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This is an endearing interpretation, but themes are only one part of a story. Even if you generalize the narrative to explain how it makes sense thematically, it says nothing of how it was technically executed, which lies in the details, and is what many people have an issue with. That’s not to mention the fact that this is only one theme, and one piece has many which often conflict with eachother. For instance any unearned powerup cheapens the setup and great moments that contributed to the theme of hard work/training/dedication to overcome obstacles
Just cause themes are well written, doesn't mean the execution is good nor the plot os well written.
Firstly, Nika isn't a power that Oda built up properly. He just called ot 'the embodiment of freedom' and now appearently, all readers and OP world, meed to eat it up as such.
Even Luffy turning Nika was a questionable writing choice, as Nika is not well constructed in the lore. We just know Oda wants us to see Nika=Freedom wothout actually building it up.
And now Bonney turns into Nika too as the climax 9f her arc and reaching 'freedom'.
It is just lame at this point if this is how Oda will tackle freedom concept going forward.
Law also had a way to attaining freedom in Dressrosa. All of Corazon flashback and Corazon's sacrificies were about it, in the end even confronting Doflamingo and saying Law is free.
Law as a child, had a great mentor figure, also a sad story. But he fought his demons with his own allies,skill and will, and attained his freedom.
He didn't have to magically turn into Nika to smack Doffy around.
We can tackle good themes and concepts without Oda turning it into a 3 year old daturday cartoon. Nor shoving down our throats his Nika fetish.
Honestly, I don't think One Piece is really as socially rebellious as some people with political agendas claim it is.
The themes are rebellion against tyranny, yes, but the reoccuring narrative is almost always that the tyrant has replaced the good and rightful king and we need to put the old king back on his throne. We see this pattern in Alabasta with Crocodile trying to overthrow Cobra, Skypeia with Enel replacing Ganfall as God, Dressrosa with Doflamingo usurping Riku, and Wano with Kaido and Orochi ousting the Kozukis. Hell, its really likely that this is what the whole Ancient Kingdom vs alliance of 20 Kingdoms thing is going to amount to; the Celestial Dragons are going to presented as usurpers and we need to put the Ancient Kingdom back in charge of the world again. I think the whole Wapol situation is the only major instance where a tyrant is depicted as a legally legitimate ruler who needs to be overthrown despite being of the right bloodline instead of a usurper. Its kind of like how people try to portray Robin Hood as a left-wing revolutionary when in reality the whole Robin Hood story was about how King Richard was a good and rightful king and its only the corrupt Prince John and Sheriff of Nottingham that were exploiting his absence to oppress the peasantry. Its only really criticizing bad people as opposed to the system itself (even with the Revolutionaries you have them saying "the problem isn't the World Government but the Celestial Dragons who rule it"), and when the people are as over-the-top evil as One Piece villains typically are pretty much everyone no matter their political opinion, even if they're literal fascists, would go "yeah that guy needs to get his ass kicked".
I mean to be fair if he did try to go for some genuinely hot political takes then One Piece wouldn't have that universal appeal that made it top-selling.
You can kill the woman (insert pic of Rowling) but not the idea (insert Goda pic)
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13d
I've never heard someone say he doesn't think One piece is socially rebellious with zero political messages, when the entire story is literally about overthrowing the oppressive government?
My point is that the story isn't about overthrowing the oppressive government, its mostly about keeping the same government except there's a nicer guy sitting on the big chair this time, if its not about outright counterevolution. When you literally have the guys calling themselves the Revolutionary Army say "we don't want to overthrow the World Government, just the Celestial Dragons" that's telling.
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13d
Are you 5 years old? Only then you'd think "we want good guys at the top, we must say no no no to bad guys" is meaningful political commentary and bears any relation to how the real-world works
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13d
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Neither? I don't think One Piece has no politics, nor do I think what little is there are "bad messages". That's the whole point.
One Piece has some of the most boilerplate depictions of politics in existence. Do you seriously think any politician in the real world just announces they are pro-oppression? It is just generic and vague platitudes.
I'm reading a book on revolutionary Iran atm, and even Khomeini framed his uprising as standing up to the Shah's oppressive policies, and that led to an equally repressive theocracy.
Do you think Khomeini watched One Piece?
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13d
I’m not surprised that all the fans that started reading in wano eat this shit up
They aren’t entirely wrong that this was the intention. Luffy has always inspired children, most notably in Wano. But it’s the execution that is poor. The chapter made it look as if it is the convenient situation that Luffy is the reincarnation of the freedom god which inspires Bonney to rise up, rather than inspiring her through his showcase of his will and determination. It wasn’t luffy’s doing, it was the Nika clout.
Bonney choosing to become Nika also leaves a bad taste because it’s an example of how she wants to achieve her dreams by becoming someone else, the same reason we criticize Yamato’s gag.
"thematically important..."
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13d
Sure. IMO, bringing the discussion to the "themes" of One Piece in order to defend the particular writing is a cope. Personally, what I dislike about this is the implications to the plot and characters, not the thematic significance of ot.
Bonney has been around since Sabaody, with no indication previous to Egghead that she gave a damn about Nika or that her powers could do anything more than aging or de-aging people. Now, a 1000 chapters into the story, we have to just accept her stealing the spotlight from the Strawhats for the whole arc, that she basically had Luffy's DF in her back pocket and, on top of that, getting the his most important transformation?
Sure, maybe it tecnically fits the themes of the story, but the themes of freedom and going against tiranny don't demand Bonney gets G5 or any of Luffy's powers, for that matter. The story could be told in a different way, with less retcons, and still be thematically sound.
Something can both be thematically sound while being bad storytelling. That is what I feel it's the case.
That's a lot of words and thoughts for something Oda barely gave a fuck about.
As much as One Piece has yapped about dreams during its tenure, it actually used to be about trying and giving your all.
You know, working hard.
That's how you get what you want. That's why the early arcs centered around grit, sacrifice, and spilling your blood both literally and metaphorically.
Vivi's dream was peace and no one dying, and Oda outright rejected that notion with his narrative. That's why her screams over a crowd that won't hear her is supposed to be powerful. It's why Luffy took three attempts to beat Crocodile. It's why he understood those jackasses in Jaya making fun of him didn't mean anything.
This °•○●Dreams●○•° crap is a last minute bandaid because Oda didn't know how to handle expanding his story and had weak editors.
What he used to mean was the indomitable will of the human spirit in adversity, when he references a Character's dream.
That's not the same thing as whatever the fuck he's doing with Bonney and this Nika shit. It currently feels more like a Christmas special where you find out Santa is both real and the friends you made along the way.
It's not in line with what the manga has been setting up as a narrative, and it sucks.
holy trinity depicts Father, Son and Holy Spirit. assume for some strange absurd reason Jesus appers, proving his existence. this is followed by some random child from a Christian Fundamental family becoming Jesus too due to the excitement of seeing their hero. is this is supposed to be peak?? if stories are about themes stop having people fight since that too is another aspect of this manga. Bonney can embody the most ridiculous power, grant it to others in addition to commanding all pacifista. there's a difference between making my arms larger too I can rewrite physics like this God ive become.
The thing is that this is not subtle at all, without Bonney and gomu gomu no mi being nika the metaphor could exist and was already existing. It’s just make it a less good written metaphor
why all of this ???????
Artur from Ohara has the same analysis as well, so I get it narratively speaking
I think everyone has gear 5 fatigue lol
Why? ignoring the narrative is literally the best way to enjoy gear 5 and thats coming from someone who generally enjoys the idea of nika
Same issue with the last Jedi, the themes make sense in weaving the narrative together to further the story.
but from the viewer’s experience of the world and the characters’ actions and agency, it comes off as misplaced and unearned especially when other character’s arcs involve overcoming physical and mental barriers to unlock new levels across multiple domains not exclusive to fighting ability.
Though you can say that Bonney has achieved this “growth” based on my description above in becoming free, it doesn’t hold the same narrative weight for people who are interested in how the power structures and levels in OP require a great deal level of effort and will to surpass or supplant and how different characters will approach it. At least that’s how I see it.
The problem is probs from the “broken” nature of the fruit thus some people aren’t happy with Oda and the leeway he seems to give the character Bonney in the OP world. Why watch Zoro, Usopp, Nami, Don Krieg, Koby or Sanji grow when someone can just speedrun that growth?
Not reading all of that, i stopped caring when oda make the freedom fighter for slaves be called a nikka like is he even trying
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12d
Np
The answers on this thread is my final straw.
I'm unsubbing.
You guys are actually this dumb, pretending to be smart. Holy fuck. No themes?
After over twenty years? Well fuck.
Ok bye
Luffy can represent a symbol without magically embodying it out of nowhere