news.sky.com/story/second-reform-candidate-quits-and-backs-tories-over-racism-and-misogyny-13162247
Second Reform candidate quits and backs Tories over 'racism and misogyny'
he's advocating for more integration instead of segregated communities.
When has he done that? The word "integration" doesn't even appear in the Reform manifesto.
Of course Reform is going to attract racists
Of course.
Farage is not going to let the far right take over his party.
Well, no, for two reasons. First, he owns it, it's a company not a party, so nobody else can "take over". And second, he's already far-right.
Here's one to get you started
Sure. Not very interesting. A bunch of nationalist pandering, some lies about "lost control", some "please clap for me, I'm great", some bleating about "elites" (yes, from an extremely rich businessman, the irony), and the usual misdirected blame for the state of the country. At least, that's what I got from the bits I could hear, it was pretty muffled from his nose being so far up Nige.
Watch the videos on his Youtube channel. He mentions integration in many of the videos.
You might think having a culture or pride in your country is just nationalist nonsense, but every other country in the world has a national identity and culture. Look at Brazil, a multiracial society with a dominant culture that most of the population identifies with.
Your viewpoint is one of technocracy, typical soulless left wing drivel where we all exist in parallel societies. The more you enforce this mindset, the more divided we become as a nation.
I was part of the urban music scene in the late 90's / 2000's. I directly collaborated with Jamaican and African people to create music that takes input from those cultures. That is what happens when people from different backgrounds work together, you get new culture, British culture. But of course, none of this would matter to you, as you only care about box ticking and labelling people.
Watch the videos on his Youtube channel.
Why would I ignore what's in the actual manifesto?
He mentions integration in many of the videos.
He complains about people not doing it, in his opinion.
You might think having a culture or pride in your country is just nationalist nonsense
Your viewpoint is one of technocracy, typical soulless left wing diversity drivel where we all exist in parallel societies.
Blah blah strawman noises.
Wait what, you are saying complaining about people not integrating is wrong? So that must mean you advocate for people to integrate less.
Ultimately, this is about the fact that someone you don't like has said something that makes sense. Instead of agreeing with him, you disagree solely because you don't like him. That's not democracy, that's putting your fingers in your ears and screaming like a child. Feel free to carry on with this behaviour, you're just giving Reform more voters.
Let's just hope Kier Starmer isn't this narrow minded. If he doesn't listen to the obvious concerns people have, Reform will be running the country in 2029.
Wait what, you are saying complaining about people not integrating is wrong?
I'm going to have to get the crayons at this rate. No, I'm saying that complaining that people don't integrate is not the same as "advocating for more integration". He is using that as one of his reasons to demand we reduce immigration. You were lying.
So that must mean you advocate for people to integrate less.
Blah blah strawman noises.
He has complained about the lack of it and he has also advocated for more of it (integration). His position is crystal clear to me.
However, I can't figure out what your position is at this point. Do you even have one, or are we back to default left wing destabilise the conversation / de-platform the "racists". Honestly, it's like talking to a 5 year old.
he has also advocated for more of it (integration).
Not in his manifesto, which is what matters in an election. It's obviously not something that he cares about, if at all, enough to talk about in that document.
I can't figure out what your position is at this point.
Then maybe you should try asking about it instead of just making shit up?
OK, I'll try. What is your position on integration between communities within British society?
Pro? I don't think integration is helped by screaming at foreigners and anyone who isn't white that they're not welcome. I'm also fairly relaxed about it - first generation immigrants tend to be a bit more insular in a country which offers little by way of help with language etc, but with successive generations that vanishes quickly. We should be looking at how Germany handled a huge influx of refugees in 2015, and learning from that (though obviously refugees are only a very small percentage of immigrants to the UK, it's still instructive).
"I am in no doubt that the party and its senior leadership are not racist.
"As the vast majority of candidates are indeed racist, misogynistic, and bigoted, I do not wish to be directly associated with people who hold such views that are so vastly opposing to my own and what I stand for."
So the party isn’t racist, just almost everyone in the party… this is some mind blowing cognitive dissonance
Are the vast majority of reform candidates racist? Sounds like a great soundbyte but a politically motivated one.
I’m not attacked or defending reform here. I’m pointing out that Georgie David holds two conflicting views.
Either the party is rotten or it’s not. Claiming the party isn’t rotten but most of the people that represent it are makes no sense at all.
Are the vast majority of reform candidates racist?
According to their own candidate, yes.
You know what - I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out the leadership actually aren't racist. They're just more than happy to stoke racism and bigotry, and cash in on it - so they'll gladly play the part. At their core though they equally and indiscriminately despise everybody poorer than them regardless of colour or gender
What a load of complete rubbish 🤣🤣🤣🤣
farage went to 1 of about 47 meetings when he was an MEP... the fact you'd trust him with anything shows either your ignorance or cognitive dissonance.
Who cares?
Right now, I want to set the cat amongst the pigeons at Westminster.
Tories are traitors who destroyed this country. Labour will be as bad and have been previously. LibDems are undemocratic fools. Greens are idiots.
People like you have been doing this for years. Brexit ousted the Tories and inserted Farage’s stooges in their stead, as you well must be aware.
You’ll never get anything tangible as what you want is to feel hurt, slighted, ignored and vengeful.
Like a toddler, as soon as you get your heart’s desire, you will discard it a throw a tantrum for more More MORE.
Putin’s useful idiot.
Ah, so we went straight to Putin?
"eVeRYoNe I dOnT aGReE wITh iS PuTInS UsEfUL iDiOT"
You dribbling cretin 🤣🤣🤣🫵🤡🧠🤏
They're right, though. You think you're starting a revolution, but all you're doing is making things worse. Again.
Again? BREXIT was the best thing we ever did. Sorry if that means you are a sore loser in 2016...
And yes again - how tf do you think that voting Labour or Conservative again, is going to make a damn bit of difference? Wake up for christs sake.
How was Brexit? The best thing? At best it was neutral.
It was a win.
We are no longer subject to the EUP or EUC.
Exactly what I voted for. Thanks for asking 👍😀
BREXIT was the best thing we ever did.
Hooray for deliberately losing 4% of GDP to "take back control" of immigration, to then increase immigration. You didn't get the only thing you lot cared about, it's cost us billions, and you're still pretending it's great. Completely unhinged.
That was the Tories failing to make use of the control they now had.
Brexit was a total win: no.longer subject to the EUP.
As for the shambles that is Westminster, that's why I'm voting Reform! 😅
What am I missing?
The fact that you're talking utter rubbish.
cognitive dissonance: the state of having inconsistent thoughts, beliefs, or attitudes, especially as relating to behavioural decisions and attitude change.
Georgie David believes her party is not racist the people representing her party are racist.
She’s expressing two opposing views. Why is pointing that out “utter rubbish”?
So why is she leaving?
She should stay and be a decent representative.
Also - if we're doing a competition of which party is supported by bigots - that would be most of them. Just look at Labour - Clacton Candidate for one. More than one MP has been booted out at one point or another too.
Why is she leaving? She literally said why. Read the article.
What does Labour have to do with the views of a reform candidate on the reform party?
Try and make some sense.
For the hard of reading/thinking:
The lefty media is making a huge deal out of publishing every negative story about Reform.
Labour are just as bad.
Try to keep up...
So a direct quote from a reform candidate is the falt of the “lefty media”.
And how fucking far right do you need to be to make the claim that sky news is left wing?
And your justification to support racists is because you think another party racist?
So if a reform candidate is racists it’s the media’s fault. If a member of reform calls out other candidates as racist it’s the media’s fault.
If members of other parties are not openly racist. They are just as racists as the openly racist reformer candidates.
This is unhinged but fascinating. Yes I’m struggling to keep up.
Are you thick?
Labour have the same problem but a fraction of the focus from the lefty media.
They're not anywhere near as bad. Reform is a party aimed at encouraging bigotry, labour has a few examples of it slipping out with stupid posts/odd examples.
Those are not the same thing.
Someone jokingly doing a nazi salute is wrong, but it's doesn't make them the same as actual nazis
Her name will still be on the ballot papers (too late to change that), so does that mean the tories effectively have two candidates now?
Presumably if she won she would stand as an independent, but there's nothing stopping her from joining the tories later on.
Remember when people said the words 'far right' and 'racist' and we believed them? Years of labelling working class people through to basic bitch Conservatives as these things have rendered the terms meaningless.
These people will never ever learn.
these things have rendered the terms meaningless.
No, they haven't.
I was wondering how long it took someone to somehow make it a class thing.
This doesn't work. People tried this strategy for over a decade in my country.
Is the party racist in policy? Is the party systematically protecting and excusing expressions of racism and behaviour among its members?
If not, it's probably not a racist party.
If you continue to equate opposition to mass migration of low-skilled disproportionately fighting age males, with often antagonistic views towards the west and diametrically opposed values, with racism.
You'll lose. People don't stop noticing patterns just because you insult them over it.
People don't stop noticing patterns
Like Reform candidates being dropped when it turns out they're massive racists?
Yes, exactly that. That pattern goes against the point you're implicitly trying to make.
What point is it you think I'm "implicitly trying to make"?
That Reform UK is a racist party, and that if you vote for them you're in support of racism.
I'd say it's broader than just racism, but let's go with that. How does the fact lots of them have been revealed to be racists, friends of fascists, conspiracy theorists, misogynists, etc, go against that point?
Because as you already admitted. They're routinely removed from the party, by the party.
Politics and power attract malcontents and fringe people of all sorts.
That a new party, that's in the process of setting up its party infrastructure and that rapidly has to fill positions, will end up with a higher number of crackpots and cunts (especially since it's a heterodox party, that's anti establishment/migration) is simply sadly to be expected.
It's not proof of guilt until said party actually does something to signal its willingness to deliberately attract and harbor these people. Reform seems to be doing the exact opposite, which is good, right?
They're routinely removed from the party, by the party.
They're routinely removed from every party, by that party, when they're found. There appear to be a lot of them found in Reform.
new party
But it's not really new, and you know that. It's been around since 2018. That's plenty of time to weed out "crackpots and cunts"
Reform seems to be doing the exact opposite, which is good, right?
Yes, far better than knowing about them and letting them remain. However, these people are attracted to Reform, and presumably that's because they think Reform aligns with their views.
But it's not really new, and you know that. It's been around since 2018. That's plenty of time to weed out "crackpots and cunts"
2018 is brand spanking new in terms of political parties.
Yes, far better than knowing about them and letting them remain. However, these people are attracted to Reform, and presumably that's because they think Reform aligns with their views.
I'm sure they think that.
I think we need a lot less immigration, because under its current form it's causing more harm than good to society. I'm deeply disatisfied and distrusting of our current political system.
This other guy thinks we need a lot less immigration because he believes that non-whites are inferior beings. He hates the political system because "it's all run by the jews".
Are we the same?
Extremists push where there's mush. It's not shocking to me that nazis end up in parties critical of immigration. It's the same reason for why islamists end up in green parties all over the continent. It's not primarily because of alignment of ideals and values. It's pragmatism.
2018 is brand spanking new in terms of political parties.
Not that new. They managed to recruit over 600 candidates in 2019, even if they eventually did rob half of them of their deposits and not run them. And the entire leadership and membership of Reform overlaps almost perfectly with the leadership and membership of UKIP, which was around for decades. Pretending they're new is pathetic.
I'm sure they think that.
Why do you think racists and fascists think Reform aligns with their views, and Reform selects so many of them to be candidates?
Are we the same?
Let's talk about vague nonspecific third parties, I don't want this to descend into accusations and playing the victim. The first guy is couching their dislike of foreign people in vague allusions to "harm", the other guy is honest and direct. So, no, not necessarily the same.
Do you agree that someone who believes what the second guy believes, but wants plausible deniability against accusations of racism, could easily be found to say exactly what the first guy says?
They’re removed when the media catches them being racist. Farage’s personal corporation masquerading as a party has no interest in removing racists proactively, otherwise there’d be practically no one left in it.
Is the party racist in policy? Is the party systematically protecting and excusing expressions of racism and behaviour among its members?
You appear to have written your comment expecting that people will read these questions, think of Reform, and answer "no." Bizarre.
Also, when did this "fighting age" remark become a thing? It applies to anyone likely to be relocating to work and is nothing more than a hollow scare tactic. Are we supposed to imagine a bunch of brown guys forming battalions on the beaches of Kent?
I wasn't expecting much more than to burn some time online pointlessly debating with people, something I enjoy doing for some reason.
So, how is the party racist in policy, any specific policy you consider racist?
Fair it's a bit loaded of an expression. Look "If you continue to equate opposition to mass migration of low-skilled disproportionately fighting age males, with often antagonistic views towards the west and diametrically opposed values, with racism".
Obviously we're not talking about hard working and competent migrants who come to work here. Almost no one has any issues with that subset of people.
how stupid are these people?
Everyone with a brain knows that Reform is a reincarnation of the Brexit party, which is a reincarnation of UKIP, which is an reincarnation of the BNP.
Are these people really so politically ignorant to have not understood that? These people are scum.
You get all of your news from the mainstream media and question none of it. The definition of an NPC
It must be the BNP link which has upset you as the rest of the comment would not be argued by anyone, including the Reform leadership.
BNP links of certain Reform members, is a matter of record, and has been cause for the leadership to expel several from the party.
Prominent ex BNP members like Tommy Robinson openly support the Reform party. You can hear this in their own words on youtube.
Still, you could say that a few bad apples does not a party of right wing football hooligans make.
So what could we make of the claim that Reform is the spiritual child of the BNP, in that it has inherited their policies. BNP's first reason to exist was grievances about immigration. Reform's first reason to exist was grievances about immigration.
So we have commonality in terms of members and policy. But still one thing, the BNP and EDL's membership had that nucleus of career football hooligans. Here we might have an actual distinction. I can clearly tell Farage, Tice and Bull, have not and could not last 10 seconds in a street brawl. So here we have it, the Reform party are not career football hooligans.
The NPC MSM thing, you are both reading the same media, Reddit, so if he is an NPC, you are. Doesn't seem like a well thought out insult.
Who should a right wing person support? Not the Tories, so naturally they'll move from one anti immigration party to the next since there's only really one at a time. If that's not allowed there's effectively no political opposition to globalism
It's a fair question and I don't have a good answer. There must be similar questions being asked all over Europe, countries where the radical right wing parties have a direct lineage with something a little more sinister than the BNP. There, here, you, for many the answer will be the same, ignore the darker aspects of the radical right party and vote for them anyway. I'm not naive enough to think I can convince you to vote for anyone else.
Some personal toughts. Globalism, its main component is trade, Britain will not survive without it, we couldn't even feed ourselves. Immigration, I hope that both next Labour government and Conservative opposition will dial back immigration to avoid ever increasing support for Reform, ensuring their own survival and political stability. In future, if economy is turned around, where there is consensus, and without the permissiveness of the current system, immigration might be increased again. I want immigration where it helps the economy or provides sanctuary to our friends in Hong Kong and Ukraine, but with zero tolerane for crime and religious extremism.
Depends on what you mean by “right wing”. Someone who just wants rich people to pay less tax and make everyone else’s lives miserable? Tory. The same person who’s also a knuckle dragging loon or a racist, Deform.
Like many progressives (usually young) you fundamentally don't understand the other side. It must be nice to live in a world with no ambiguity, people either agree with you or are evil/stupid
If someone is voting for a serial grifter, they are stupid, yes - this isn’t very difficult. Voting for Farage is like lending Bernie Madoff fifty quid. At this point it’s your own fault he’s conning you again.
Like many Reform voters (usually old and thick) you fundamentally don’t understand how the world works - which is why you love simplistic answers from conmen and will vote for them time and time again.
It's great you've got it all figured out!
Thanks little buddy, you’ll get there one day. Maybe after your conman hero does literally nothing once again this time.
If all the racists are voting for one party, I would not want to be associated with that party regardless if I wasn't a racist myself.
So yes, to some degree I do find people voting for reform either uneducated in what the party hides in its underbelly, or just unpleasant people. There can't be other choices really. You're either OK with voting for a party with all the racist support and a history or racist ties, or your somehow unaware of it
That sort of implies that if Reform wasn't standing, but the BNP was, right-wing people would have to vote for them. You don't have to move further right. You could vote independent, or spoil your ballot. Reform are clearly incompetent. Their manifesto is uncosted because they know they'll never have to deliver it.
Okay then. I'm concerned about very high levels of immigration. Feel free to call me a racist. Who do you suggest I vote for? Or should I just spoil my ballot?
User deleted comment
4d
The Tories deserve zero seats!
You've been grifted.
Reform won't give you what you want. They have no intention of doing so. Spoil your ballot.
Sigh….go on then, give us the links to tH3 tROof.
You forgot the EDL.
What did she expect?
If racism is your primary political philosophy the Tories and Reform are your natural parties to join. With Reform being more right towing and more racist. Who are annoyed that Brexit hasn't caused a massive emigration by POCs and that they haven't been kicked out.
Racism is wanting control over immigration? Reddit classic
There are different reasons for wanting to control immigration. Some want it because uncontrolled immigration increases house prices and rents, increases the burden on public services, transport etc. Other people want it because they don't want to see any foreigners. There are lots of areas where people dislike white british people from London as they buy up all of the houses and want local houses for local people.
Racism is wanting control over immigration?
No, racism is wanting to end immigration because you don't like foreigners. Racism is willingly damaging your own economy just to keep other people out. Racism is lying about the "great replacement" conspiracy theory. All things Reform as a party, or its candidates, support.
Lying? Current projections see ethnic Brits a minority by 2066. I don’t see any let up on immigration, so how is this a lie?
I guess the conspiracy is that it's an intentional plan (the objective being to eliminate British people). Maybe that's what they are calling a lie.
Frankly people are uncomfortable discussing the fact that ethnic replacement is taking place as a result of political policy (and is doing so in most of western europe). So they try to shut down the conversation using guilt by association.
The average person isn't using "ethnic replacement" as some dog whistle for beliefs in jewish cabals, globalist conspiracies and space lizards.
They're simply discussing a statistical fact.
Bingo.
And what if the response is and so? Ethnic Britons will be a minority by X? So what? I think less migration would be good but my bigger issue is the quality of people we are letting in and the failure to assimilate the people who have been let in. And before someone cries, I'm sure most of the people we are letting in are fine but it's the ones who aren't that we then fail to deal with that I take issue with.
Then that is a perfectly valid response. You're pefectly fine thinking that ethnicity doesn't matter at all, and that no ethnicity is entitled to continue existing as a majority population in lands they've historically inhabited for generations.
The problem is that the counterview is not accepted, even though it's just as valid (and in fact more common globally).
I'm somewhere inbetween. Even putting aside all the negative consequences for society as a whole, one has to admit that there is a severe democratic problem underlying it all.
I care more about culture than ethnicity. I get people come here for different reasons but that's why I think assimilation is important. Unfortunately we failed to have a proper immigration policy and stop ethnic enclaves from forming. I'm not saying I believe it will happen, but it's not difficult to see why people wouldn't want the UK to say fall under Islamic law in the future. I would personally see that as a negative evolution of our culture and society. On the other hand I think very few people would complain about good access to decent curries.
I do too. If a truly multicultural society meant only the positive aspects of various cultures. I think very few would be against it. But as things currently stand, that lovely food comes with a side order of gender discrimination, homophobia, sexual violence and religious fundamentalism.
For assimilation to work, there must be a greater whole to be assimilated into, with incentives to actually assimilate. We risk losing that in the long term if we continue on like today.
Frankly people are uncomfortable discussing the fact that ethnic replacement is taking place
Because it's not. No white people are being replaced. If 1 billion people of a different race magically appeared in the UK tomorrow, white people wouldn't somehow stop existing. Even if you don't buy into the conspiracy theory nonsense, the demographic panic is still moronic.
I think that's a very reductive argument.
If you were to drop 100 million Russians into the UK tomorrow, then for all intents and purposes, the UK no longer exists. You'll have diminishing and segregated areas that bear a sleight resemblence to what the UK was, surrounded by what is now Russia in both form and function.
The Brits obviously wouldn't just go up in smoke. But they would have been replaced as the majority population of the UK, and with that they'd lose the option to politically shape the UK as a whole. They'd now be at the mercy of a different culture, with different values steering the country in a vastly different direction.
I think that's a very reductive argument.
No, the "great replacement" is a very reductive argument.
The Brits obviously wouldn't just go up in smoke.
Exactly. So not "replaced". Just having to share.
with different values
What values do you have that you think people who aren't white brits don't have?
If by "great replacement" you mean the fringe alt right conspiracy, then yes. It is reductive. Do you think it's attributable to me and what I've written here so far?
Exactly. So not "replaced". Just having to share.
They would have been REPLACED as the majority population, and thus their ability to meaningfully impact the evolution and direction of their society irretrievably diminished, if not outright lost.
C'mon it's faulty logic. "There's still native americans, so they obviously weren't replaced".
"Palestinians weren't replaced in Israel, they were just forced to share"
(Comparison of logic, not like for like).
What values do you have that you think people who aren't white brits don't have?
The differences in value systems aren't color based. I used Russians as an example for a reason.
Lying?
Correct.
Current projections see ethnic Brits a minority by 2066.
No, they don't. One projection does, whose author is a long-time opponent of immigration and long-time supporter of eugenics. Nice chap. And the great replacement is not just an observation of trends, it's a conspiracy theory about that being a deliberate sinister plot.
I mean, I don’t think it’s a sinister plot, but there’s weight to it. Gone from 99% ethnic British in 1980, to 81% in 2020. Immigration numbers have only risen, thus the 2066 prediction. The amount of posts on here from you trying your hardest to demonise Reform indicates our conversation will be about as useful as smashing our heads into a brick wall…We should leave it here.
I don’t think it’s a sinister plot
Good, that means your brain is still working. You are apparently not qualified to be a Reform candidate.
but there’s weight to it.
No, not really. It's little more than ignorance in support of bigotry.
The amount of posts on here from you trying your hardest to demonise Reform
It takes no real effort to "demonise" people who say racist and bigoted thing.
our conversation will be about as useful as smashing our heads into a brick wall
You spent more time crying about me posting things than saying anything useful, so I agree with you here.
You demonise by twisting and pushing a narrative. Calling people stupid for having valid concerns, straight from the tolerant left cookbook. I’ve given plently of evidence as to why replacement worry is a thing, apparently your educated response is “no, not really, you’re just a bigot”…
Everyone is a bigot/racist in your world. Luckily, most of your “world” is online constantly crying about Reform. Rather live in my world, a real one.
You demonise by twisting and pushing a narrative.
No, they demonise themselves by being racists and scumbags.
Calling people stupid for having valid concerns
I don't think I called anyone stupid. More of that lying you lot are so fond of.
I’ve given plently of evidence as to why replacement worry is a thing
No, you've alluded to one (cherry-picked) projection, and then pretended we're talking about "replacement worry", which is not what we were talking about.
apparently your educated response is “no, not really, you’re just a bigot”…
Hmmm, another lie. I'm seeing a pattern here.
Everyone is a bigot/racist in your world.
No, just the bigots and racists. Most people still find those things abhorrent.
You can’t even understand half the complete dribble you type. “Never called anyone dumb” when you implied reform voters have no brain. Using statistics and forecasts, that projection seems more valid than some cry baby on Reddit saying “nuh-uh!!!!”
I’m talking about it because you also implied the only reason people vote reform is for racist reasons, when not wanting to be ethnically and culturally replaced is a valid concern. That’s apparently racist? Mass immigration is a worry, maybe not for someone of your ilk that only interacts with people online, but it is for the majority of Brits.
Every party has knuckle draggers. Labour has its fair share of racists, so do the Tories, and every party. More Labour members have been booted since 2019 for racist/bigoted beliefs than Reform…Who cares though, Reform is the boogeyman coming to kill all those who oppose!!! Heil Farage!!!!!!! Sieg Heil!!! Sieg Heil!!!
Link?
Experts in the field of demography, including Professor David Coleman of the University of Oxford, predict that if immigration and fertility rate trends continue as they are doing, then the "White British" will be a minority (less than 50% of the population) in the United Kingdom by the year 2066.
Link?
Want me to hold your hand anymore? David Coleman has an entire website with archives of his work.
Link?
You don’t seem to get how this “persuading someone I’m trying to convince that I’m not just pulling stuff out of my arse” thing works.
You’re trying to offer a factual-based rebuttal; just link to the documentation.
I’m not trying to convince anyone, make your own mind up. Certainly not holding the hand of a snarky Redditor. If anything, i’m looking to be disproved. I’ve only been called a bigot/racist in retort.
Do you have a link to prove this claim? I've seen an interview with Farage and he's not mentioned anything you say.
Farage knows how to tow the line, dipping a toe one here and there to try to move the line.
Don't just listen to what he says, look into his history, you will find he was a proud fascist as a younger man. You will also find he has said and done many racist things.
Most of the time, yes. Seeing as most of the people who want this start talking about "cultural differences" and "British values" when you press them. Both of which are fascistic euphemisms for "these people don't belong here because of their race/ethnicity".
Not "classic reddit", it's classic fascism everyone is too historically illiterate to notice. They sincerely believe this time the people who want to get rid of the foreigners are the good guys.
Well it's a fact that if you import a million people a year they will never assimilate and thus never adopt British values and instead create urban communities full of trojan horses.
This is exactly what supporters of every fascist regime sincerely believes. You understand that right?
You understand that if you walked around 1930s Germany the supporters of the Nazi party would say exactly the same thing, right?
Please tell me that you understand that basic historical fact, and then please explain to me why you believe things are different this time and why you aren't the bad guys.
The last properly diverse nation I can remember was Yugoslavia, how did that end? Ah right…Ignore that, guess I’m just a fascist…
And was it the tolerant people who were happy with multiple races sharing an area who started the ethnic cleansing of Bosnia?
I understand that comparing everything you don't like to 1930s Germany is lazy and tired.
OK so no response at all?
And yes, if we want to not repeat the mistakes of the past we have to look to history. So please explain to me why your beliefs are not fascistic and why you are not the bad guy that Britain will have to defeat again?
You don't even know my beliefs I have no reason to explain anything to you?
You genuinely think that anyone who opposes the current scale of migration into this country is a nazi. You will be suprised to find that based on that criteria the majority of the country would be nazis. Get your head out the sand.
You'll find that's not true & the irony is that you are exhibiting the tell tail signs of "everyone who disagrees is a secret bad person".
You seem to lack the self awareness to recognise that fascism relies on othering people and you've fallen into the trap.
What is not true? Please explain this to me.
All you lot can do is write what I'm saying off, but none of you can respond.
fascism relies on othering people and you've fallen into the trap.
Othering people due to immutable characteristics. Like gender, race, sexuality, nationality, etc. Not people's behaviour or their beliefs.
You know the Nazis went for their political opponents & communists first right?
Their followers believed burning communist literature was good because the communists were evil bad people.
Are you able to self reflect or do you honestly lack the ability?
Are we (the population of the UK) burning Reform literature? I'm sure someone has, or would if it was winter. But strongly disagreeing with people based on political opinion is hardly putting people in concentration camps for having different political opinions.
I don't know what you'd call reform literature, there was a post man who was caught breaking the law with reform campaign materials.
Given that would be a disruption of democracy, that would count as a fascist behaviour.
The point however is that the other user is accusing others of doing something that they are in this case exhibiting the closest behaviour to.
You can't complain about fascists while acting like a fascist, you only create more fascism.
At the top of the Nazi party and the Nazi membership, yes.
But if you spoke to a civilian Nazi supporter in the street what would they tell you?
Are you able to self reflect or do you honestly lack the ability?
Stop trying to talk down to me and address my argument.
They would have told you that the communists were bad / evil.
The Nazis used the communists as one of the biggest justifications for their actions.
I am addressing your argument and trying to make you see that you're weirdly doing the action you accuse others of.
Do you think there's any chance the people disagreeing with you might just know something you don't?
r/england classic is that when someone points out the racism that follows Farage like a bad smell anywhere he goes you reply "ohhh so wanting any immigration control is racist now, is it?!"
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Reform are the only party offering net zero migration, this is why they are popular. Reddit are desperate to brand Farage as a racist. Maybe he was back in 80's, but today, he is definitely not a racist, he's advocating for more integration instead of segregated communities.
It's weird that the left think that anybody who isn't White is not allowed to be against immigration. We are all British, regardless of ethnicity. I grew up in a multicultural area and know a lot of Black people and Asians. Almost all of them are moaning about immigration. They all voted tory and Brexit on this one issue, and many are now voting Reform.
Of course Reform is going to attract racists, but that doesn't mean that normal people can't vote for them. It's like saying you can't fly the England flag because the EDL use it. Farage is not going to let the far right take over his party. If you actually watched Reforms videos, you'd realise this for yourselves.
Here's one to get you started: Zia Yusuf Full Speech - Rally for Reform UK 30th June 2024 (youtube.com)