I recently beat the original FF7 for the first time, here are my thoughts. Overall I would say it is a great game.
FF VII / RemakeThey were the initial baddies with the early game twist being that Sephiroth is the real baddy
This is something that was completely tossed aside in Remake, which is a shame. I remember going through Midgar thinking Sephiroth might be a powerful ally, since we were aligned against Shinra.
This is my sole complaint in the remake trilogy. The “holy shit wtf” moment in Shinra Tower when you realize this god-tier soldier that had only been hinted at prior to that had completely lost it was CRAZY for middle-school aged me. The whole music shift and blood trails section when you’re walking through a dead and empty Shinra Tower was top tier, may be my favorite few minutes of any final fantasy, ever. They really undercut that by having Sephiroth show up as an ominous figure early in the game.
Yeah, I feel the same. Also about the fight at the end of the game. They could have created a new jenova 'fate' or something, or just go with the previous ending.
Also, bit of a shame about the spirits. Should've been hashed out a bit more, it felt a bit rushed/out of place in the otherwise masterful writing of the Midgar arc.
I think they are mostly catering to fans of the OG which is sort of paradoxical in the sense that they don't need to have the Sephiroth reveal be the big twist since it's not really a twist for us, so they end up doing a sort of different twist like Barret being stabbed. But then a lot of OG fans are purists in the sense that if it's not a 1:1 retelling, a lot of people get annoyed.
I think this logic of "bringing a new twist to replace the older ones so that even veteran OG fans will still be surprised" is something that will happen again in pt 3. The Zack reveal already started MUCH sooner in Rebirth than in OG, so I believe the Northern Crater and Lifestream scenes will have something to surprise us veterans. Probably something involving Aerith and when Sephiroth reveals the "truth" about her fate, in much the same way that he revealed the "truth" about Zack in the OG.
2 is the big disagree for me. Exploring the world and seeing all the cool locations was what made the game for me. I loved the characters and the overall story was great but that sense of adventure between leaving Midgar and the end of disk 1 was one of my defining moments in gaming. Disk 2 felt kinda weak in comparison.
- Yeah, the whole conversation in the Final Cut scene of remake where Barrett asks, “I thought you beat him? “It works because it’s followed by some music and this builds up as we hear the rallying cry of each character.
what would have been shrouded in mystery in the final scenes of the original game gets diluted throughout remake by having Sephiroth Constantly appearing in the story. Even if Cloud is the only one that can see him most of the time. I think it would’ve been better if each of those times we get a tiny clip of what is going on in Clouds head (like the fuzzy tv effects throughout the game) without revealing the main villain until after President Shinra dies. It would have served and honored the original game by keeping that same pace and mystery. Rebirth would have been even more anticipated.
That’s what’s missing from most stories and games lately. People don’t want to write a mystery and they really should.
Zack has a pretty crucial but easily-missable flashback scene in the OG, but really he's as "important" as he is nowadays because of Crisis Core.
I was going to post this, I feel like the majority of people never go back to the mansion and see the extra cutscene with Zack
I was one that never went back and saw them. I had no idea about Zack until years later lol
Zack as a person is not really important. It could have been any other soldier dude that went on the mission.
That's why I put "important" in quotes - he's "important" now because Crisis Core made him more important than he was in the OG.
Honestly, I dislike how the turks are written as a whole. These guys litterally killed hundreds of thousands of people by dropping the sector 7 plate, but then, for the rest of the game, they are treated as slightly comedic rivals who you grow a grudging respect for despite being enemies.
I get the point was to demonstrate that the people doing shinras work aren't all just soulless bastards, and that they are just people as well, but the fact that the main cast ever treats them with anything other than hatred after what they did to sector 7 just takes me out of the story.
The remake unfortunately doesn't seem to have attempted to fix this problem at all.
yeah they're attractive and funny which is a get out of jail free card in most popular culture. if anything remake made it worse. i'm not saying i didn't enjoy the scene with Rude at the bald persons' bar, or Elena and her ice cream, but you're absolutely right that these are scummy murderers and kidnappers.
The materia system is cool except that it nullifies any one character’s individuality. In my experience, there are some stat differences between characters but not significant enough that moving one materia build to any other character would break that build.
For example i run Barrett with a lot of materia because he’s perfectly fine in the back row just like any other mage. But also Cloud’s magic stat is a few points higher than most and would be just as good as any other mage build. So it’s basically just choose your favorite limit break party.
Remake did this better.
That's exactly what I love about it, it's fantastic to have your party be customizable!
It's just a much more flexible version of the job system really.
That's why I love NT 2.0
What's NT 2.0?
That's the "New Threat" Mod I believe
I think it likely doesn't help characters feel unique when, for the most part, they get their narrative story section like Cosmo Canyon for Red XIII and then they aren't really that narratively important for the rest of the game.
Your Zack point is the reason the Remake era started adding more Zack scenes to hammer in his importance.
I'm conflicted about Zack and the change to the story with Whisperers and multiple timelines.
I like Zack and I enjoy his part in Rebirth.
But the Whisperers/multiverse aspect of the story means that this is more like a sequel than a remake. I still enjoy it but I feel like the original story of FF7 is more impactful.
They should have left him. He isnt actually very important, and trying to drive significance for him is a big part of why the compilation material is poor.
That is probably because SquareEnix wants to pander the Japan market which has a lot of Zack fans, so the incompetent Nojima along with other devs wrote a horrible script to make him important. But the funny thing is that in remake and rebirth he is not important at all, he appears in some small sessions, doing boring stuff in a separate world with Biggs which nobody cares and want to skip but cannot skip except for the beginning of rebirth.
Just to clarify, I'm a Zack fan who is not in the Japan market. I've met Nomura and told him in Japanese that Zack is my favorite character (before the Remake project started)
With all that said, I disagree with your comment.
So you're saying the unnecessary extra Zack stuff is your fault? /s
If the necessary extra Zack stuff is thanks to me, then I'm flattered.
When I said Japan market fans, I did not direct at you, I don’t even know who you are. Respectful diagree.
To tell the original story, yeah, you don’t need Zack or any of his backstory at all. He ends up being a catalyst for Clouds recovery late into the game.
So the question is, why is Zack even getting screen time at all? There has to be a reason to the narrative and not just fan service.
How did you feel about the golden saucer in this version?
It’s great for world building, I just wish I didn’t need to go back to it multiple time since I got the point the first time
I very much felt the same about Fort Condor. I hated having to remind myself to keep checking it.
I thought the worst part was, by far, the entire huge materia arc that is about half of disc 2. The return to Midgard felt a bit half baked as well, as if the dev team ran out of time and needed an area to quickly wrap up all of Shinra before moving on to the ending.
Honestly, I am curious as to how the Turks were able to rival soldiers. Were they experimented on differently or were they able to become this strong? Answers that are not found in the original or the two remakes.
They do give some explanation in the cellphone game (I think it's before crisis) but basically they are specially selected and trained (similar to how Tifa/Yuffie can stand next to the likes of Cloud [Soldier], Vicent [Zombie Turk] Red XIII) then again there is Cid a literal old drunk engineer
I’m glad materia was introduced or we wouldn’t have it in 14 and it is practically required for raiding
I actually dislike the materia system, as I greatly prefer all my characters having unique roles within the party. It’s a similar reason why I didn’t like the junction system in 8.
Zack's importance is actually crucial. I'd go as far as saying that his sacrifice is the single most determinant moment in the game/compilation. No Zack, no FFVII.
But I understand why you would feel that way, his actual screentime doesn't reflect that at all, which I think is kinda cool in a way.
Surely "determinant", not "detrimental"?
Yes sorry, English is not my first language. I fixed it, thank you for pointing it out.
Oh, don’t worry. It’s just that it has a completely different meaning, but also could be interpreted as relevant: the omission and downplaying of Zack’s sacrifice in OG (since you only see it in an optional scene) could be detrimental to the plot.
I wanted to be sure.
Well thank you for asking, I learned something !
Yeah I was referring more to screen time
There is an optional, pretty long and extremely important cinematic sequence that only triggers if you go back to the Shinra Mansion basement in Niebelheim after you’ve gotten Cloud back .
In it, you learn what Zack’s whole deal is, what was going on with Cloud and Zack during the 5 years since the Niebelheim Incident, and It’s actually one of the most important expositional sequences in the entire game and you will almost certainly miss it if you don’t know how to trigger it.
Zack is important as a plot point for ff7, important for Cloud as a character but say that he is important to the point of no Zack no ff7 is ridiculous, only Zack fanboys say this. Zack did not play any role in ff7 journey from bombing in Midgar, cross-dressing to save Tifa, the plate drop, the Shinra HQ, etc.
There would have been no "ff7 journey" at all without Zack. Freeing Cloud from Hojo's lab in Nibelheim and carrying him all the way to Midgar is what makes the events of VII possible. So yes, no Zack, no FFVII. Nothing to do with being a fan boy.
There would be an ff7 journey without zack, because the story would just be written in a different way
Then you could literally say that about every character lol
Yeah, lol
It would still be ff7, just not our ff7 (and we wouldnt even know it)
Curious to hear which mods you used?
Zack was very minor in the story in the original Crisis Core gave him well needed expanded story making him more important.
Zack is in my top 5 FF characters all time. Primarily because Crisis Core did a really good job of making him such a likable character. My only issue with him is they literally just copy and pasted a good portion of Cloud’s story onto him.
Top 5 FF characters are Squall (8 is my favorite and Squall is my boy), Cloud, Aerith, Balthier and then Zack.
But the Turks theme music 💗
Honestly? After replaying it this year, I would say 7 is my least favourite of the PS1 trilogy
There were just too many minor issues that drove me batty by the end
Well a spotlight shine and FF7 title show up is epic.
I enjoy all event before temple until the game foreshadow someone will left the party.
Temple of ancient is good but Cloud starting to lost control make me feel bad.
Zack is a part of whole twist. Thats why i always told people not to play Crisis Core before OG.
Yup, i spent sometimes an hour just to set up Materia.
Remake definitely not a straightfoward remake, but since most the original main devs are behind the project, i have faith in them on whatever they want to cook.
Definitely the graphic is outdated. I remember trying to get my friend play it on 2005 and he laugh at me 😂.
Summon animations are great!
Because Sephiroth is the main villain.
I thought FF8 intro was a class above, and Liberi Fatali 👌 FF8 and Soulreaver are probably some of the most memorable intros for me.
I still can't believe how much time I spent on obtaining the Knights of the Round materia.
I started the og recently too. What mods did you used ?
My main issue with the remake is that they cut the game in 3 part (more if you count the dlc) and then throw random stuff to fill the gap so it's not a game of 20h or less !
And it completly butcher the pacing of the game compared to the original.
They did that for obvious monetary reason, to milk more money out of their FF7 licence which SELLS by its name itself !
I’m replaying through FF7 now. Itd still pretty greet, I agree with a lot of what you wrote here. Though after playing the remakes there are so many things about those versions I appreciate a ton more now. Especially the way they write most of the characters. Those games had so much interaction between the characters and fleshed them out a ton. I’v been primarily walking around with Aerith and Tifa and forget how much less dialogue characters have. Sephiroth is one of the things the OG does better. But the remakes made Rufus cool and the Turks actually interesting so it’s a decent exchange
“I dont think the game is dated, but could only finish by installing some mods” this doesnt make any sense
Yeah it does, I have the same opinion on games like Minecraft or some Pokémon games
If you cant finish an old game and can only play it by changing it to be more clear and comprehensible (i will assume you used a texture mod), thats literally calling it dated. It was too old, it didnt felt good, you changed it. Thats not a bad thing tbh, its just the natural cycle of games
I absolutely loathe the Materia system. Compared to the games before it, it is the most inefficient combat system I've seen. The idea that your knowledge of combat skills/magic/summons is linked to these stones and lost when unequipped makes no sense to me. I would rather have 2's progression system over this.
I feel Remake/Rebirth remedied this by giving the characters all their unique abilities. They were now each individually skilled and uniqie and materia is just a bonus.
Though I still hated swapping my healing materia to a different character every time there were forced party changes.
Yeah my biggest issue with the mechanics in the OG was there was no practical distinction between characters. Outside of limit breaks, they had no individuality and could be carbon copies of each other just by switching materia around. They have different stats but the game is easy enough that stats aren't that important - you could run Barrett as a caster and beat the game easily even though he has a low magic stat.
It just makes no sense to me. The Esper system in 6 made more sense, the esper crystals bestowing their experience to characters and permanently learning spells from each one, the big benefit there was also gaining permanent stat increases depending on the esper. Having you suddenly forget how to use healing magic because the materia isn't equipped just feels wrong.
Exactly
I for one think Midgar is a terrible introduction to the game and was done much better in Remake.
OG only clicked with me once i started going out in the world and story also picks up.
I dont get the hype. It seems like antiquated garbage to me. Such a step down from 6.
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I’d agree with that. No other FF has an opening sequence anywhere near as ambitious.
Disagree, while I think stuff slows around Junon, I found Cosmo Canyon and Barret’s backstory and Rocket Town to be some of the best moments the game had to offer.
Certainly the Temple of the Ancients and the Weapons are awesome. Things slow a bit for the hunt for the giant materia imo but nothing too bad.
He’s more a reveal than a character, yeah. Him as his own character is something Square developed in later games.
They’re fun but also left every character feeling samey, just an interchangeable blank entity to swap materia between - 8 has the same problem. IMO 6 handles it better, with a mix of unique mechanics for each character and customisation via Espers and Magic.
Dunno which complaints you’re referring to, but mine are mainly with the writing - Remake drops even the mild subtlety of the original to just shove Sephiroth in your face as much as possible with no buildup or teasing or gravitas. And that undermines the tension and reveals later on in the story.
Interested what mods you used? I would call the game dated, even if I love it. It’s why people wanted a remake to begin with (and why some felt bait & switched when the remake did its own thing so much).
Kinda didn’t like that - they’re so powerful but no-one ever mentions them, not even Shinra’s weapons development lot? Feels like they don’t actually exist in the story or world, and are just a gameplay element that only the player sees.
They were the initial baddies with the early game twist being that Sephiroth is the real baddy. But also Shinra’s role is that they’re humanity meddling in forces they don’t understand and so are quickly way out of their depth.