www.eurogamer.net/nintendo-war-against-switch-piracy-ramps-up-with-two-fresh-cases
Nintendo war against Switch piracy ramps up with two fresh cases
"Hey everybody online, just felt like posting this list of very specific crimes I like to do. Look how cool that is! Don't worry about me tho, I've been totally getting away with it for years. I don't even know how to operate anonymously, I'm just not on their radar and they're too dumb to realize haha. Plus, what are the chances they come after little ol' me? Anyways, you should totally get involved too! Here's my guide:"
Idk. Seems legit. All they were missing was someone saying their list of actions was “official.”
/s
This is every modding community ever because half the fun is that it's a community and operating in secret hampers that
lol being part of the secret club is over half of the fun
I dunno, this one is very different from the Xecutor and Yuzu cases. They started because they were running a business and making money from it. With the r/switchpirates guy I'm not sure that he was, he just ran a subreddit and some "stores" which allowed you to download games directly to your Switch for free.
This basically boils down to the point as to why talk about the emulation/downloading of copyrighted material for free or outside the normal methods or pointing to sources of said material is generally prohibited in public forums. This guy pretty much advertised to the world that he pirates software AND openly spreads the word as to where anyone can find these sources thinking he's immune to copyright law. I know years ago you had to seek out sites on your own that hosted copyrighted software like ROMs and keep a low-key profile about what you do with it.
The internet is an enabler.
The subreddit didn't allow links to ROMs though, you still had to go out of your way for that. It had homebrew guides and discussions about how to set up the firmware, but the actual games were either from dodgy websites or "stores" (you don't pay for the game, but it's like an app on your Switch that lets you download and install directly).
Also, why is no one talking about how reddit basically sold this guy out?
Turns out, and you're not going to believe this, but it turns out that doing homebrew bypasses Nintendo's copyright protection and all of it is a violation of the DMCA if it's not being done by a licensed preservation archive, museum, or library.
Reddit didn't sell this guy out any more than Discord sold out Yuzu. Stop typing your crimes on the servers of corporations if you don't want the smoke
That's beside the point I've made that generally lawsuits like this don't happen unless there is money involved. Bowser sold hacks, Yuzu started taking donations, the mod chip guy in this story sold mod chips and chipping services. To my knowledge, the reddit mod wasn't selling anything or taking any money.
Also, no crime has been alleged here. Stop drinking the kool-aid and trying to make civil matters into criminal.
People like you are the reason things get worse. If you were around in the 80s the public would have lost the VCR battle with Sony.
Promoting piracy is something you can be sued for. There. I used all the right terms for you.
That's not actually established precedent. No one's taken a homebrew case like that through trial yet. It might be likely the courts would decide it's a violation, but they haven't done so yet.
This IS the precedent.
Nintendo can afford to keep you in litigation until your skin shrivels up and you die of old age, just to make a high profile cautionary tale about you.
No one is crazy enough to try to match their legal spend in indignance for the sake of 'rights and freedoms.'
Everyone caves... and everyone who follows them watches in fear.
It's absolutely a threat, and you have little practical chance of paying for a defense against Nintendo lawyers, but that's legally different from a precedent. I think it's important to point out that Nintendo just kind of sidesteps the law entirely through intimidation.
And yet while Reddit banned him they didn't ban the sub for some reason.
I'm a third world piracy maximalist but making a store is definitely the biggest target he put on his back here. I love all the hardware modding projects though and I'm bummed they'll be hampered
Yeah maybe. I never kept up with all the stores, I did get onto one eventually but people have been saying they're all gone. I haven't turned my Switch on in a couple months so I dunno lol.
I'd have a hard time not yapping about the extremely cool things I'm doing too. These projects are awesome for consumer freedom to do what they wish with their purchased hardware. Nintendo has really normalized a sort of IP corpo fascism
Kinda irrelevant: but I like how the article credits Nintendo for the image yet a joycon shell color combo like that has never existed lol
Damn I got excited for a second cuz I really wanted it
Same here I just tried to look it up 💀
You could easily do this combo with bits of Aliexpress
next lawsuit incoming
Reminds me a bit of the Etika Joycons that Nintendo shut down sadly
you mean the ones sold against the wishes of Etika's family that stole Nintendo's art assets and didn't donate any of the money to the family despite advertising using Etika's name and saying it was to 'support Etika and his loved ones'?
I'm telling you, people need to stop being so loud and proud, especially if you got recognition in piracy spaces.
I've no issue with piracy, I do take issue with idiots who put more of a spotlight on it and ruin it for everyone who keep their heads down.
Yeah, regardless of opinions on piracy, I don’t exactly think Nintendo is overstepping their bounds going after people actively profiting off of giving people ways to illegally play software Nintendo currently has on store shelves. Again, not trying to play apologist for multi-billion dollar corporation, but this is hardly a Vimm’s Lair situation.
I take issue against people making money from piracy. I don't know if the main guy in this story actually was, which is markedly different to Xecutor (whose hack was only available if you paid) and Yuzu (who started taking payments right before Nintendo sued them).
I think 99% of pirates agree with you. The remaining 1% are the ones trying to profit from piracy.
Except the vocal minority whining when illicit streaming sites get shut down and their customers are out their subscription fees.
I take issue with people who just don’t want to pay for things and think they’re entitled to it, hiding behind “righteousness.” You don’t steal a car because you can’t afford one, but you do it with games because it’s easy to do. That doesn’t make it better.
Copyright infringement is not theft. Never has been, the definitions have always been different. Theft requires intent to deprive, copyright infringement does not deprive as the copy is a new and separate thing to the IP holder's possessions.
Even with cars, there exists the lesser crime of joyriding, or "taking without owner's consent". This exists because a joyrider doesn't really want to own the car, they just want to use it, and thus aren't really depriving the owner in the same way that theft does.
These are all definitions that were established before you or I were born. What you have learned is wrong.
Copyright infringement isn't even a crime, though, but a civil offense. Excluding commercial copyright infringement, which massive rightsholders managed to get on the books through anti-consumer lobbying. They know that piracy keeps prices lower than they would like, even though the price they have with piracy is still above the fair value of the goods. This is because if they charge too much more people will pirate, whereas without piracy people have fewer options.
If you have to “technically” your way out of a situation, you are probably in wrong
I goddamn hate that thumbnail. Makes me think I can get joy cons in those colors
Technically you can, just not official ones. Shell swaps are a thing and are fairly simple to do if you know how
You could easily make that joy con combo by getting the bits of Aliexpress if your confident changing the shell/buttons
So, while I have nothing agaisnt piracy, It was a really dumb thing the guy did. That is why MAME and other Emulstors were so careful about that. These kids don't look to their peers of the past and think they're hot shit. Well now they're a lesson for smarter clever people.
The moment they put roms on that thing they were essentially selling and profiting off of Nintendo IP which is a huge offense for Nintendo. The crazy thing is they could have been fine! They didn't need to put roms on it! Modding hardware is legal and protected, but selling copies of a company's software without authorization is not legal or protected unless otherwise stated in a software license agreement.
What did he do that was dumb?
Other commenters mentioned, he distributed roms. Just about asking for it.
Yeah but normally people who do that only end up prosecuted if they start charging for it. This is a new step for Nintendo.
It should also be said that the subreddit and ROM distribution have always been separate. You're not allowed to link to or provide instructions for getting ROMs on r/switchpirates, never have been.
It's a sorta situation for both counts.
Sure, you couldn't link rom websites, but the sub did allow talking about shops, and he advertised them in a pinned post.
He also didn't make money from the shop, but he did run the missingdumps crowdsourcing scheme where he would give people access to better shops in exchange for donations.
Piracy is immoral. Why do you have nothing against it?
Piracy is moral. You can't own the games you pay for you need to trust Nintendo to always have them available. For me, from a preservation standpoint its just and justified.
I wouldn't even be able to access my 3ds eshop library if it wasn't for piracy. I wouldn't even be able to get updates for titles I paid money for. Thanks to that I still play my 3ds and Dsi happily today.
Yeah I just don’t get that logic. It’s not game preservation if you are pirating a new game. I definitely pirate old roms to emulate old games, but stretching that logic to new games where pirating actively hurts sales and future prospects doesn’t make sense.
It’s the same excuse they always say. Preservation, but then they’re pirating Breath of the Wild at launch and cackling at Nintendo because they got their $70 game for free.
At least be honest about yourselves lol.
I don’t pretend what I am doing is moral, I just want to play games on my PC.
Yeah the whole Tears of the Kingdom situation kinda blew the lid off that. I hate hate hate how many people on here pirate and act like it’s some high moral act when they just don’t want to pay for things.
They don’t boycott anything else in their life worth a damn, just Nintendo for some reason.
the whole Tears of the Kingdom situation kinda blew the lid off that
What was it? Something like 1.2m verifiable downloads before it actually released? And at a time when emulation of the game was pretty unstable, according to emulator devs themselves.
"Preservation"...
Go buy TOTK v1.01. Since it's so new and popular and was so widely pirated, surely preservation must have been useless and a non-argument. Surely the only way to acquire the best speedrun version of the game without piracy can't be to buy an entire Nintendo Switch secondhand from someone who updated a TOTK install within a one week window before permanently disconnecting the entire WiFi enabled console from the Internet forever.
Lmfao was this supposed to be a good point? You are really are telling me having the 1.01 version of the game on the rom site somehow makes up for millions of stolen copies? As if speedrunners make up even a fraction of players? Good one bro
I can get having different versions but this is such a poor argument. I’m all for game preservation but we are talking about a game that just turned a year old. This isn’t game preservation it’s piracy, it’s readily available.
Ah yes, preservation only matters if it's the newest version. My mistake. It's not like retcons, patches, and rereleases are the main way media gets memory-holed and lost in the modern age or anything. Go buy TOTK 1.0.1, go buy Star Wars where Han shoots first, go buy Evangelion with "Fly Me to the Moon" on the end credits, go buy anything else the creator decided to change after release. Interstitial game versions are even worse than those other examples - official legal licensed VHS tapes of pre "a new hope" Star Wars exist if you care about "waaaah the company's IP rights", but short of selling entire consoles interstitial 3DS/Wii U/Switch game versions cannot be legally transferred from one guy to another guy, no matter how much money someone's willing to throw at Nintendo.
You don't care about preservation and you made that clear. That's fine, not many do. Not many people are interested in content like Supper Mario Broth or The Cutting Room Floor or speedrunning. It doesn't mean that preservation doesn't matter. And yeah, I'll personally prefer a world where one person can get into the item dupe route for TOTK any% that's also a world where Nintendo shareholders estimate a few million dollars of "lost potential profit" from piracy existing over one where the sacred bottom line is protected.
Remember how I said I can see how versions can be important? Then now you are sending me a wall of text going off of something I never said. I agree different versions are important so not really sure where this is coming from. We are talking about specific context here.
I don’t think serving an extremely small subset of customers remotely makes up for the fact of how many people pirated the game. The reality is if most players dumped their games and bought it legally, this wouldn’t have been an issue. You can play 1.01 and still support the devs. That’s what I think you don’t understand.
And I do care about preservation, but I also care about supporting people creating art. Difference of opinion there I guess.
I didn't pirate Tears because I didn't want to pay for it. For many people like me it's because Tears was significantly better on PC. Performance was massively better on PC, resolution was way higher, I had the comfort of playing on my PC, I could mod it, and I could stream the game to my friends. None of these are possible natively on the switch, I simply got a significantly better experience on PC.
Why not buy it, rip the ROM and emulate it that way?
Even if you downloaded the ROM you could have still bought the game as well
Yeah man that’s fine and dandy but I don’t really agree with you. You really aren’t entitled to not pay for the game because it’s not playing at the fidelity you want or within your chosen ecosystem. Modding it to where it’s not even the intended experience. That’s just entitlement imo. You also aren’t supporting the developers at all this way.
But you do you.
I own a switch, I own dozens of switch games. I simply wanted a better experience. Call me entitled all you want but if Nintendo cannot provide the services and features I want, I will go beyond their ecosystem. I don't need to "support the developers", it's a multi billion dollar company that I am already financially supporting.
I've pirated games I already own simply because I want to play games like Mario Party with friends on my PC.
I mean it is entitlement man even if you don’t want to hear it. You wouldn’t steal pasta from a restaurant to finish at home, all the while complaining about the quality from the restaurant.
Everything you just said just further cements that. I have friends who work in the industry, so I guess I just have a different perspective on the importance of supporting art.
You do you but I don’t agree
I didn't pirate Tears because I didn't want to pay for it. For many people like me it's because Tears was significantly better on PC
That's a lie. Emulation at launch was known to be pretty unstable, with the Switch version being the better-performing option at release.
I could mod it
I mean, if you're modding it so early then why even bother in the first place? It's like second-order FOMO, where instead of missing out on a major release you're now worried about other people thinking you missed out on it.
That actually fits pretty well with the excuses I see for people emulating games like BotW and absolutely ruining the visuals in the process. It's as if quite a few people care so much about not leaving themselves open to others saying that they played at higher framerates or resolution that they have to go all-out to get to that point themselves, even when they're so averse to playing the fucking thing that they mod it from the outset.
My favourite one is "I mod the durability to last ten times as long". Why? Why not just remove it entirely? Because they want to fool themselves into thinking they still played the same game.
It's insane.
Buddy, don't tell me it's a lie - I LITERALLY played it. I ran the 60FPS mod with no issues. AMD GPUs had problems but I had a Nvidia chip. The Switch version had horrendous frame rate drops, THAT was well known. Literally a quick Google search will show that. You are seriously coping. I have also no idea what you're talking about when it comes to modding, there's tons of quality of life features and cool model edits you can get from mods.
The Switch version had horrendous frame rate drops
Occasional drops, actually. And, just in case you feel like disputing that fact, "Buddy, don't tell me it's a lie - I LITERALLY played it.".
You are seriously coping
Well, here's a link to the search results page showing emulation issues from the week or so before TotK officially launched. You can see crashes, map issues, UI bugs, framerate issues, visual glitches, save loops, etc., along with people noting the little cottage industry for malware that sprung up as a direct result of people pirating the game and needing to try to fix emulation issues.
It's astonishing how my copium appears to have retroactively materialised so many corroborative search results...
AMD GPUs had problems but I had a Nvidia chip.
They both did, because, as the aforementioned results prove, we're not talking about mere driver issues here.
I think I'll double down on that prior conclusion, given that the evidence indicates that it was correct. You're chatting shit.
Go play Pokémon Brilliant Diamond v1.1 legitimately. I'll send you $70 to do it. There are unique speedrun glitches exclusive to that version, and they make for one of the most interesting glitched playthroughs in modern Pokémon.
Oh, you can't, because the way updates are delivered means that the only versions of a game you can play legitimately are the ones committed to cartridge variants or the single latest version? And if preservationists waited an arbitrary number of years to start archiving and serving content, that version of the game would be lost forever, outside of systems lucky enough to have taken the specific update before being permanently disconnected from the Internet? Huh. Almost like something being "new" and part of a big profitable series doesn't make preservation irrelevant in the modern age.
Just because "you" or "most people" only care about playing the latest game version doesn't make preservation useless. Do most SNES emulator players just grab Mario World and some popular JRPGs? Sure. But does that invalidate the efforts of the preservation groups that did not wait until the SNES was "retro" to dump all the v1.0s and obscure shovelware games that the SNES had? "Nobody normal cares" about Speedy Gonzales on SNES, but a quirk in its code revealed edge cases in the SNES hardware that took decades for emulator developers to properly replicate.
Define "new" and "available". You had a seven year window ever to buy Bayonetta on Smash 3DS/WiiU. You can't buy her in any legitimate way now (even buying a secondhand console with the DLC already purchased is a TOS violation, just like homebrew).
It's even worse for "mid patches". The Switch's OS is actively hostile towards keeping games on lower-than-latest versions for any reason, and there are plenty of reasons to care about those mid-versions. The most obvious and visible one is speedrunning: the only way to buy the optimal speedrun version for Pokémon BDSP, Zelda TOTK, and others is to buy a whole Switch from someone that never updated past that patch, and also never updated the Switch's firmware past that patch (as Switch firmwares have code to not allow old enough versions of games to boot). Say you wanted to see what Bayonetta's original turbo OP pre-nerf SSB4 moves were like and show them to others online. Well, that's a video you aren't going to make with legal methods (remember, buying a console with the right patch secondhand is against TOS too).
If not for people working to dump (and yes, make available to pirates - dumping doesn't preserve anything if the files just rot on someone's hard drive), no interstitial version of 3DS/WiiU/Switch games less mainstream than Zelda or Pokémon would have had a chance of survival. Ever look at stuff like The Cutting Room Floor or SGDQ? Those scenes live or die on understanding weird potentially lost interactions and data. "Most people" have no reason to care about stuff like this, and "most people" are okay with only having access to the latest versions of a game. That's fine. Hell, most people wouldn't care if Smash 4, MK8, Splatoon 1, and every other Wii U game that got a sequel/Deluxe on the Switch just disappeared forever. But some people do care about minutiae that came out a week ago becoming lost media. Good luck getting something like TOTK 1.0.1 dumped after an imaginary "honor period" of however many years some redditor draws the "it's ok now" line at.
I wouldn't even be able to access my 3ds eshop library if it wasn't for piracy.
Yes you can? You can still download any game you've bought on the 3DS eShop
I get whereabouts coming from, but from a media preservation standpoint, howbdo you access the things you didn't buy? What of there's a cult classic, well say Rythem Heaven Megamix as an example, and someone who just bought a 3DS wants to play it?
Sure we can hit up the 2nd hand market, where copies can go for around $150usd. There's always the argument for playing original games on original hardware but there are several thingsbtobworry about here. You're at mercy to the speculative game market where you'll overpay for the title. Then there's the bootleg market to worry about, where I don't mind reproduction carts, you're rolling dice on quality. And in any of this cases, one of the biggest anti-piracy arguments isn't there. The publisher and developers get nothing for 2nd hand sales.
In all that, the "got mine" argument then leaves us back at OPs comment on preservation. So were just going be fine with losing all this gaming history because Nintendo decides it's no longer financially viable to sell titles they host for redownload? And what happensbawhen they close re-download servers entirely? If youbpaid for something you should be allowed access to it. If it was up for sale, someone must have bought it. If it's available for redownload, why not keep selling it?
it boils down to liberal market worship: you arent owed anything. you were lucky to even experience such art/media. you want to have that experience again? then stimulate the market to do so. if you cannot make the consumption profitable to someone, it is immoral.
second hand markets and subscription services are the market solutions to piracy. and as far as neoliberals are concerned, market stimulation is really the only "moral" solution.
That's pretty spot on. The difficult part is trying to set the argument in a way that people who have been, breathing the fumes too long, will accept. All in all I think the profit based model is to blame for the mass erasure of media. It's desirable keep shovelling out half baked, disposable trash is well suited to this.
To support publishers and developers blindly, only lets keeps them in an exploitative patern. Both to the developers and their working conditions and ourselves whobhavebtobpay more for a lesser product. Pick whichever moves you the most.
Yes but if your game has some online related content (dlc quests or spot pass, for example) there's no way to get those without piracy/homebrewing.
And even then, it's only a matter of time before what little functionality remains of the eShop is no longer maintained, what then?
And even then, you can't buy the games, your only other option is to buy secondhand whi is almost always overpriced and doesn't give a cent to Nintendo anyways lmao
Yeah your first paragraph is true, I hadn't really considered that.
As to your second point, you can still download games you've bought on the Wii Shop Channel. I don't think the 3DS eShop is going anywhere for a while.
for a while
How long will it take? If they shut it down in 2025 will that be enough to convince you? 2026? 2027? What’s a reasonable amount of time for you to acknowledge that this business model is BS?
I mean, as far as we've seen they've shown no indication of shutting the Wii Shop down so there's no precedent for how long it'll be up for. For all we know it could be available for ever.
Nice dodge, now answer the question. If you actually believe they’ll never shut it down there’s no helping you
I smash your 3ds that has all your licenses to re-download with a hammer. Remember, 3DS purchases are tied to the individual console itself, not your online account. Now what? If I took a flamethrower to your SNES collection, you could still buy all the carts again secondhand. But with eshop exclusives and DLC, you are completely screwed forever without access to piracy.
I don't EVER want to hear piracy is immoral when companies like Adobe exist. That, or the sheer amount of anti-consumer practices that we have in games now. I'm not saying Nintendo is guilty of that in this circumstance, but these days I would not guilt trip people for pirating.
There is a difference between Adobe, which you might need for work and videogames, where you have bazillion options and you don't even need a single one.
Like I can forgive a teenager who is peerpressured into Fifa, but that poor bugger is very much not the target audience for a $670 piracy Switch.
Piracy is immoral…but so is sticking a piece of gum under a park bench. Not all acts are equally as immoral and I don’t think piracy is that bad. But I’m also not going to say piracy is moral. In terms of actual harm it causes, it’s fairly minimal. It’s not on the same level as stealing, because digital goods are infinitely reproducible. I’m not going to demonize people who pirate, and I think companies like Nintendo take it too far in trying to punish people for it.
Also, though, I get really tired of people claiming piracy is some moral crusade and that it is, in fact, a good thing to do because they are sticking it to capitalism or some dumb shit. You aren’t on a moral crusade, you just wanted free games/movies/music/software. Which, is fine. I mean, you probably shouldn’t, but we all do shit we shouldn’t do, and of the bad shit people do, piracy is fairly innocuous.
Actually fair take, I appreciate that.
Yep that right there, specifically for Adobe. If the people making the product won’t make accessible for everyone, than we have to pirate do to their poor ethics.
Morality is a scam
lol
No it isn’t. Stop running cover for multinational corporations
If Nintendo asks you to stop, stop. They don’t play. Modded hardware had a chance to stop but did not.
As this story gains traction, this is the part everyone is going to slowly forget - Nintendo gave them the chance to simply stop.
"What are they going to do? Sue me?" - says person being sued by Nintendo.
Nothing is really wrong with modded hardware and people need to stand their ground when it comes to defending it. The problem is largely piracy, and also cheating online. We need to keep firm on how we are legally allowed to modify something that is our own property.
Edit: unless you’re referring specifically to the company Modded Hardware, rather than modded hardware in general. I assume now that you’re referring to the company.
The company, yes. I agree that there is nothing wrong with modding, but Nintendo don’t play when it comes to suing companies.
I am mostly saying this to people so they don’t lose their money and maybe freedom. At least be smarter about this wink wink
Nintendo ninjas have been at it since the DS, the fact anybody is bold enough to pirate or leak publicly is insane to me.
There’s something really ironic about selling piracy software.
Neither one was selling any piracy software in this case though. ModdedHardware was selling hardware that can enable piracy (mig switch), and modding services which require skill (soldering).
It wasn't selling piracy software like Team Xecuter did.
Damn I knew the mods over there ran several of those discords. Mentioned that one was asking for payment on the sub and suddenly was banned on all of them.
Well deserved, the guy is a piece of shit.
First, 'precedent' is not a word owned by the legal profession. This is the only precedent you're ever going to see.
Second, Nintendo is not alone. Not one IP owner is ever going to hand you a fair crack at posing a smart defence for ripping off their property or violating their terms and conditions of service. They're all going to go in like a rottweiler, threatening and snarling to drive as many as possible to back off.
Going back to the apt reminder, pirates were viciously brutalused and hung in cages as a cautionary tale for everyone to see without so much as a natty human rights lawyer with cunning interpretations...
Man, I just read the article and what a dumbass.
Bragging about committing a crime is a negative IQ move.
“Nintendo won’t do shit” Famous last words
wat about the 10000000 other ones that they dont know about?
Did Nintendo ask Daly to stop selling modded hardware in general? The article just refers to Nintendo telling them to stop selling modded hardware. I could understand stuff related to piracy, but not stuff to simply mod your switch. The Switch we bought is our own property, and we need someone (preferably Daly in this case) to stand up and defend that we are allowed to legally modify it because it is our property. Modding your Switch is not the same as pirating. Daly can’t give much of an argument regarding piracy, but there are arguments for modded hardware in general.
stop stealing games that are still available for purchase god damn ya’ll need jobs
Piracy isn't stealing and modding your own hardware isn't even piracy.
I'd be happy to pay if it was readily available on pc or on a platform that isn't sub 1080p and 30fps I prefer playing my games at either 3440x1440p 165hz or 4k 144hz. Nintendo resolution and frame rates look horrible on my displays.
If you're that bothered about performance why not buy it, rip the ROM and then emulate it on PC? That's a totally legitimate thing to do. You don't need to pirate games to play them on PC
that’s actually not legal either. you don’t own the encryption key or the proprietary software, you just own a license to play the game. you own a copy of a game, not the right to reverse engineer Nintendo’s encryption data. the moment a Switch game is played on anything other than a Switch console a law is broken. the DMCA laws protect against this exact thing lol. of course no one will know or care if you do it, but it’s definitely not legal.
It might not technically be legal but it's certainly less questionable than downloading the games for free
It's not legal but it's definitely righteous.
I prefer playing my games at either 3440x1440p 165hz or 4k 144hz.
Given that you're not going to find many new games that run at that spec without nuking the visuals, that sounds like bullshit. For example, the six-year-old RDR2 will run at around 100fps on an RTX 4090 at 4k.
I do find it quite funny that you'll shell out for high-end PC hardware, but refuse to pay MSRP on a Switch or buy a new couch rather than a smelly, pre-owned one.
Nintendo resolution and frame rates look horrible on my displays.
But emulating them just means that you get a clearer look at textures and geometry designed for a 1080p display. I game at 4k on PC, and I'll often switch down to 1080p just to avoid things like tiny draw distances from being all to apparent with such a high pixel count.
Do you really expect people to believe that you're getting a better experience in Mario Wonder just because you bump up the pixel count in a game that in no way looks any different when you do so? Or in TotK/BotW, where the grass popping into view a short distance away is relatively well hidden by the default resolution and art style?
again a terrible argument, you aren’t owed anything for your preference. you aren’t entitled to mario party at 120ps just because you prefer that. I prefer a car that does 0-60 in 4 seconds but that doesn’t mean I’m entitled to steal a porsche engine and put it in my mazda. also, the Switch already comes with a screen, no extra display needed.
I personally love straining my eyes and enduring headaches so the corporate ultra-rich can see a few dollars
Millions of people own Switches and have zero problems. I think you're just trying to justify not paying for games.
If you're that bothered by Switch game performance why not buy them and rip the ROMs to emulate?
millions of people own switches and have zero problems
I forgot I'm in the cope subreddit
What does that even mean?
"all of the people that bought switches are just coping because they dont realize how hated the maker of the switch REALLY is"
cop*
straining my eyes and enduring headaches
oh my god these excuses are so tired. ya’ll say the same 3 things to justify not paying for games
Completely ignoring the piracy vs anti-piracy debate, using the Switch screen is a poor choice for several games. Ever try to play Xenoblade Chronicles 3 in portable mode?
Edit: Apparently I need to clarify that I mean that the series is more enjoyable docked connected to my TV using the Pro Controller than trying to see all the elements in portable mode and using the smaller buttons.
Ever try to play Xenoblade Chronicles 3 in portable mode?
I'd love to see how well you emulate it on your 4k-capable desktop while riding a fucking bus...
you’re joking? the XC series and especially XC3 is one of the best optimized games for the console lol. they did such a good job that Monolith Soft was courted to help optimize other Nintendo first parties. the only games poorly optimized for the Switch are the 2nd/3rd party titles where developers don’t bother to optimize their ports out of laziness or lack of resources. The Witcher, BioShick Infinite, Pokemon ScarVio, Ark, are all much better examples of said poor optimization. but no, XC3 is not by any means an example of a game running poorly on the Switch, its gorgeous especially on the OLED.
To play devils advocate here; just because it is well optimized for the Switch, doesn’t mean it runs well. No amount of optimization will compensate for poor hardware.
Also to piggy back off your previous car comment, I feel that this applies; there is no replacement for displacement.
No amount of optimization will compensate for poor hardware.
sure, but let’s not act like a game is unplayable if it doesn’t run at 60fps. optimization means the build is stable and playable specific to the hardware you’re playing it on. the Switch gets a bad rep performance wise because people buy games like the Witcher and then go “this thing sucks” when there are a ton of games that run great on the console. it’s really the developers that need to be better vetted by Nintendo and the barrier for entry to putting your game on their platform should be that it is fully and specifically optimized for the Switch.
It’s not as simple as that. Not everyone wants to throw money at outdated hardware like the switch (which was as also pretty dated when it came out). Nintendo is lazy and stupid for not making stuff more available.
My PC is outdated too, so should i just pirate everything to play it on my smartphone?
Nah the person you're responding to is pretty obviously correct. Don't know why people are being dense Nintendo cops in here. There are so many switch games that are just objectively better experiences on a PC if you have the hardware. It's about having the choice. Being locked on the switch is a major part of Nintendo's business model but it's also a major limitation for consumers. Nintendo wants to dictate exactly how you are allowed to use their hardware and software and we should be opposed to that.
Its not simple as that. Not everywant wants to throw money to build a pc or have time for excessive gaming, the point with nintendo is that they dont make their games exclusively for gamers, most PC gamers ever give a damn about nintendo is zelda, they dont care about other ips, why should they port their games on such a community where everyone just wants to rip them off because of fancy fps? If you think gaming only relies on $$$ and performace then maybe you should stick to those genres where its just a mindless world of digital entertainment, with how AAA games doing recently im pretty sure Nintendo will outlive them with the way they're going, they succeded twice with the Wii and the Switch, they failed twice with the Gamecube and the N64, and gaming consoles dont have to be relied on perfomance to be "revolutionary", its their gimmicks and exclusivetivity that make people love them
This sounds stupid tbh. Piracy is a choice but one that a person must know the risks of and is cautious of.
This logic just doesn’t make sense. If I want a piece of bread, I’m not going to a place I don’t like, to steal their bread, and then finish cooking it in my own oven at home all the while screaming about the quality.
If you don’t want to buy their hardware fine but you aren’t owed anything. Classic gamer entitlement
Doesn't give you the right to play the games for free regardless.
I pay for the games on switch, then I play on PC.
The reason I said it’s not as simple as “get jobs” is because it’s more complicated than that. In huge parts on the world a game costs close to minimum wage. Or stuff might not be available. The reason my generation is into video games and spend tons of money on video games today, is because we pirated games when we were kids and had no money. You can look at it as an investment
Games are a luxury not a right or necessity.
You are right. But locking the third world out of popular culture is not a very good thing.
I pirate games too. However, I’m willing to admit that I want game for free and don’t really go around and brag about it. There are so many things that are expensive in Vietnam, I dont go and blame the company on my financial situation though. I can always buy used games on Facebook or rent a shared account, like most people in Vietnam with Nintendo Switch.
Yeah I feel like this is normal and fine? People who act like pirating video games is Fighting the Good Fight against whatever boogeyman they have in the head are weird as hell.
"Don't pirate games even if you can't afford them" is a rather silly take. They may not be able to pay for it today but they might become a fan and afford it tomorrow. Piracy is harmless if you are too poor or the game is not on sale anymore.
“I robbed a bank to make the down payment for a mortgage with them, you can look at it as an investment.”
That is completely different. Games are often franchises. If a kid gets into a franchise, they might spend money on it as they get money to spend growing up. If they are not into the franchise they will definitely not spend any money. I know I’d rather grow my franchise and take the investment than nothing at all
Yeah, and you’ll be paying the bank over time through future mortgage payments and interest.
Stealing from an agency just because you might provide that agency with more revenue down the line doesn’t mean it still wasn’t stealing.
Do what you want, it’s just a wild take to me to try to morally rationalize it.
I’m not saying it’s morally right or wrong, I’m just talking about how the world works. Mario is the most recognisable media character in the world, because of exposure, not because billions bought a Mario game. I’m sure if you limit the knowledge of Mario only to people that played a Mario game, the franchise would not be as profitable (games, merch, theme parks, etc).
Entire generations of kids became gamers growing up because it was easy to share games in the 90’s. These kids now have jobs and are peppering the video game industry with money.
Also, fuck Nintendo, one of the most cynical companies in the world, who repeatedly fucks over their most dedicated fans
Congratulations on being the 0.0001% of pirates that do so.
Do you have a source on this? I’d love to read into it
The Cemu devs did an AMA on here a while back and I asked them what proportion of their audience is, to their knowledge, using legitimate copies of games via Cemu. They were under no illusion that almost none of them were.
Besides, the TotK release situation showed that people were full of shit on that point. More than a million people downloaded it prior to release - they sure as hell weren't running their own, legally-purchased copy, were they...?
Source: My ass.
But I also live in one of said "third-world" countries (well developing ones) and the vast majority of pirates do not buy their games. Never met nor heard of one that did in the region.
I don't think that guy was saying every pirate buys their games, just that for their generation kids got into franchises where they would purchase the games through pirated copies.
I pay for the games on switch, then I play on PC.
it is as simple as that. you’re entitled to what a company sells. not to dismantle their encryptions and frankenstein it back together just because you think you’re entitled to 900fps ray tracing on every game you play, that’s nonsense and a bad argument. outdated or not the Switch is what’s available for market and every single one of these cases Nintendo will continue to win because you have no right to their proprietary encrypted data.
I never said I’m entitled to what they sell. I said they should release it on more platforms.
ok but that’s never going to happen lol so either buy your video games like a reasonable person or continue to watch these things get shut down en masse.
I am buying them.. But I want them on more platforms. It’s not like I need to buy a Sony blu-ray player to watch a Sony movie, so why should I have to buy a shitty switch to play a Nintendo game. Stuff should be more accessible
blu-ray is an industry wide standard and a medium of physical media. nintendo games are not an industry wide standard, they are exclusive content that you need to buy the console to play. you need a playstation to play playstation games, an xbox to play xbox games, and a nintendo to play nintendo games. let’s stop acting like this hasn’t always been the case so you can justify not paying for things. you’re not better than anyone, 30fps doesn’t give you a headache, and you’re not a “preservationist”. time to grow up
Just because that is how things are now, does not mean that’s how it has to be forever. Why do I need to “grow up”? Just because I don’t want to buy outdated technology and produce unnecessary e-waste? The switch is a cheap toy for kids (which is why it has a cheap plastic screen), it just happens to have some good games as well.
if I own the game I should be able to use that game in whatever format I want.
and its fine that you feel that way but encryption keys are bound DMCA laws, that’s not how proprietary software works. I can’t take a PS5 disc and stick it in an Xbox and then be mad that it doesn’t work. I just have to buy an Xbox. this isn’t new and the gaming industry has always been this way. you want change write a letter, Nintendo owes you nothing
You know what? I'm gonna start [pirating Nintendo games] even harder.
I'm not going to defend or criticize these filings but it amazes me sometimes how much bear poking some of these modders and/or ROM distributors do. What kind of delusion did Yuzu's team have thinking that they could loudly and openly distribute a ROM of TotK before the official release and suffer no consequences?
What kind of delusion did Yuzu's team have thinking that they could loudly and openly distribute a ROM of TotK before the official release and suffer no consequences?
Yuzu never distributed any ROM. Yuzu is a software-emulator (=> a software environment) that translates instructions written for the Nintendo Switch ARM architecture into instructions the system running the Yuzu software can understand.
If a game can still be bought on a Eshop or from the original company for market prices then why pirate it? It’s 60 bucks vs 300 for old games!! Just pay the 60 it’s much cheaper than what you would have to pay in lawsuits!!!
The average Switch pirate isn’t ever gonna face lawsuits and fines lol, as long as you don’t open a platform making paid games accessible to everyone you’re fine
Is ryujinx still alive? That's all I care about.
Yeah they’re doing fine. I’ve personally been using them over Yuzu since it has a higher compatibility list.
well i guess you shouldn't operate actual rom sites
Looks like someone commented without reading the article.
Nintendo's interest in Williams primarily seems to be as an operator of "several pirate shops" through which he offers "massive libraries of pirated Nintendo Switch games", Nintendo's legal filing alleges.
Reading comprehension is hard I guess.
Why not?
Edit: And what the F does it have to do with the linked article? Which mentions nothing about any rom site?
Because distributing a company's games for free is just asking for trouble?
I download ROMs pretty frequently but it's never surprising to me when Nintendo decides to shut them down.
And what the F does it have to do with the linked article? Which mentions nothing about any rom site?
What do you mean? This is right at the top of the article and is clearly about a ROM site
Nintendo's interest in Williams primarily seems to be as an operator of "several pirate shops" through which he offers "massive libraries of pirated Nintendo Switch games", Nintendo's legal filing alleges.
Nintendo's interest in Williams primarily seems to be as an operator of "several pirate shops" through which he offers "massive libraries of pirated Nintendo Switch games", Nintendo's legal filing alleges.
Reading comprehension is hard I guess.
Somebody's gotta do it. You narc now but they the savior of game preservation and make the games available to whole countries that don't have access to the "proper market" for Nintendo's hardware and software. Ultimately these piracy rings are justified in the long term even if affluent first worlders want to feel morally superior in the short term.
If Nintendo had their way, every single emulator developer would be rounded up and placed into a forced labor camp.
All this nonsense about “oh well they had it coming because they weren’t humble/careful/smart enough” and “not like the REAL good emulator devs that I like”, is just coping. Eventually Nintendo will try to sue all of them if they don’t go away on their own. It’s ridiculous to think that this is in any way about principles
Other than Yuzu, which was justified imo, when has Nintendo ever gone after an emulator?
Also, this is nothing to do with emulators. It's entirely to do with distributing ROMs for free
This doesn't effect you in anyway unless you were going to use this persons service. What is the psychological issue of someone who has to project death note fantasies as if they wouldn't be a complete psycho if they had unlimited power over something that has no effect over their life whatsoever.
This doesn't effect you in anyway unless you were going to use this persons service.
The existence of the MIG Switch and its dumping-accessory puts every user of used Switch games at risk of getting their Switch hardware banned. No actual ownership of a modded console, MIG Switch or its dumping accessory is necessary - simply buying and using used games is a risky action.
Taki Udon has an excellent video about this on YouTube, but the tldr is:
Every official Nintendo Switch cartridge comes with a worldwide unique certificate, which the cartridge must present if it wants its software to run on official Nintendo Switch hardware
If a cartridge gets its data dumped, users of emulators so far only needed the game data itself, never the certificate. So two people using the same game data wasn't a problem, because their emulation software wouldn't tell Nintendo (with the same certificate) that the same software is running twice.
The MIG Switch cartridge must present the original certificate to the Nintendo Switch hardware. This means if someone dumps the cartridge, sells the game to a second-hand buyer and then continues to use the dumped data (including the unique certificate - which at that point isn't unique anymore), Nintendo can be informed that the same "unique" certificate is being used and both consoles could be hardware-banned for being involved in piracy.
Oh cool I guess since Nintendo’s evil actions don’t affect me personally, you and me and everyone else should not care at all!! Very cool and intelligent opinion
This will change nothing, if Nintendo continues to give bad service and discontinuing games, it will get pirated
Nintendo has become too big for it's own good, and this is the result
They can spent massive amounts of money to take down one random dude, 1000 more will pop up after that
They really need to start thinking, which they are not doing now
if Nintendo continues to give bad service and discontinuing games
This is absolutely true for older games that aren't available any more but this article is talking about people pirating Switch games.
This will change nothing, if Nintendo continues to give bad service and discontinuing games, it will get pirated
All switch titles are still supported. Some of them may have stopped production but they're all freely available on the eshop
If it changes nothing, why do people cry and moan every time Nintendo takes these sites down? It must have at least some affect.
Nintendo Piracy has always been roughly just as easy. Nintendo tries to keep it from becoming their main competitor, because they know their hardware lock-in model creates a lot of frustration, and if they do nothing it will become the main way people play their games (because it's the best way). So they introduce just enough friction for a layman to throw their hands up and either play something else or buy the hardware. But it will always be a problem, their hardware lock in model makes emulation the natural solution since there's only one version of every game and one platform it works on. And there are whole markets around the world that don't have access to specialized hardware and just use PCs for everything. That's how most of the third world games. Nintendo's model is just at odds with everyone and that makes them the prime target for major piracy operations. Other platforms and companies simply don't deal with this. Because frankly they're not as anticompetitive.
Thank you for an actual respectful and intelligent reply, but it doesn’t answer my question. Why do the people who pirate and say literally nothing changes complain when Nintendo takes action? If it wasn’t affective at at least some level then why do the people who pirate regularly and are certainly no “layman” when it comes to it complaining and getting defensive?
Just release the games on pc… such a lost opportunity. If I want to play BOTW or TOTK and buy a switch Nintendo won’t earn any extra money because I’m not Interested in playing non exclusive titles on that device. And just charge extra whatever the store cut for steam is
Nintendo makes a lot of money on hardware as well as software.
If you buy BOTW and TOTK on Switch you also have to buy the console itself, you'll possibly buy a controller as well. Nintendo makes money on all that other stuff as well as the games themselves, and they'll make more money on the game itself as they won't have to give a cut to any PC distributors.
Sure, there will be people who buy the games that never would have otherwise but there would also be people who would have bought a Switch but then don't because they can get the games on PC instead.
Nintendo will have certainly calculated that releasing the games on PC would be less profitable for them overall, even though the games might sell more copies.
Plus the cut of third party sales.
such a lost opportunity
Is it, though? Nintendo is a business, and businesses like to make money. If they thought that they could make more money by releasing games on PC, they would do it.
I'm pretty sure that Nintendo, the multi-billion dollar company knows more than you do.
Nah. Japanese business culture and old ways is their handicap. There is so much untapped potential for them. Just look at Pokemon, the world’s biggest franchise, yet they are lowering the quality of their product with every iteration and turning people away from the product.
Nintendo's business is the hardware. They aren't Sony or Microsoft circling the drain making losses on their hardware. They are profitable from day one. Either accept it or get out.
That’s a one time profit. And a very small one at that compared to software sales
Not really. They make a profit on the console itself but then also on any controllers and other accessories. Also, by locking people onto their own hardware they make more profit on game sales as they don't have to pay other platform holders a cut
Dude 30% of the software sales of EVERY GAME ON THE ESHOP
They would be morons to encourage people away from their eshop onto other companys digital stores
Nope. It's a large profit since Nintendo designs their consoles to be profitable at launch. And unlike Sony or Microsoft, Nintendo will never port their games to PC. Your choice is either to buy a Nintendo console or not play the games at all.
It’s a “large” one time profit. You earn more from the sales tax on every digital sale on the store
You seen quite angry that Nintendo won't port games on PC. The entire reason for the existence of the first party Nintendo games is to build their ecosystem. If you launch them day 1 on pc you remove a lot of the reason behind why they were made in the first place. Either accept it or don't play Nintendo games at all.
every pc gamers mouthy, jUsT rElAESe iT oN PC! Its their property, and they can do what the hell they want with it, they aint going bankrupt without yall's money
Stop defending a multi billion dollar corporations. They dont care about you other than just ur money. If they released it on PC it would definitely expand the games target audience. Imagine playing Zelda TOTK on steam at a stable 60 fps. Would be a dream but will unfortunately remain unless u pirate it.
Imagine playing Zelda TOTK on steam
What makes you think they wouldn't release exclusively on DRM-free platforms? Or Epic?
Sounds like your primary complaint is that everyone isn't just releasing all of their games on the one platform that you refuse to move away from, even for a moment.
Just release the games on pc… such a lost opportunity
Because then your excuse will switch - pun intended - from "Their hardware is outdated, so I'll pirate their games" over to "They're not making full use of the GPU I tell people I have, so I'll pirate their games". Net benefit: fuck all.
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Another guy who couldn't keep his mouth shut about what he does and being proud of it