And i cant help but wonder that if Stassi, Kristen & Jax didnt get fired/ leave after Season 8… would Tom and Rachel pulled off Scandoval?? I feel like the only reason Rachel got a chance was because those people were gone and they needed a story. I just think Stassi and Jax are too observant. It would’ve been called out sooner or they wouldnt have attempted at all. Thoughts?
I forgot about Kristens dedication to proving her points about Tom!! I also question if Tom stepped into this villainous era because the spot was vacant due to Jax’s exit
No Tom has always been a villain and he’s worked hard to hide it. It was just a lot easier to keep it under wraps when jax was around taking all the attention for being the absolute worst
Agreed, I think its an overt vs covert narc situation and jax is so clearly an overt narc. Tom cultivated his image WELL for a decade (as many coverts are able to do) but with the affair the masked fully slipped. Hes trying to pull it back on now, desperately!
Yeah maybe more than anyone, Tom really hasn’t changed at all over the course of the show.
Agreed. Also, I think because Jax is more open about his assholeism and has an obvious pattern. And went through so many partners we could see it. Where as Tim picks long term relationships to hide is assholery.
True. I did try the Valley and I'm shocked at how much Jax has changed. He seems more mature. Brittany is drinking more than him and he seems the one that's more responsible in that marriage. He also seems like a great Father.
I don’t even think he was hiding it I just think people were distracted by how open villainous and shitty Jax was.
Agreed. The focus was always on how shtty Jax was even though Tom was doing shtty things too. Tom had more people protecting him/translating for him.
And Tom spent a lot of time highlighting Jax’s shittyness to distract from himself (Tom started doing that after Jax was confirming that Miami girl was telling the truth if I remember correctly) and at some point I think Tom started buying his own bullshit because very few said anything about his behavior.
Thou art a villian!
After this season of the Valley, I feel like Kristen will get a call to do House of Villains. She would even do really well on Traitors!
I would loveee to see Kristen on Traitors 🦋
I'm gonna start this GOAT show she is on, I wonder if it's any good. I used to love Tosh.0
I was going to say Stassi was good, but Kristen has nothing she won't do to find the truth. They would have def figured it out. Told Jax in confidence and of course he would spill it.
And how good Kristen was at sleuthing and digging up dirt!
Multiple people clocked it and were talking about it. Scheana even approached Ariana about it.
Did she? All I remember is Scheana telling other people that she would have trusted Rachel alone with Brock at 1 am at a dance club
Yes, it happened off camera in real life when all of them were speculating. Ariana shut it down. It came up a lot, including at the first reunion after
The difference is Kristen would have come with proof haha. She would have had his Uber receipts or something and somehow got into this man’s iCloud and solved it all
On that note… how did Scheener not know if she had everyone’s locations tracked?
Does anyone else find the location stalking creepy in the first place? The fact that she outed Katie and Max pissed me off...
Rachel turned off her location, again this was covered as a reason Scheana was suspicious
She also said she would have trusted Rachel in bed with her husband... and the 3 of them have slept in bed together... with Scheana in the middle.
Lala and Ally called it early. It wasn’t a lack of people being suspicious, it’s just that they weren’t caught red handed until Tom’s phone fell out of his pocket.
I actually think it is insane that they (producers- as they claim) didn’t go back and edit.
Which means that during Lala’s bday party, when Katie tells Tom Sandoval: “I think you enjoy Raquel as well. Late night, dancing together at the Abbey, alone?” …..no one really wanted to keep following up on that? Beyond even when Ariana said she trusts Tom and Raquel? If I was on the cast I’d be 🕵️♀️ and literally following them around to catch them being weird.
And if we had never found out about the affair…. That would’ve just been let go?! Umm what?
Yup. Did production even ask tom or rachel about it in their confessionals either? They would have worked with Tom’s plan to make Ariana look like a villain and then bringing Rachel in as the new gf while covering for him cheating. Truly despicable producers. They did the same thing with Tom and Ariana cheating on Kristen. Literally god knows what else they covered the men for.
Ugh, I fucking love Kristen. 😮💨
Same here. She is THE reason I watch The Valley. I have missed her messiness.
She has a lot of hate, and I don’t share it, haha. There is something so genuine about her. Her messiness, her personality, all of it. I love her. I wanna hang out with her. And I’ve been watching since day 1. She’s just endearing to me. An endearing mess. 🤷🏻♀️❤️
Now that im caught up, should I watch the Valley?? Worth it?
Yes
regretfully, yes, it's good LOL (I hate watch Jax)
Yes, you definitely should !!
🎯
Ariana would have gaslit Stassi and Kristen denying Tom’s actions like she’s always done when someone comes to her about Tom.
Came here looking for this take. They would have dismissed Kristen for SURE.
I’m torn on this. Because I acknowledge Ariana was in a heavy grief when all the Kristen/Tom/Ariana thing happened. I say that because when I had a hysterectomy I was going through heavy trauma and grief from it, and I met my narc ex who say I wasn’t really myself. I was more susceptible to being used and molded to his needs.
But I found by season 7 Ariana had been working on her healing, and that’s when Sandoval lost interest because she started getting out of it and picking what was best for her and her healing. Setting boundaries etc. I think Tom found her harder to control once she left her cool girl vibe behind and chose to heal from her previous abusive relationship, her relationship with her body and it’s needs, and boundaries.
You could tell because she started seeking things outside of Tom, or without his guidance. At first I think she would resist out of habit from the previous years. But she became less and less about protecting him and more herself. And you see this before the affair came out.
And I think she would have come around to them and the evidence. She doesn’t like wearing her emotions out for everyone to see, and is probably like me where I need time to process everything and then when I come to my own conclusions and wake up.
Because once I came out of my grief and being vulnerable, and started deciding how to get better from it. Things shifted with my ex and I, and I did defend him and hide his actions out of shame and judgement from others.
I became less easy to control for him and our relationship fell apart, and I found out about his cheating and called him fully out on all the horrible things he had done while acknowledging I wasn’t a perfect partner and listed what I did wrong.
But the things I did wrong were not even close to being comparable. And I think that’s where they were at on the end of things.
Yes I agree she started changing a bit more for herself in the later seasons.
Yes, Kristen was always good at getting evidence, a la the smoking gun Uber
Lmao the roof of Sur 🤣
Kristina Kelly clocked Rachel from a mile away last season. And she hadn’t been around in years!
What would VPR have looked like if KK had taken them up on the offer to make her the star? She has always been THAT bitch 💖 I’d love to see more of her, she’d know who the Traitor was right away 😂
Kristina Kelly would’ve RAN shit. I always liked her and wished they had her as a main. She was so real and always had everyone’s number 😂
She was smart to keep her presence to a minimum. She probably wouldn't have ended up being as liked as she is if she were more of a main character.
The way she just dead ass stares someone down with her big eyes showing NO FEAR. Haha.
It’s the way everyone says that in reality, KK was the Regina George of Sur and Stassi was the Gretchen Weiners
Idk, I think that yes, KK was the Regina George of SUR but I also think Stassi wasn’t like Gretchen wieners as she’s always been direct and honest. Gretchen is spineless and follows Regina around and is jealous of Regina. KK and Stassi have a very loving and authentic friendship and are loyal to each other. I’d compare them more to something like Blair and Serena whenever they ran shit together in GG
YES--KK is def blair and stassi is serena
I LOVE kristina kelly and was so glad to see her reappear
I don’t think Rachel could ever handle Stassi!…
Oh god, she would have had to apply for citizenship at the mental health retreat...
Stassi would eat her alive and ask for seconds.
I doubt Rachel would have even been cast.
If they were never fired I don’t think Rachel would have ever even been made a main cast member lol, and certainly wouldn’t have been on the show still after her and James broke up. So maybe the affair would have happened, but I doubt she’d have been as integrated into the group or even on the show still at that point.
Maybe not a main cast member, but seeing as how she stuck around and let herself be played a fool by James in the beginning, I think she would’ve tried to stay a re-occurring member. She always screamed desperate for attention, IMO
Yea I just don’t think the show would have even offered her that if they still had all the OGs tbh lol. They wouldn’t have needed her and she was only on before as someone’s gf. Like imagine if Shay had tried to stay around lol. but agree that she’d try though
"let herself be played a fool" what gross victim blaming way to express she didn't escape her violent addict abuser fast enough...
I think maybe what they are referring to is that despite countless people telling her that James was cheating (and some with proof), she still stayed with him and blindly defended him, even got in fights with the other girls about it, bc she wanted to be on the show.
I mean Ariana did the same thing and it worked out for her
I agree. I think Sandoval was probably cheating the whole relationship. If it wasn't with Rachel it would have been someone else. I think Rachel would have went away and had a normal like possibly if those three never got fired.
I wish others would come forward with proof they were with him during his time with Ariana. I don’t want to see him redeemed
I agree but they won't after all the backlash Tom and Rachel rightfully got.
Sigh
Any other female leads, the affair would NOT have even happened at all. Sandoval saw people were interested in her and the support she got after breaking up with James. He wanted her because she was the top girl that season. He wouldn’t even let Schwartz have her. Getting rid of James and Katie would mean whoever is left would be in a better position to get higher contracts too. He wanted to be the last OG standing. And I am not convinced that Scheana didn’t know about the plan to oust James and Katie. That is what he is holds over her head. That she was part of the plan to get rid of Katie and James.
That makes so much sense!! Tom & scheana were too close and conniving that season I didnt know where that came from. I could see that being true
I don’t think she was top girl that season though (or ever). And their affair started v early into filming - he wouldn’t have known if anyone was still interested in her or seen their support yet. I also don’t think Schwartz wanted her, they were def already hooking up by then and used him as a cover. I think Tom just saw a younger girl that was clearly into him, was insecure/malleable herself, and who made his ego feel good.
She was put in as a lead girl. She was single, young, still working at SUR, and had a broken engagement story. Production saw her as far more interesting because she was known but not “known”. So Sandoval jumped on that attention and groomed her to act certain ways. He tried to “produce” her. Like he “produces” himself.
Yea I agree with Sandoval doing that. Like I said, I think he saw an insecure/malleable girl who he could control. I just don’t think the public ever saw her as top girl or the new star, which I see some people insinuate. Back then, I remember thinking it was weird they kept her on the show and felt bad at the beginning of s10 bc she was clearly spiraling and it was hard to watch. But just my opinion!
I think they hoped for some drama between her and James and the group standing up for her. There is more though. Scheana gave her a place to live, Sandoval started talking to her more, by Coachella she was already talking to Nema about thinking Tom Schwartz was hot. Is was all a set up. Get rid of Katie. And get rid of James for her.
This is such a good point. She is so boring compared to Stassi, Kristen, etc.
The thing is I don’t think Ariana would have believed it. Apparently one or two friends did say something to her, it was even covered at one point on season 10 but she said she totally trusted them both. I think she just genuinely could not conceive of it.
That’s devastating, honestly
It’s ok because she has brand deals /s
Which is wild, cause she knew first hand Tom was a cheater. He cheated with Ariana and Miami girl.
Bro even Ken said something befor Ariana 'caught' him. It was all calculated.
I think Kristen and/or stassi would have come with evidence somehow
No chance. Kristen would have sniffed it out immediately.
Yes! She knows Tom’s tricks firsthand and (eventually) adores Ariana. She would have hound dogged that ish
Lala did try to call it out. She even tried to approach Ariana about it and she shut it down.
Ken tried to call it out too! KEN!!!
I love the way he just came into the kitchen, dropped some hot goss, and left immediately lol! That was the gossip equivalent of a Molotov cocktail. 🤣
Almost like it was set up by production 🙃
Oh totally, just thought it was funny because it was so unnatural.
the way he shuffled in, incoherently delivered his rehearsed line (that LVP had to basically finish for him) then was shooed out by LVP cracks me up to this day
Totally! Katie looked like she knew what was up but did Ariana a solid by pretending she didn't.
Oh lord that setup tried too hard. I can hear LVP: “now Ken, you come in and mention the sleepover.”
Ken: “errrr err hummm you want me to sleep with who now?”
Stassi would call it out loud for sure.
I know she would of called out but then again her and Ariana didn’t really like each other so I’m not even sure. She’d definitely talk about it behind Ariana’s back. But I think like Lala clocked it, stassi and jax would of clocked it as well for sure.
Stassi hates Tom so much she’d just love pissing him off and exposing him.
Interesting hypothetical! I think 2014/15 Kristen *would be on the case”…but today, she is an actual friend and didn’t notice.
I think LaLa—because she wasn’t as close to them—picked up on things that their friends just didn’t notice or think was odd.
I thought it was because she was the only one not drinking
Lol, that probably helped, too.
It was called out earlier though. By Ally, Lala, Katie…
Ariana yelled at anyone who tried to bring it to her attention and shut it down.
Scheana even met with her OFF camera about it
It’s so obvious that Lala and Scheana were suspicious of Sandoval for a while…thinking about that one aftershow or WWHL where Lala says they needed to “get Ariana out” of her relationship.
Wait what ?! When did I miss this. She said this when cause on camera she was denying everything
In the reunion they discuss it, Scheana had a sit down with Ariana and laid out concerns she and the group had been having that something was going on.
Oh wow! Good to know. And Ariana still wouldn’t believe it? Crazy how much she trusted someone she KNEW was a cheater.
if I speak 🤐
Hinting and vaguely asking is no where near the level of effort Kristen would’ve went through to expose Tom Sandoval had she been apart of that friend group and film .
Kristen and Stassi would've had RECIEPTS. TIMELINES. EVIDENCE!
They would have cleared a whole wall in Stassi's house to map out/hang up evidence props/pics exhibits like they do in crime procedurals and brought Ariana over for a presentation.
It would have ended up like the Miami girl situation and Arianna would have defended Tom and they would have swept it under the rug together and called Rachel a liar
Exactly and would have bullied Rachel into confessing somehow
Thats exactly my thoughts! Kristen and Stassi wouldn’t drop it as easily as Lala and Scheana who were constantly on the outs and fighting with the OG group
Allys attempt didn’t seem strong enough! I would not have let up!! And i don’t think the OGs would’ve either. She was just too new IMO
Because Ariana knew!!!! I’m not understanding why everyone can’t take the final step and realize the WHY. Ariana shot down every attempt to bring it to her attention because she knew. She wanted to control the narrative and come out on top, and the only way to do that was to pretend things were great and she was blindsided and release the news herself
No. Stassi has always been suspicious of Sandoval, and Kristen knows his tactics all too well.
The ONLY thing that may have prevented it from getting out would be if at some point Jax cheated on Brittany with someone close to the group recently (which is likely, tbh). Jax, Sandoval, and Schwartz all have dirt on each other and Sandoval definitely would have given up dirt on Jax to take the heat off of him.
Now, I do want to reiterate that in no way do I want Stassi back given her behavior, but I am saying it would have turned out differently.
I'm doing a rewatch too and Stassi says in the second season: "Sherlock Holmes has nothing on a scorned woman" referring to Kristin catching Tom hooking up with a girl in Vegas by calling the phone company to look up Vegas girls number. No chance in hell Rachel and Sandoval would get away with their fling with the three private investigators (Stassi, Kristen and Jax) lol
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19d
He literally let Sandoval and Rachel hang out in his apartment and went on couple trips with them and Jo… he was fully helping, lol
Kudos I can only seem to handle a couple episodes per week!
I was clearing almost a season a week 😅
Wifey has me jumping around a bit because I'm like... When did Lala, Brittany and James show up? When did Jax Kristen and Stassi get fired?
Jax fucked KRISTEN? Jax fucked someone named Faith while a dying woman was in the room? Miami Girl?
There are just so many references casually thrown around it's definitely like joining a club and not knowing all the secret handshakes
A dying woman? How did I miss that???
Yup, Faith was some kind of care taker for this woman and they did the deed w/ this old lady in the other room!
This is so doable. I cleared 10 seasons of SVU in 2 months! Did the same with VPR
I’m wrapping up my first binge through too!
Jax would’ve thrown him under the bus & run him over 37 times, so that’s gonna be a hard no
We were robbed idgaf!
Ariana was also deeply depressed & trying to start a new business. I can understand overlooking or not caring to look deeper, simply out of emotional exhaustion.
It was also bc Tom conditioned Ariana to always protect him in public. Even if she had legit suspicions, he’s trained her to keep those concerns in-house, to protect their relationship. It’s prob always been to help Tom, but Ariana has shown she is loyal AF & has a blind spot for love ones — eg Scheana.
Totally agree!!!!
Stassi would of been on to his arse for sure
Exactly and she would have prob still been seething about the book signing debacle it would have been perfect
That scene infuriated me. He is such a douche canoe
Why did Jax get fired?
Pretty sure last straw was yelling at Lisa that "THIS IS MY SHOW!"
💀
He wasn't up Lisa's ass, same for Kristen
Does anyone get the feeling that Ariana and Tom made an agreement to have it play out the way it has? I mean, Tom is making a sh*it ton off of the mess; as is Ariana. They both knew their time on the show was coming to an end as they weren’t working at VP anymore and could probably see that the show was losing its edge - they’ve been on it for 10 years - they know how it works!
Omg yes, I've said this multiple times.....and I got all the downvotes like you did.
Hahaha the downvotes made me chuckle
Thwy are all names stan
I DO think its a little odd that now Ariana comes out about how Tom coached her for reunions and they hid important information. So, it is somewhat valid but I don’t think she would have truly reacted the way she did if she knew.
yes, this has been obvious to me since the day the “scandal” broke
I wonder if maybe they had an ‘open relationship’ with boundaries, such as not hooking up with friends/the group, being up front, etc and he violated that
I don’t because of the way Ariana reacted. If she were that good an actress, she’d be winning Oscars
Well she is a Broadway star now
I 100% think she knew, I think they had some sort of agreement but she didn't like the way it was exposed.
everyone knew. Katie, Scheana, James, Lala, production, they all knew. they just sat back enjoying the show of Sandoval grooming Rachel and waited for ariana to find out.
1000000% NO
Not a chance. Kristen and Stassi would’ve clocked it immediately, Kristen would use her skills to get hard evidence and showed Ariana (in a nice way), and Tom would’ve had a hard time hiding this from Jax, because the second Jax found out he would’ve screamed it from the roof of Sur