My (30M) gf (35F) is pushing to get engaged but I'm happy with things the way they are. What do I do?

My gf and I have been together for about 5 years now. I love her a lot and I've never been happier in my entire life. And to me that seems like the whole point, we are extremely happy, so why change anything? However, she really wants to get married and has been bringing up me proposing...a lot.

It seems like marriage is a lot of boring money-related risk with no upside. And TBH, all the risk is on my end more or less, because I earn a lot more than she does (although she will probably inherit a lot of money one day, and has never been super motivated to make a huge amount of money because of this.) I know some but not all of this can be mitigated with a prenup which I would definitely insist on if we did get engaged.

Is there a different way to look at it that will make me feel more motivated to propose and get married? What are the upsides that I'm not realizing? Or should I just do it because she wants it even if I don't personally really see the advantages to doing it?

tl;dr: gf really wants to get married. I don't. What do I do?

in relationship_adviceby ThrowRAPomegranatest

33%

23d

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23d

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MichiganMainer

23d

My only advice is to think deeper about what marriage is. Your comment “boring money-related risk with no upside” is not how most people view marriage. I just celebrated 37 years with the same person. Sure, there have been bumps. But I am so happy that I didn’t take the easy path and marriage connections and vows were in place. Marriage can be hard, but more often it’s beautiful. You need to reflect on your cynicism and what gets you to that analysis. Stay single if you want. But most long-term partners want this final commitment. So you are being kind of unreasonable wanting a long-term relationship without commitment or risk.

JoyfulSong246

23d

Exactly - OP, do the work to figure out what marriage means to you now, and what you WANT a marriage to be (or want it at all). Then you need to hope your gf has done that work and you can have a conversation (or many) about what marriage means to each of you, and whether you can be on the same page.

Also think about whether your current gf is just a “good enough for now” relationship. That’s probably what your gf is afraid of, and you should address that, at least in your own mind.

ThrowRAPomegranatest

-6

23d

I already feel completely committed to her. It is hard for me to understand why marriage would be a change there. But I am trying.

MichiganMainer

23d

Because marriage is a strong bond that keeps people from making short term decisions. 2. Symbols are more than symbols. Marriage is symbolic. 3. Religious or not, marriage vows said in front of friends and family are mystical, beautiful and bind people together very tightly. 4. Right or wrong, many government policies are oriented around marriage and married couples. Taxes, social security, Medicare, all have financial impacts related to marriage status. 5. The person you say you are completely committed to, finds marriage important and she wants it. And she is in the vast majority.

Again, reflect. You are in the3 vast minority. Vast minorities are often mis-guided. If you are commitment phobic, admit it and give your GF a chance to find her path. Don’t hold on so long that she sacrifices to the utmost. It’s not fair or loving. Again, reflect and decide. But your reflection should be about your own issues around money, commitment, fear, whatever. But you put out into the Universe, frankly, that money drives your life planning more than love and commitment. And to me….well, that’s a very sad way to live a life.

ThrowRAPomegranatest

-1

23d

I am trying very hard to reflect, that was the point of this post. All things considered, marriage is not a good financial decision for me. However, if I have to make a choice between love vs. money, meaning I have to marry her to stay in the relationship, I choose love.

I wish I did not have to make the choice, though, as I am very in love and committed right now, without exposing myself to major financial risk.

MichiganMainer

23d

I guess we just have different outlooks. Money never once came to mind when I asked my wife to marry me. And even now you look at this as a competition between love and money. It just isn’t. Shit happens in life for sure. People get divorced; no doubt. But over the years, you will make a million decisions that will either help or hurt your financial situation. I bought a business once. I was a 8 figure millionaire on paper for 5 years. Then 2009 hit and I got out with nothing. And yet, today, I look back with only good thoughts on that decision, for all the other benefits to my life it created. Experience and relationships that have helped me ever since.

Marriage is a decision. Why should this decision be guaranteed? Banks don’t guarantees the value of a house when you get a mortgage. Employeers don’t guarantee life-time employment. And there is no guarantee, if you have kids, that they will be healthy. I have a daughter struggling with cancer, and a son with chronic kidney disease and already his first transplant before 30. I have been supporting them financially, willingly and without a single care in the world. Love trumps money every time.

I am not trying to be mean here. But man, you are way too focused on money. Happiness, character, love, loyalty, kindness, niceness, humor, commitment…..there are a million things more important than money. And this is coming from a serial entrepreneur who has done very well financially. But I see my financial success as an outcome, not a goal. My wife has been there every step of the way supporting my business goals. Even when we almost went bankrupt. My success stems from others; I believe this and it has come true.

You say you are trying to reflect. But you keep coming back to money. I guess I will end with…..good luck with that.

MbMinx

23d

If she were critically injured in the hospital, you would have no right to see her, speak to her doctor, or consult on her care - because you are not legally married. She could die, and they would have no obligation to tell you anything. Same for her if you were injured.

That's only one of the major legal protections married people have.

Why do you think marriage changes your relationship? Between the two of you, all it means is that you've committed to stay together. Unless you don't want to commit, in which case you should tell her and break it off so she can find someone who does want to stay with her.

ThrowRAPomegranatest

23d

That's exactly my point though. Marriage doesn't change the things that matter about our relationship. The love, intimacy, connection, etc. Everything that matters to me, we already have. It does change the financial obligations, which is exactly my hesitation.

I also am not sure your facts are correct. We have both dealt with medical issues and were able to see each other in the hospital and speak with each others' doctors. I couldn't override the wishes of her next of kin (parents) but I also can't imagine a scenario where I would want to do that.

FatSadHappy

23d

Tell her you don’t want to get married. Yes , there is a risk she will walk away

Kinniekawa

23d

For a lot of women marriage is a huge deal. Its the meaning behind it all. Even if its just a paper to you, its a sign to her that you are willing to love and cherish her forever, as well as commit your life to her. Marriage is something a lot of little girls dream of. Lack of marriage is also a deal breaker for a lot of women. Thus you should consider carefully how important not being married is to you or else she might find someone who will marry her. Finally: clearly SHE is not happy with this relationship how it is because its bothering her and she keeps bringing it up. Even if you are fine with the status quo, she is not, and that needs to be discussed.

PlantaSorusRex

23d

I mean the only thing you can do is talk to her, try to come to a compromise y'all are both happy with, or go your separate ways.

ThrowRAPomegranatest

-9

23d

Yeah that does seem to be how most of these relationship questions go. Thanks for the advice.

advocatadiaboli

23d

I've never been happier in my entire life. And to me that seems like the whole point, we are extremely happy,

Love how you're here asking about something that's upsetting your girlfriend, and yet you're still thinking "I'm happy" means "we're happy!"

Consider that YOU feeling fulfilled and happy in this relationship, as it is right now, does not mean your girlfriend is feeling equally fulfilled and happy. For her, something is lacking. I'm not saying you have to get married—that's your choice. But you need to approach this question with the understanding that the status quo is not as ideal for her as it is for you.

You're here asking Reddit why you should want to get married... Have you asked her why she wants to get married?

WildlyUninteresting

23d

Does she know you feel this way?

This is a 4+ year old conversation about expectations and goals. Why wasn’t itn happening then?

ThrowRAPomegranatest

-6

23d

Yeah we've talked about it a lot.

WildlyUninteresting

23d

Then why would she expect marriage from you?

Are you telling her what she wants to hear instead of the truth?

ThrowRAPomegranatest

-9

23d

My position has never been that I absolutely refuse to get married. At the end of the day if she gave me an ultimatum that I had to marry her to stay together I think I would do it. I just am not feeling any excitement or drive to do it and that's really what I'm looking for advice on.

sabreyna

23d

And does she know that the only way for you to marry her is an ultimatum?

Because it doesn't seem like it.

ThrowRAPomegranatest

23d

It's not at all the only way...I didn't really expect these kinds of comments. I am still working through how I think and feel about this, I would definitely prefer to understand better the positive sides of marriage, and that is the kind of advice I was hoping to get. I am feeling like the comments are criticizing me for having made up my mind not to marry her, which isn't the case. I wonder if I wrote the post wrong or confusingly, because all of the comments seem to be very convinced that I've made up my mind and can't change, when what I am looking for is a way to change my mind. Maybe I should just delete this.

sabreyna

23d

The way you wrote it it does seems like your mind is at least 97% made up. It also seems like she thinks sooner or later you'll definitely marry her 100%.

Which is why you get criticized.

But to answer your question about the upsides of marriage (but it really depends where you're from):

Financial benefits -> less taxes, depending on the country some insurance benefits, more benefits if one of you dies

Medical benefits -> if you have an accident and end up half-dead in a coma, your gf won't be able to advocate for you at all. She has zero say, even if you habe been together for 40 years and told her exactly want you want to happen to you in such a case. They'll listen to your wife though.

Easier to bring up kids -> f.e adoption

Happier life -> your gfs end goal is clearly marriage. It would make her happy. You already know prenuptial exist. So why not do this for her? Happy wife, happy life after all.

sabreyna

23d

Maybe just ask on askmen/ask reddit about the benefits of marriage. No futher details.

bioinfintraining

23d

you will resent her for the challenges marriage brings, just let her find someone who wants to spend the rest of his life with her.

ThrowRAPomegranatest

-4

23d

I definitely want to spend the rest of my life with her, I just am struggling with the idea of marriage. We already have the love, romance, intimacy, connection... adding laws about money into it doesn't add anything valuable to me.

bioinfintraining

23d

the quiet part is that those risks are not worth the benefits of committing to your girlfriend. I'm sure when you find the one or get older, you find someone who is worth all those risks. You already have grey feet, don't get her hopes up if you are not committed.

WildlyUninteresting

23d

There is no way you told her that or she would have made the ultimatum or left.

Why would she expect marriage otherwise?

You are not a good person saying threaten me and I might marry you. I doesn’t show real love or commitment. It shows apathy and willingness to settle for anything.

It’s really rude towards her.

There is no event where the other person says, force me and I will do it but my heart isn’t in it; with good results.

ThrowRAPomegranatest

23d

Ok, thanks for the feedback.

Sensitive-World7272

23d

Have you told her it’s not happening and that, if she wants to be married, she needs to find another partner because you don’t think that you would benefit from marriage?

ThrowRAPomegranatest

-6

23d

No, that's not really how I think about it so I wouldn't say that to her.

MbMinx

23d

But you obviously don't see any benefit to getting married, so maybe you should tell her that.

ThrowRAPomegranatest

23d

I have told her that.

RoughNaive404

23d

How do people stay in these long-term relationships and never have a conversation about important topics such as marriage or kids? I will never understand. Has she always known she wanted to be married? Have you told her you don’t believe in marriage? Marriage is important to women as it gives them a sense of security and stability and it is beneficial for men, married men do better at life than their unmarried counterparts. Getting married would make her happy and making her happy makes you happy. Do you really wanna be 45 years old saying “I’m living with my girlfriend” ? The only reason you don’t want to get married is so you always have one foot out the door and can run away once you find someone better.

agressive_panties

23d

Boy does this hit home, so take what I’ve got to say with a grain of salt.

I’m very close in age to your girlfriend and been in a relationship for about 1/2 the amount of time you’ve been with your SO, and some days I feel at my wits end that things aren’t progressing the way I’d like them too. I’ve had to step back and do a lot of emotional regulation over how my relationship isn’t progressing on the time line I had hoped, but because I love him and want to be with him, I’ve compromised and am giving him more time to sort out his feelings. At some point, the amount of time I’m willing to give (because like your gf, I want marriage too) will run out. It’ll be the same for her, or she’ll stick around until either she, you, or both of you becomes so unhappy that the relationship ends. I don’t want to have to give an ultimatum to be married. I want to marry someone who is as excited about the idea of being with me forever as I am about it, and most women feel the same way.

A lot of this depends on conversations you’ve already had. I saw in another comment where you said that you’ve never been against getting married exactly, just lacking the motivation to do it because you feel like everything is great as-is. You also expressed the concern about what financial fallout there would be if it didn’t work out.

If she’s anything like me, her clock is ticking and her time to settle down and have a family is running out. I don’t know if you both wish to be child-free or if you’ve ever discussed that, but if you two as a couple haven’t already agreed that children are completely off of the table, she’s liking viewing it this way. Generally, women of this age start thinking about how they are starting to age and their window to have these things is closing, and it’s compounded by the fact that the dating pool is seemingly only getting more and more shallow. She’s been with you for 5 years of her “prime” and is coming towards the end of her “fertile years” at 35. As it is now, she’d be considered a geriatric mother. Unmarried women who desire these things at this age start to really feel the weight of time, which is likely why she’s been bringing it up more frequently. She could be looking at you and thinking: “I’ve spent 5 years putting in the work in hopes of having these things and our relationship is good, so why isn’t he committing if he wants to be with me?”. Five years is a long time to be with someone and not be interested in taking the next step.

If your concerns are financial, gently bring up the topic of a prenup. I’d be fine with one, but not every woman feels this way and a lot of it has to do with how it’s presented. No one wants to talk about the possibility of divorce when you’re wanting to get married, but the rate of divorce is so high now that it really should be discussed.

By your own admission, you say you’ve never been happier and that it’s just a lack of motivation. If it’s not that you don’t want to be married, then think about what this means to her. She sees this as a sign of your commitment to her, that you’ll always be there to love, cherish, and support her in all things. And her for you. It’s what most women grow up dreaming of. Let that be your motivation - you’re giving the woman who has never made your life more happy and fulfilling her dream of spending the rest of her life with you. And really, what changes? It’s a piece of paper that gives you tax advantages and nothing between you two as a couple really changes.

If you do decide to propose, please please please do it before she issues an ultimatum. She will never forget that she had to force you to make this decision and no woman wants to feel like she is having to drag her intended to the alter. It’s a seed to breed resentment for a lot of women: “well, he never would have asked me if I hadn’t forced him to” is not a good way to start off a marriage.

She has made her desires known. It’s now up to you to decide what to do with that knowledge. If you decide to propose, make it special and tailored to her. This is, after all, something she has been dreaming about and a half-ass proposal is only going to make her think you’re doing it begrudgingly.

ThrowRAPomegranatest

23d

My concerns are 100% financial. I will definitely insist on a prenup (that is non-negotiable to me). There are some things that prenups cannot protect though. If I could somehow have the emotional commitment of marriage without the financial obligation I would do it in a second. (But I feel in my mind that I already have that.)

agressive_panties

23d

So would it be fair to say that you’re viewing this as a risk vs. reward scenario then?

ThrowRAPomegranatest

23d

I guess so, is there some implication to that I'm not understanding? I think every major decision in life is made by balancing pros and cons, no?

agressive_panties

23d

Fair enough, and yes, but a lot of women don’t see it exactly that way. Yes, we look for a compatible partner but she’s been with you for 5 years and has already decided she’d like to marry you. She sees it as being worth the risk. Right now, you don’t seem to. We don’t necessarily compartmentalize it like men do. She’s looking at it like she’s decided you’re the one, and it seems like you’ve decided you’d be ok to marry her buuuuut “what if”. Which is valid, but it’s holding you back from taking the next step and could be the reason (in an otherwise fulfilling relationship) that it ends.

So what it really sounds like needs to happen here is some introspection and a conversation about a prenup. Some questions to maybe ask yourself are: Has she ever given you any indication she wouldn’t be fair in the event of a divorce? Is she generally a fair person or does she show signs of vindictiveness? Is she bad with money? Does she have a large amount of outstanding debt or rely heavily on you to foot the financial burden? How do you do finances now and is that an agreement you are both willing to continue or would one of you like to change some certain aspect? What are you concerned about in the event of a divorce that a prenup wouldn’t protect you against?

She is viewing this as a decision based in emotion, which to a certain degree is required, and it looks like you are being a bit more pragmatic. That’s not to say your approach is wrong. You should be sensible about it because it is a major decision. Really, I think you just need to pin down the exact concerns you have, and then sit her down for a conversation where you emphasize how much you love her and how happy you are, but with today’s climate you have X concerns that you’d like to discuss before a proposal and go from there.

ThrowRAPomegranatest

23d

But all the risk is on my end. She does not earn enough to financially support herself and has no plan to change that. She has a safety net (family money) and I do not. It is a financially risky decision on my part. I wish that I had a life where I could not care about money but I do not. (She does.)

agressive_panties

23d

She may not be taking the same risks as you, but she is still taking risks. Marriage is a gamble for both parties and you seem to be coming from a place where you feel like you’d be investing more and are the only one with anything to lose based purely on finances. There’s more to it than that. I don’t know the fine details of your lives, but she’s already placed a bet of 5 years of her life on you. If it doesn’t work out, she’s lost those years. In your mid-30’s, those years become more important for women.

If she has family money and you two are married, then presumptively, unless you have a prenup or her parents will it to her in a way that excludes you from accessing the “family money”, then that’d be money she’d have to invest in you two as a couple. That’s a risk on her part. She potentially has “family money” to lose if it doesn’t work out.

By all means, if you don’t want to get married then don’t, but be prepared for her to feel like you’ve strung her along for the last 5 years because none of this is new information to you, right? And you still chose to date her knowing this information and have known for what sounds like quite some time, that she wants to be married.

I’ll be honest, it sounds like you just don’t want to marry her and want all of the perks of having a girlfriend who is a committed partner in every way except in an official capacity. It sends the message of having one foot in and one foot out. That is a big deal-breaker for most women, and after 5 years, you owe it to be her to be honest and allow her to have all of the information she needs to make the decision if she still wants to be in this or not if you’re never going to give that to her. It sounds like it’s sh*t or get off of the pot time hun.

Talk to her.

Trap_Cubicle5000

23d

She wants someone who loves her so much that getting married is a no-brainer. The fact that you hesitate and have to weigh the pros and cons before you'll consider it, or force her to issue an ultimatum in order for it to happen, sounds to her like you don't care about or love her enough.

It's not supposed to be this difficult of a decision - you're hesitating because the truth is you don't want to get married. And you're trying to waffle by saying "No no I do love her and want to spend the rest of my life with her, I just think she might leave me and take all my money if we get married that's all." But if you think she's going to do that, you don't love or trust her as much as she loves and trusts you. It's an incompatibility.

Her pressuring you into it is probably not how she wants to get married either. You should let her go to be with someone who wants the same things she wants.

There are women out there who don't care about marriage and don't want to be married. You should seek out one of them.

Thinking_Machine1

23d

If you don’t want to get married but will want to be with her, you need to be honest and open with her about it. Essentially, marriage is just a piece of paper and it doesn’t change the love that you have for one another.

Oohkbutnotokay

23d

No one is owed marriage. You do not reach a threshold where you must now consent simply because its a common social expectation and it overwrites your desire to not be so. You are not compelled to explain why, just the same as if someone in a relationship with you does not want to do things you would like.

The problem here is more than that though. You know well how much she wants it and you resist being clear because you fear to lose her. You likely will regardless. Some people want their ‘special day’ more than many normal, though still great, days that you are offering. That is their choice. Respect it.

The longer you go on being intentionally vague, hoping she will ‘get over it’, the crueler you are being. I get the idea of why change a great thing, but for something so important to her, thats not your call.

Talk to her, be honest. Dont cave because then you will be the one not living an authentic life. If you search yourself and find you could change that desire for her, by all means do so, but such a change needs to come soon. No more dragging it out.

MoistReindeer4846

-1

23d

She is at an age where her stock price is falling. You’re at an age where your stock price is rising. Decide if you want to keep her or lose her. If you’re OK losing her, keep things the way they are and she will realize soon she needs to move on to find forever before her stock no longer will yield the results she wants.

qxluM

-12

23d

That’s what SHE wants, and that’s fine most women want that too. But what do you want? Does she require you spend thousands as a way to illustrate your love for her? Always been a stupid idea to me personally. Put that money to good use. Invest it. Start a business. Buy your dream car. Marriage is just as materialistic.

2 missing replies