Your in Jiraya’s shoes and know everything you do would you say yes? Your not allowed to change anything else
DiscussionEh?
No Pain means no Madara eyes in storage.
No Pain means Jiraya doesn’t die.
No Pain means the Akatsuki is never formed, the tailed beasts are never captured, Naruto isn’t specifically targeted and the fourth war never happens.
No Akatsuki changes the history for both Itachi and Oorochimaru - butterfly effect could mean Hiruzen might have had a chance to tell Sasuke of Itachis truth.
Also changes the Rain Village as well, probably has minor consequences.
No Pain also means Naruto never defeats him and never gets to be the hero of the village, he never gets the fame that he had.
Without that fame, the alliance and even Konoha shinobi would find it way harder to fight a war for him, or to even follow him in the war.
The history of the Akatsuki wouldn’t have been changed so much, also. Obito would’ve just found another pawn, and everything: the hunting of the tailed beasts, Itachi, Orochimaru, would still happend, because it wasn’t Pain who was the mastermind behind all that, it was Obito
Who else is he going to give the Rinnegan to? Wasn’t this already after the massacre of the Uzumaki?
Yes, that too. Madara was just going to find another Uzumaki, who maybe didn’t have any personal beef with Konoha, and never attacked it, but Obito would’ve still found them and manipulate them to play Pokémon Go with the biju. Everything would’ve still had happend
Karin
wouldn't have been able to see minato, wouldn't have trained for sage, wouldn't have seen everybody die(character development). yes it brought many bad things but it also brought many good things to naruto
Yeah best Naruto survives to meet his parents and got magic sage powers rather than the untold amount of people that got killed in the fourth war....
Heck yeah.
I'm not seeing much downside. I don't buy into the argument that there would be another Pain. Not many uzumaki around to implant the Rinnegan in. Most other clans don't have the vast amounts of chakra to fully utilize the Rinnegan either. So even if Madara found someone else, they would be severely limited and you would have Jiraya to help fight alongside everyone else in the village.
It all depends. Do you believe in "fate" where an invisible god/hand controls what happens for all beings and even inanimate objects? Like how the Force in Star Wars (talking out my ass because I'm not a huge SW expert) allows things to happen but can influence the state of the world to its preference.
Assuming there is no external god causing everything to still be on course as if Pain survived, then sure we can kill Pain here. I think Jiraiya actively voting for the trio's death would lead him down a darker path.
Couldn’t madara just put one in óbito and have him save the other for later? Pain was just a figure head to hide tobi’s identity at the end of the day in terms of their plan right
That’s how you know know Jiraya ain’t Anakin
I mean it would probably stop the 4th great shinobi war due to no Rinnegan and all but that also means Naruto and Sasuke don't awaken six paths powers to fight Otsutsuki so Momoshiki would come in and instantly win but at the same time maybe they awaken it later on and actually stand a chance. Sasuke wouldn't be able to rescue Naruto without a rinnegan and it's probably the end of the world just because of that.
Within just Naruto, yeah, but for Boruto and all, no. It's probably safer to not interfere with it.
Crazy how Orochimaru could have indirectly lead to the end of the world if not for Jiraiya.
Considering he could have brought them to village at any point during their training on the condition he'd become hokage...
But that wouldn’t have worked coz Nagato hated konoha.
Nagato didn't hate konoha at this point it is only after the death of friends that he goes down that route
Konoha shinobi killed his parents
He was a kid, he would have adapted. Especially with the Toad Hokage at the helm of the village. The only things he'd have to worry about is Orochimaru and Danzo.
I'd say yes as a joke and hope Orochimaru knows me enough to know its a joke
You're*
Madara would have just chosen another Uzumaki
You mean Naruto?
Nah Karin. (Not sure if it was confirmed but iirc it was heavily implied that she has a relation to the Uzumaki clan)
That doesn't make sense to me. Less cool for the story too.
Edit: wait wrong person. I know what you mean. Makes sense but she clearly didn't get the high chakra reserve.
Lol, all Jiraiya had to do to stop Pain was to not train them. The dude spent how long training them? He could've instead just taken the time to bring them to a safer place and not taught them any ninjutsu.
Sigh….Just the Uzamaki kid. We’ll adopt the girl and keep her away from paper forever.
Hell yeah, there wouldn't be a rinnegan anybody's aware of which could stop everything pain did for his peace like creating the Akatsuki and killing yahiko not happen. but at the same time Naruto and Sasuke would've gotten dealt with and the six paths would've never been given to them if jiraiya killed them, this leading to the fourth war never being a thing which could lead to the otsutsukis killing everybody. unless naruto and Sasuke awaken the six paths some other way, which actually isn't that unlikely bc of Sasuke getting hagoromos chakra when he was about to die. the same thing could happen if one of the otsutsukis almost kill him, same with Naruto
I feel someone else would have ended up making an organisation similar to akatsuki with all the wars and battles between villages and the smaller villages that get caught in the cross fire if not pain it would have been someone else
I would have brought them to Konhoa.
No. "Life is filled with unavoidable pain, so we might just as well put others out of their misery" is an absurdly nihilistic way to think, and you'd actually have to be a sociopath to think like that. Besides, Nagato was doing ok until Danzo came along and fucked it all up.
the Great War acted as an end towards all the hatred between people of the villages. even without akatsuki, there was no peace, wars still happening everywhere. as bad as it is, and even though the future events has caused a lot of sacrifices, we cannot deny that those horrific times serves as a need.
I would say the same about the Uchiha massacre. it is what it is.
my opinion towards butterfly effects, is that it's better not to change anything. we often only focusing on the bad, but only later realized that those bad moments somehow produced good memories, no matter how small it could be.
No, the rinnegan becomes a leaf military asset after killing the kids. Probably ends up in the hands of danzo somehow and he stages a coup once he masters it and ends up killing the 4th and becoming a new antagonist. Tobi somewhere working in the background to get the rinnegan back and fufill moons eye plan. Naruto still an orphan
without Nagato there would be no Naruto. simple as that
Naruto name was taken from main character in Jiraiya's book which also inspired by Nagato. without jiraiya experienced life with nagato there would be no book. and reason why Naruto want to become hokage was because he is an orphan and treated like shit by everyone. he wanted to become hokage so the villager will acknoledge him but if he never be an orphan then he wouldn't have wanted to become hokage either, instead he will develop the same daddy issue with Boruto and despise the hokage
Naruto would have completly different person with different name anddifferent personality. he probably would be like Menma. Naruto and Sasuke wouldn't get six path power either
without all of that it might be delay madara's plan but sooner or later otsutsuki either Momoshiki or Isshiki will emerge from the shadown and without anyone strong enough to take them down the world is fucked
Nagato became jiraiya's student, Naruto became orphan Uchiha massacre and 4th shinobi war are part of the canon event or absolute point. remove even one of them will spell the end of the world in few decade
maybe destroy nagato's eyes and give him a normal pair? that should screw over zetsu quite a bit, but tbh sasuke will just end up as the next madara I feel
No, no i wouldn't. Pain or Nagato is the result of the heinous injustice brought about by the avarice of the five major nations, of which Konaha is both a part and the cause. Just like what Kakashi said about Sasuke - "He is the victim of the time we live in". "Pain" will emerge whether it's Nagato or someone else.
As long as human greed, injustice, selfishness, and other ills continue, killing Nagato would not bring about any solution. The idea that killing a child would end all problems and bring about world peace is nothing more than conceit, hubris and narcissistic self-righteousness.
In a way, what Pain did to Konoha is satisfying considering all the bullshit that they initiated, the same can be said about Sasuke killing Danzo.
As with all of these what-if questions, the world would probably end during Boruto era when the Ootsutsukis arrive unless Naruto gets strong enough to fend them off. Which means, any events that are integral to Naruto's development can't be changed. I think there's a good chance that if the Akatsuki never existed, then Naruto would've trained a lot less; including possibly not getting the toad sage training, the rasenshuriken training, and the perfect jinchuriki training. So I don't think you can kill these kids.
Naruto would’ve had a harder time without Pain