cheesesteak hoagie Reuben sandwich smørrebrødSee all related content →
Sandwich, in its basic form, slices of meat, cheese, or other food placed between two slices of bread.
I think the "quirky controversy" of this ruling is ignoring the fact that...
legally allowing fast food companies to dictate their competition, to the point of calling a small mom and pop taco shop a sandwich in order to get them removed —
Is not only FUCKED UP, it's anti capitalism (which I thought we loved here in the US)
Is a Crustable a dumpling?
I mean, I guess I'm glad that a local business was able to get a spot in a popular area, especially at the expense of a national franchise/brand, but....
tacos are not sandwiches.
They came for hotdogs and I said nothing, for I was not a hotdog.