First 50k Advice

Training

I signed up for a 50k and have been sticking to the plan. Until the last few weeks between traveling out of the country, home life, and my masters degree projects, training has been less of a priority than previously. I’ve been hitting about 1/2 of the weekly mileage. A “test” marathon was prescribed over the weekend and things went as expected up until my “half way/refuel station” at mile 15. I achieved a 9:30 to 10min/mile pace which is very normal for me. I changed socks, applied aquaphor to my feet, refilled my water and was out. Around mile 20, my legs were heavy and joints were feeling it. I was in the hurt locker. I did a fast walk/light jog getting about a 13min mile from mile 20-22. At mile 22, I started walking. The walking continued until 26.2 which was home for me.

I feel pretty defeated and upset with myself during this. I feel my nutrition was decent? Water in one flask, Gu Roctane in the other, Gu gels every 45min to hour. Maybe some real food would have been better? I just felt not in shape at all for this attempt. My 50k is in 6 weeks and I’m wondering how do I shift from focus training to prevent a DNF.

in Ultramarathonby thinkingoutloud-17

81%

1mo

Simco_

100 Miler

1mo

I’ve been hitting about 1/2 of the weekly mileage.

I think you know your answer.

thinkingoutloud-17

1mo

I appreciate the reality check.

GreenLights420

1mo

You’re doing it man. It might not seem like it now, but you’re on the path. I’d suggest going out slower. A 50k is a fairly long ways, and you need to secure the distance before the time. Take walking breaks. Walk hills. Get 400 calories a hour. Chat up random people. Take pictures. Dont think about finishing. Just endure. And if you feel good after 25 miles, feel free to dump energy at the end. But I always think the main things are pace and mantras. I cant tell you how many people have blown by me early, only to bonk and get passed 5 hours later. This stuff is fun man. Ultras are the best. Throw the time goals out the window and enjoy the journey. Finishing an ultra seems cool, and it is, but eventually it becomes your least favorite part of the experience. Troubleshooting is par for the course. And the training runs are exactly that. Sometimes you learn your nutrition sucks, other times you learn you need more strength, or cardio, better gear, etc. Keep getting better and keep things in perspective too. You dont have to do this - you get to do it.

jrexpaver

1mo

This is the way! Just finished the Gorge 50k and was stoked to just preserve my body and enjoy the first 20ish miles. I felt pretty darn good and picked up the pace towards the end to finish at a fast 7 hours. Good shit.

suntoshe

100 Miler

1mo

Do you know that a 9:30-10:00 min pace is "normal 50k pace?" for you? Sounds like you went out too fast and blew up. A good lesson.

Also remember that one training run is not a good barometer of fitness. There are so many variables that go into our performance on any given day that you shouldn't put too much stock into any singular outing.

thinkingoutloud-17

1mo

For me 9:30 to 10 min pace is a heart rate of 125-145. My max heart race for this run was 165.

69kylebr

1mo

I’m finding out volume seems to be key. The more you run in a week the better prepared you will be.

professorswamp

1mo

6 weeks is still enough time to turn it around.

You got to feel the suck when things don't go your way during that training run. That's part of the experience. you are now stronger because of it and ready to smash the rest of the training block.

I'd question if you really need to stop and take off your shoes during a 50k especially if you are expecting to do it in 5-6 hours. unless you are specifically having an issue i wouldn't take my shoes off.

jatmood

1mo

What's your mileage per week?

ColoradoHollow

1mo

9:30 avg would have placed you 3rd overall at last year's PM2HR 50k.

Blue_Pickle_57

1mo

I’m starting on my first 50k as well and I just want to say that even if you walk across the finish line, you finished it! Don’t beat yourself up over one training run that you did indeed overcome the mental barriers to complete, even if it wasn’t as fast as you’d have liked. Keep staying consistent and mindful with your nutrition, hydration, and rest, and you’ll be golden by race day. Half the battle is mental so stay tough :)

P.s. to address your actual question - I find a mix of solid food and gels is best for me because it gives me more energy and I look forward to the next snack!

thinkingoutloud-17

1mo

Ran into a runner who is 73, he told me ultra running is 95% mental and the other 5% mental. I enjoyed his other words of wisdom.

I have a pretty reasonable stomach, I will try some carb/protein based snacks on runs and see how I feel. Any suggestions?

amyers31

1mo

That wall you hit really isn’t going anywhere. Don’t question whether it’ll come or not but hope that it comes sooner than later so you can work through it. Control what you can by eating, hydrating, getting in electrolytes, and taking care of your body/feet and be ready to problem solve.

Last weekend I just took on back to back 50k’s in prep for my 100 miler. Friday night I felt like shit. Hammy bothered me at mile 8, legs felt like bricks at mile 12, but job got finished. Wasn’t pretty but got it done in about 7 hours in my local trail with about 4k feet of gain. Turnaround time was less than 12 hours, I got 3 hours of sleep, had a 4 hour drive and Saturday morning I was off again but this time in an actual race. Harder course terrain but race environment, I felt great all day Saturday and finished in about 6 hours 45 minutes on a course with 5k feet of gain.

So know that race day energy will help. Don’t get caught up in someone else race, do you. Let conversations carry the miles away, control what you can, and you’ll have a good day out there.

scrotumpop

1mo

Okay deep breaths. You’re not going to dnf if you have already ran a marathon.

Glaring Things to improve:

Mileage. And One gel every 45 minutes is not enough in a marathon let alone an ultra. Should be shooting for 400 calories an hour which is 4 gels. Sounds like a lot and it is and it sucks and you get sick of it so experiment with different flavors brands textures chews etc. also try real food like bananas and honey stinger waffles, things like that.

Edit to add: what is your weekly mileage supposed to be and what is the half of it you’re hitting? Not all plans are the same so that will give people more info to work off of. Also what is your longest run prior to the marathon test?

catnapbook

1mo

Not an ultra runner yet, but did have a bad run on my marathon. Heat, nerves, and forgetting to fuel were all a part of it I’m sure. I came in second to last.

In my training I had had some really good long runs and some really crappy long runs. Luck of the draw sometimes I think and not all runs can be good. Greg McMillan has a nice video on which runner of yours showed up today and how to adjust for it.

By the halfway point of the marathon I knew I was having a crappy run and all that I could do was embrace it as such. It was disappointing to not have a great run for the day, but being able to recognize it as a crappy run really helped. I just had to power through it mentally. And I did.

You may be able to turn your thought process around. While you physically didn’t have the best time, your emotional and mental fortitude kept you going! You’ll need that strength for your ultra and you were able to prove it to yourself. That’s a big thing.

I’m sure others with more experience can offer you the advice you’re more looking for. Personally, I’m impressed with how you managed. You adapted as you needed to for your circumstances. There’s an intelligence there that a lot of people don’t have.

All the best and fingers crossed you have a great run for your ultra.

thinkingoutloud-17

1mo

Thank you for the positive words. In all, this was just a training run. As you referenced a lot was learned from this attempt. Fueling strategies, emotions/physical fatigue, and embracing the suck. Training will continue, I think I know my own answers to a lot of questions. But the perspective of others is beneficial in my eyes. Cheers.

Weird-Effect-8382

1mo

I hit a fairly steep (6500ft of vert) 50k this weekend with approximately 4 weeks of running this year 2024 but lots of skiing- I definitely was walking the up hills- running the downs and runwalking the flats- I’m out of shape- and the actual running is what killed me, but I still managed sub 7 hrs (2.5 hours behind the winner!) - but it really should have been quite a bit faster if I had run more than 125 miles in training- I have a 70 coming up in 6 weeks, and while it may not be a PR it’ll help me build back to decent fitness and continue it until hopefully my first 100 this fall-

all that to say, don’t stress it, go run- do the plan- walk when needed, and have fun with it, it’s not that far- you literally just did it this weekend- and it’s way harder without aid stations and other runners. Besides, you have 6 more weeks before the actually race- that’s only a few more miles- work on your fluids and nutrition- if it’s warm- you may not be getting enough electrolytes- but just have fun- it’s not that far and you can finish it just by run walking it in- but you are already killing it

tom-choad

1mo

holy shit. you barely trained for a 50k with 6500 ft of vert and still finished sub 7? that's fucking superhuman my man.

Weird-Effect-8382

1mo

I appreciate that but felt it was pretty meh, I wasn’t even in the top 50% but nearly 65 days of skiing and working on the ski hill at least helped keep the legs strong for the ups and downs- maintaining a jog on the other hand sucked and was my biggest weakness.

but I think the biggest thing I was trying to do was encourage OP that he’s got it, it’s gonna suck at times, it may hurt at times, but if it’s a trail race- leave the music behind and enjoy the moments- talk to people and share miles and see how it goes. Eat calories, take salt as needed, and drink plenty of water and electrolytes. My first race ever (70 mile trail race) I was told shoot for 3-400 calories per hour and finish all my fluids by the time I got to the aid station, and my body would keep going long after I wanted to quit. And it’s true- you’re got this, just embrace the unknown. You’ve already done a long run and truth is, you’re probably trained up just haven’t learned how to fully pace yourself. I’d bet you could finish a 50 miler to 100k by the time the race day comes around.

Also real food makes the day better- chips- pbj- perogie-broth-bacon- makes it all better- and soda is calories too-

tom-choad

1mo

I learned the importance of fueling way too late. I ran multiple marathons while barely eating anything. Once I learned how to properly fuel during a race, it was a massive game changer. (I'm honestly not sure I even know how to "properly" fuel during a race, but at least I'm eating more).

RIP_shitty_username

1mo

Not helpful, but what training plan are you following?

GunnarNils

1mo

Dont be discouraged. You're doing great. Its extremely common to hit a wall and have pace slow down roughly around mile 20. My first few 50k races all went like that no matter how well I tried to pace myself in the beginning. Keep spending time on your feet. Remember the race is going to be likely 7-10 hours of constant movement. Think less about mileage and more about hours on your feet. Now is the time to play around with your fueling as well. Get it dialed in. Try fueling more and see how your body responds. I like to focus on the amount im fueling per hour. Over time, ive found the sweet spot for me is 300-350 calories/hour. This will vary for everyone. Lastly, id suggest backing off your pacing at the start to something that might be more manageable for you. Try 10:30-11:00 for the first 15 miles with more aggressive fueling. Good luck! Stick with it.

strangefellow77

1mo

I think you’ll be fine if keep listening to your body. Nutrition is key too.

I’m in the same boat and my 50k is in almost 4 weeks. I’m planning to walk a lot!

chroomchroom

1mo

You're perfectly fine. Just keep training and you'll finish easily. My longest run was 17.5 miles 2 weeks out from my 50k due to missing 2 MONTHS for a hip injury. I ran probably a marathons worth and walked the rest. Finished in just under 7 hours. Stick to your training as best as you can and just send it when the race comes.

tom-choad

1mo

sounds like pretty much every ultramarathon experience to me. haha

Weird-Effect-8382

1mo

OP- what kind of race is this? Road- mountain- technical trail? I think that also changes advice and strategy a bit

Erigann

1mo

I don’t know your weekly mileage, but following a plan I’d expect you to be hitting at least 35-40 Miles per week, hopefully a little more some weeks. Just ran my first two 50k+ last two weekends and maxed out at about 45 miles per week leading up. I’d add miles but do two weeks up, one week down, one week add, then do your lower/taper week

TheRealJYellen

1mo

Coming from the endurance cycling world, 1 gu every 45 minutes seems like under fueling. I'm 1 every 20 minutes on the bike, and trying to dial in what I can tolerate while running.

That said, how was heart rate for the first half and how does it compare to your PR HR for that length of time? Did you blow up, or was it just the legs giving out?

But yeah, you lowered training volume by half and expected to get the same results, that's probably the root cause.

ehowey18

1mo

You’ll be fine don’t worry about it. As long as you can get your weekly mileage back to where it should be for the next 6 weeks, you’ll definitely build enough fitness to at least finish the 50k. More gel/food most likely would not have helped.