Shakedown Request: my LW First Aid Kit, post WFA recert

Shakedown

Finally got off my butt and did my WFA recert for the first time in (way too long, like since scouts). Everyone always says once you have the training you carry less stuff but I found the opposite. I finished the course realizing "damn, long term wound management is resource intensive even for minor injuries" but I think I've got enough here to not be seriously wanting for anything. weight is 175g.

General

4" flat fold elastic wrap. I really need to get a vacuum sealer so I can make these on my own. more expensive than a standard packaging ACE but dang it's so much more compact
Gloves
Roller Gauze

FOOTCARE

Uncle Bills Sliver Grippers
Nail Clippers
Moleskin 3x kidneys
Molefoam 1x sheet (this stuff is amazing for building up around blisters)
Tegederm

GOO

1x Poison Ivy wipe (unnecessary if you carry soap I guess, but I don't.)
2x Antibiotic ointment, mostly for footcare
1x Diphenhydramine ointment for bugbites
1x hydrocortizone for bugbites/rashes

MEDS

2x Tylenol for fever
4x Diamode (Immodium) cus ya boi got IBS
2x Benadryl for major allergies
8x Motrin
2x baby Asprin

BOOBOO

2x Small bandaid
2x Medium Bandaid
2x Large Bandaid
1x Steristrips (pack of 3) for moderate wounds
1x Dermabond (Don't seal deep wounds, but this can be good for sealing skinned knees/elbows if you're crossing water or something else gross)
1x Transparent dressing
2x Gauze pads

I went with transparent dressing since it doesn't need to be changed every 12hrs like a regular bandage, so a smaller moderate wound could be stabilized with steristrips and covered in transparent dressing and be good for 3-5 days (long enough to start healing properly or get out of the woods) while allowing me to monitor it without wasting any supplies

Stuff that's not shown:

My dorky bandana with the scene assessment and patient history system on it
Garmin InReach
RitR notebook and golf pencil
Duct tape on my hiking pole.
I'll also usually keep a CAT TQ tucked in my thigh pocket if I'm doing anything with a fall risk or in an area where people do gun stuff, because improvising TQs sucks. Yeah you can do it in a pinch but you aren't getting a belt TQ or DIY windlass cinched down before you black out in 60-90s.

Stuff I feel like I'm missing but I don't want to make it bulky/heavier

A tick key, this is the only thing on the list I might add. I have one in my bigger kit and its amazing.
1x More Roller gauze, tegederm, transparent dressing and gloves. If something starts getting infected and I have to start repeatedly cleaning and warm soaking, I don't have a lot of stuff here to redress effectively.
A small burn pad like second-skin. They're amazing for scalding burns (like... fucking up with your stove), but they're heavy
Triangle bandage: Really bulky, but much easier to use than clothing for splinting and bracing
A second ACE wrap
Irrigation syringe: I carry smart waterbottles so I could put a pinhole in the cap to use for irrigation, if you use nalgenes or something similar you won't have an efficient way to presurize water for cleaning wounds.
Tincture of Benzoin for helping stuff stick to the foot, small, might be worth adding for 5g.

I've also got a larger ~750g kit that has more of everything and more trauma stuff that I take (hunting, shooting, climbing, or with groups of friends where I'm "the first aid guy"), but that definitely wouldn't qualify for this sub lmao.

Note: the 4 digit stickers are for an excel spreadsheet where I track everythings location (car firstaid kit, hunting kit, backpacking kit etc), expiration dates and inspection intervals. I'm a nerd. If you think this is bad, I strongly considered a barcode system...

Thoughts?

Edit:

Budget: (Anything reasonable)

Weight: 175g

Goal weight: unknown

Looking to: Either add things I missed, upgrade/make subsitutions for efficiency, or remove things if they're really dumb but I don't think there's any capabilities that I'm willing to sacrifice unless there's just a better way to do them

Use: backpacking and dayhikes (solo). 80% self care, 20% being able to provide good-samaritan first aid within my scope of practice (NOLS WFA, not a professional)

in Ultralightby Soft_Strategy_7092

90%

14d

13d

DeputySean

Lighterpack.com/r/nmcxuo - TahoeHighRoute.com - @Deputy_Sean

14d

Help us help you! Please make sure you have this information in some form within your shakedown post body.

Location/temp range/specific trip description: (Insert response here)

Goal Baseweight (BPW): (Insert response here)

Budget: (Insert response here)

I’m looking to: Upgrade Items OR see what I missed or can leave at home: (Insert response here)

Non-negotiable Items: (Insert response here)

Solo or with another person?: (Insert response here)

Additional Information: (Insert response here)

Lighterpack Link: (Insert link here)

HOW TO ASK FOR A SHAKEDOWN

jkkissinger

complains about vert

14d

I would probably never carry that much stuff in my FAK so I can’t really help with your FAK besides to say that you can likely get away with much less gear. I will say that there is no reason to not carry soap, especially if you’re going to carry all that other junk for wound care. Do you just plan on bandaging up dirty wounds?

twoknives

https://lighterpack.com/r/6byk37

14d

WFR here, the reality of a high risk wound is often going to be proper debridement and irrigation of a wound and allowing it to drain during the healing process until you can get back to the front county. Clean hands are ideal but hardly the reality for most in the back country. My gloves are not individually wrapped and sterile but I am probably going to be putting infection down as an anticipated problem anyway. This applies to a simple superficial cut as well. You goal is to reduce the bacteria count and limit the surface area for it to cultivate. I will say that more people need to rinse those hands instead of just smearing sani on them.

Soft_Strategy_7092

14d

I used to carry soap on the east coast but now I live in Socal and tbh I've been using sanitizer just because I always feel like I'm wasting water (I'm a noob at this arid lifestyle lol, so definitely more water insecure than I should be).

That said, the BKM for wound cleaning is high pressure clean drinking water without soap or scrubbing.

Anything in particular you think is unnecessary and why (ie: what you would use instead in that scenario)

dec92010

14d

dr bronners soap. get a mini dropper bottle from a store like litesmith and fill it up with dr bronners. can also use for toothpaste

Soft_Strategy_7092

14d

just... just because it says it on the bottle doesn't mean it's actually good for toothpaste.

It's good soap, yeah, but it's not toothpaste.

dec92010

14d

i like bringing things that work for multipurpose. I don't use it for toothpaste at home but it works fine in the field.

even if you don't use it for toothpaste it's good to carry soap with you instead of hand sanitizer. (or in addition to hand sanitizer)

positivelymonkey

13d

Did people stop dehydrating toothpaste into chewy drops round here?

quintupleAs

14d

Leukotape and a 4x4 could replace all of those bandaids and the moleskin. I wrap leukotape around stuff like chapstick and whatnot.

Soft_Strategy_7092

14d

You're probably right on the bandaids. I could throw 1-2 2x2s in and cover more potential injuries with less stuff. I do prefer the moleskin though, if you throw leukotape on a hotspot and it then becomes a blister getting it off is absolute hell lol.

liveslight

🍰

https://lighterpack.com/r/2lrund

13d

A band-aid is so much easier to apply and keep a cut clean than fashioning something out of a 4x4 and leukotape.

positivelymonkey

13d

This is why I carry small bandaids. For anything serious and much less likely I'll deal with the fiddly.

CactusHuggerActual

14d

I would recommend carrying A LOT more Benadryl than that. In case of serious allergic reaction you’ll need 2-4 to get a reaction under control.

I used to carry a dozen for a week trip. Recently in Patagonia I found that not to be enough. Started having an allergic reaction to a local plant that grows everywhere on day 4 of 7. It took all 12 of those to get me back to the trailhead on the end of day 6 with an open airway.

Also seriously carry soap. Cleanliness and sanitation prevents small problems from becoming big ones.

Soft_Strategy_7092

14d

as from the other comments, heard on the soap.

giraffevomitfacts

13d

If a reaction is serious enough you’re worried about a failed airway, you’re a lot safer carrying a few ampoules of epi and some im syringes.

CactusHuggerActual

Now knowing that I have an allergy that affects my airway I fully intend on getting epi and keeping it in my kit. But at the time I did not know I had an allergy of that severity, and Benadryl saved my ass. I also will probably never return to Patagonia, so there’s that too.

giraffevomitfacts

If you have a reaction that permits time to draw up medication, get your hands on some ampoules and IM syringes for $2 instead of a pen for $500. If you know any medical professionals have them save a couple expired ampoules for you.

CactusHuggerActual

Appreciate the advice! I sure don’t mind saving a few hundred bucks.

donkeyrifle

https://lighterpack.com/r/16j2o3

14d

RN but not WFR.

I carry some benadryl, some ibuprofen, the fancy hydrocolloid blister bandaids, and leukotape. That's it.

Manages minor allergic reactions, minor aches and pains, and minor cuts/scrapes/blisters.

Anything bigger than that is going involve:

1) trip ending, and one where I'm potentially making a call on the inreach
2) I'll be willing to improvise with other bits of clothing/fabric
3) I'm most likely going to be getting antibiotics once I get medical attention anyway.

Soft_Strategy_7092

13d

Those hydrocolloid pads are amazing. As I run out of regular bandaids I'm probably gonna just start buying sheets of that stuff and cutting it to size.

My main goals are:

Can I treat nuisance injuries well enough to keep them from becoming trip enders
Can I treat moderate injuries well enough to self rescue if preferable (Can I care for that laceration that stopped bleeding without getting a blood infection before I get to the next road)
Am I giving myself a chance at survivng until the helicopter shows up for a major injury (this one of course has more to do with luck and skill than materials)

donkeyrifle

https://lighterpack.com/r/16j2o3

13d

I haven’t taken WFA or WFR but something to remember:

Once a wound has stopped bleeding, a clot/scab/whatever is already protecting the wound and preventing dirt/infection/whatever from entering. Often times bandaids/gauze/whatever are more for our physical/psychological comfort rather than actually doing anything to keep infection out. Moreover, in the process of bleeding at the start of the wound, your body is already pushing dirt/germs/etc… out. Then the clot/scab protects it.

If your wound will not stop bleeding, then self rescue is a bad idea and you want to use that inreach.

Pfundi

14d

First aid kits are discussed here quite frequently and people carry everything from a pound to a few grams. It boils down to personal risk tolerance mostly.

That said what helped me get rid of a lot of stuff is the thought

"If that helps, applying nothing will be just fine too"

Souvenirs_Indiscrets

14d

Not sure who everyone is, I’m WFR and after cert and recert you learn that you really need to carry more.

The best advice I can give you is, think very carefully about each trip and what is LIKELY to befall you. For instance, when I go solo I to BWCA for ten days, I make do with the minuscule scissors in my SOG micro tool. Yes it is a pain in the ass to cut Leukotape with them, but the weight savings is worth it. Since it is highly unlikely that I will be rescuing a downed motorcyclist, I don’t need my big shears. My NRS Neko rescue knife doesn’t have a blunt end, but it does have only one of the smooth blades sharpened, so I could use it to cut trouser fabric very carefully. There’s an example on blades.

Take that example and run with it. But remember, you will always need more blister plasters than you think. And large adhesive bandages.

Have fun!

AotKT

13d

WFA here and the only thing I added to my kit after class (various pills including a metric asston of Benadryl, my epipens for the same reason I carry Benadryl, tweezers [good for ticks, embedded thorns, and also crap stuck in the rain fly snaps on my tent], some moleskin and leukotape, one emergency blanket because I do run very very very cold and sweat heavily) is an elastic wrap. I'm in the US southeast and my trips are rarely longer than 3 days, so I just rinse off thorn scrapes with running water, live with the poison ivy or soap it off, my bandana works as a sling and so do base layers. The elastic wrap is because it's so much easier to splint with one than with clothing and my most realistic non-trivial injury is going to be an injured limb.

I carry an inReach but with the heavy tree cover of the Appalachians, I find that it takes messages forever to get sent.

Soft_Strategy_7092

13d

Definitely fair! waiting on my epi slip to come back, since in California we can now carry them under good samaritan law. I'll definitely be adding them to my larger kit since my partner hasn't been stung by a bee ever, but her family has a history of major allergic reactions and anaphylaxis (but not her, so she can't get a script...).

And yeah my biggest take away was "holy shit elastic/ACE bandages are golden." My larger kit is like 25% ACE bandages by volume lmao

FuguSandwich

13d

Seems to me that like anything else, you should prepare for the most likely events. Some of these FAKs remind me of the old Doomsday Preppers TV shows where people were preparing for stuff like asteroid impacts and the Earth's magnetic poles swapping polarity instead of stuff that actually happens like storms and floods and fires. What is most likely to happen when backpacking? Blisters, sunburn, bug bites, upset stomach, rarely a sprained ankle. Obviously anything CAN happen, but when was the last time you encountered a compound fracture or a sucking chest wound out on the trail?

Soft_Strategy_7092

13d

I mean, that's explicitly what I've tried to do here, do you have any feedback on my kit specifically?

mountainlaureldesign

13d

Quadruple all the MEDs. 8 Motrin is only enough for 24hrs for a twisted ankle or knee or partial torn rotator cuff from a fall with outstretched arm. Ask me how I know.

Soft_Strategy_7092

13d

Fuck I've had that exact injury before. partial tear of the lat and teres minor from catching a dyno at full extention climbing.

I usually also have a full bottle of ol' vitamin M if I'm out for more than a day hike, I didn't really consider that first aid, just "life after back surgery" but yeah maybe I should consider doubling my overall med quantity. Can't be more than like 25g right?

Admirable-Strike-311

13d

In the “pharmacy” side of my FAK I carry Claritin and pseudoephedrine. I have allergies and want to be able to treat myself and be able to breathe, especially at night.

You may be interested also that according to the most recent NOLS injury and illness statistics I saw, on the illnesses side non-anaphylactic allergies were the number two complaint after communicable illness (GI, respiratory, and flu-like illnesses). (Data from 2005-2022.)

RollingExistence

14d

W-EMT here, I just carry athletic tape and a PLB.

cakes42

13d

Reading through this thread makes me think my 5oz kit weighs too much and I can definitely knock it down to 3oz. The kit is only supposed to be enough for me to get off trail. I'll bring more if I'm with someone else that way we can split weight.

Soft_Strategy_7092

13d

Yeah what I'm trying to cover is

Can I treat nuisance injuries well enough to keep them from becoming trip enders
Can I treat moderate injuries well enough to self rescue if preferable (Can I care for that laceration that has bleeding controlled without getting a blood infection before I get to the next road)

That seems worth the 5-7oz for me, I just want to make sure I'm doing it as efficiently as possible

liveslight

🍰

https://lighterpack.com/r/2lrund

14d

I tend to get infected hangnails / paronychia, so antibiotic cream and finger cots are helpful.

Leukotape P on silicone release paper

Instead of irrigation syringe I would use the homemade bidet nozzle which is rather forceful.

Also something for damage to eye from a stick, branch, or thorn. Wear sunglasses or safety glasses, too.

Sunscreen to help prevent sunburn.

Why no soap? Washing hands well helps me stay away from paronychia.

First aid on the trail mostly has been cuts from falling especially cuts on face and head.

We don't bring knives and guns.

Soft_Strategy_7092

14d

I've never thought of finger cots, although I've cut the fingers off a glove to make basically the same thing. I may throw some in my larger kit though (I've got a bag for watch repairs in my workshop). At the very least they can be used for tiny-condom jokes ;)

Leukotape is a good one but tbh I can't figure out for the life of me how the fuck to use it for stabilizing joints. For this kit I've just got electrical tape and ducttape on my hiking pole, my larger kit does have coban and medical tape tho.

For hygene I'm a hand sani and TP guy, but if by "homemade bidet" you mean a bottle cap with a small hole in it, yeah that's my irrigation plan since I usually use smartbottles (nalgenes you can't squeeze so if that's your preference I don't think you could make it work)

Sunscreen, bugspray, and chapstick are in the hygene kit, but I agree they're definitely essential if you don't want to turn into a piece of human beefjerky

goddamnpancakes

14d

hand sani only is an odd choice given your otherwise fastidious focus on extended wound care. soap that shit

i think you have a higher potential for reduced lifetime misery by washing regularly with soap + holey cap faucet/bidet than you do by carrying all this extra first aid gear that will rarely be actually used.

i don't think it's bad to push back on ultra-minimal FAK trends but i think it's odd to prioritize that over basic protections against things like noro that routinely scourge sections of trail. especially if you intend to employ your noro hands to use this heavy FAK to help others!

i also took WFA

Soft_Strategy_7092

14d

Yeah I used to carry soap back when I lived on the east coast, I think it's a temporary result of moving to socal and being terrified of running out of water in what is basically a pseudodesert. Worrying about water isn't something I'm used to. Good call I gotta sort that shit out

goddamnpancakes

14d

you can wash hands with soap with remarkable water efficiency with the kind of homemade bidet/faucet that could conceivably be used for irrigation. start with a tiny hole made at an angle

make Ignaz Semmelweis proud!

oh and get your tetanus booster :P

fwiw i carry bidet cap + like 5 grams liquid soap + tiny sanitizer. i don't always soap, but i do soap at least twice a day or after a privy encounter and figure i'm still miles ahead of never-soapers. plus the superior wound care and chafing prevention real washing offers, and it's definitely worth it for me

liveslight

🍰

https://lighterpack.com/r/2lrund

13d

but if by "homemade bidet" you mean a bottle cap with a small hole in it,

I mean this: https://i.imgur.com/dHfRZZA.mp4

dec92010

14d

link to dorky bandana?

johnr588

13d

Imodium, for stomach/digestive issues.

Soft_Strategy_7092

13d

Imodium is in there, as I said, ya boi got that IBS-Dawg in him.

mas_picoso

WTB Camp Chair Groundsheet

13d

in the interest of multi-use, in an emegency, I use:

wraps/bandages->bandana/clothing
gloves->soap
bandaids->leukotape

I carry steristrips and tegaderm for catastrophes....I think those are good items to have on hand for backcountry injuries like burns and gouges and complements the meds I pack:

daily dose of ibuprofen
2 doses immodium
2 doses benadryl
alcohol wipes
bacitracin packets
bag balm

Jeffk601

13d

A TQ and hyfin chest seal are things that you cannot improvise easily. Those are non negotiable lots of other things can serve double duty or be improvised. My kit is geared towards Scouting High Adventure for groups of 8-12 so its larger.

philipsousa

W-EMT/ school wilderness guide here. On my thru hike/day hikes I carry IB pro, benedryl, 3 bandaids tp, 2 small ziplocks small tweezers and a saftey pin.

For group guiding I carry a much larger, more comprehensive kit for backcountry care. I also keep this in my car for emergency use when in the front country. Approx 10L.

The things on your list “feel” nice to have but I don’t usually use when out doing 14ers/day hikes with the public.

In my experience most people need a little advice, and maybe ib pro or an ankle wrap. You can do your PA and will likely just wait for paramedics/sar to arrive.

Though, there are many ways to build a first aid kit and it is a learning process and I think it’s fun to experiment with gear and supplies.

Cheers!

takoyaki-md

14d

not much benefit in taking aspirin 81 unless you need it daily for cardiovascular disease (unless you have them there in case someone has a heart attack in which case you need 324 or to carry 3). you can stick to tylenol + NSAID such as the moltrin. fexofenadine (allegra) is my preferred antihistamine these days. very good newer gen with very little if any sedation effects because it can't cross the blood brain barrier.

Soft_Strategy_7092

14d

(unless you have them there in case someone has a heart attack in which case you need 324 or to carry 3)

That's exactly the purpose, each "packet" has two so technically I have 4, but I should see if I can find some adult doses to make it easier. Thanks!

And yeah the benadryl is more for in case I get into something that gives me dermatitis or a bunch of bug bites or the like. Thankfully my allergies didn't follow me to the west coast but I'm comically allergic to a lot of insect bites

takoyaki-md

14d

np. for that purpose try to find an uncoated version. personally never chewed on the enteric coated ones so i don't know if it's hard to do or not but the goal (and forgive me if i'm explaining something you already know) would be to get it absorbed as quickly as possible.

Turbulent-Respond654

14d

Have you compared benadryl, Allegra, and zyrtec for your bug bites? How sleepy do you get with benadryl? If the non drowsy work as well, consider some benadryl for airway and non-drowsy for the bugs.

liveslight

🍰

https://lighterpack.com/r/2lrund

13d

Packets of BC powder (aspirin + caffeine) come in > 800 mg size. No need to chew.

Admirable-Strike-311

13d

If OP has aspirin for a cardiac emergency I don’t imagine they’d want to give caffeine to someone having a heart attack.

Soft_Strategy_7092

13d

I'm not a medical professional but wouldn't caffeine be like... the worst possible thing for a heart attack? Barring cocaine of course. Like I'd think that vasoconstriction + increased Bp/HR would be... suboptimal.