I happened to see this article on the Federation of the Swiss Watch Industry. It caught eye, so I thought I'd share.
One quote made me chuckle: "There can be no dodging the facts: when we buy a fake watch we’re getting into bed with highly disreputable circles and getting caught up in a scenario of, ultimately, nightmare proportions".
I fucking love kit cars, I want a factory five cobra, a Ferrari 250 gt in a Z3 and an old F1 over a Miata body.
Lambo on a Fiero is my favorite 🤣
F40 on a fiero!
I used to have a 91 Miata - perfect just the way it was.
Look old alfa Romeo F1 Miata and you will understand that it could be better.
Yeah, let me stop them there. These are the same disreputable factories that make OEM Swiss parts & ship them to Switzerland so these Swiss companies can charge 1000x markup. I suppose its ok as long as the Swiss companies are the only ones buying Asian products to relabel for retail. I know a lot of stuff is made in house, but a lot isn't as well. And they chose to refuse to sell watches, and refuse parts access and charge $1k minimum for "interventions" that take 6+ months anytime you need anything from them. They hate their customers unlike any industry I've ever seen.
Look up how much of a Swiss made watch needs to be made in Switzerland. Many, do the bare minimum.
One of the biggest forces driving rep production might be the Swiss watch companies tooling up in the far east. We are all playing a game of "who's the biggest idiot" and quite honestly I don't know if it's gen owners, rep owners, the Swiss, the Chinese, or all of us in total.
Sometimes it's best to step away from all the noise and just enjoy things for what they are. Never stare too close. Never look behind the curtain. Never meet your heros, etc..
My friend has a gen Sub, I have a rep. My VSF rep looks EXACTLY like his. He paid $10k I paid $500. We play ‘who is the idiot’ all the time.
I have both and the only difference is that gen is gen. And sometimes, that's a bad thing. I am more apt to treat my vsf the way I always wanted to treat my genuine Rolexes but I can't afford that luxury. It's hard to carefree wear an immaculate $10,000 watch.
Even the AR on the date mag looks the same. The genuine movement quality is much better, but dandong does make a nice 3135 clone.
That’s true. I imagine you’re much more careful with the gen.
There is some truth. While I love my gen DJ and am “careful” with it, keep it clean and away from certain scenarios, I came to the realization that it was meant to wear. Rolex makes a very sturdy and rugged watch. I work in the automotive industry and stayed in the shop portion most of the time (don’t like the desk).
While I destroyed nice clothes peering under vehicles and helping technicians fix things, only on rare cases did I remove my watch. Again, I was not clumsy or reached deep into a engine bay with it on, but it was nothing to knock the face against something and swear that I had broken it only to be blown away by the sheer strength of sapphire crystal.
When I knew I’d have to get dirty or take it off to help someone, I always loved tasking my good friend with watching my watch. He got a kick out of keeping it safe and wearing it for a while. It was great to be able to let another experience the pleasure. My point, unless it is sentimental or a dress watch, enjoy it! That’s what it is meant to be; enjoyed!
I've always wanted to ask this, but what about water resistance? I get that from a visual standpoint and even somewhat the internals, they are the same, but how will a rep hold up in the water? I only ask because I spend a lot of time in and around the water and I've always been led to believe that if you wanted a watch that was going to hold up it would have to be a gen as the reps don't seem to have the same WR. No hate on reps whatsoever, I'm just genuinely curious.
Case construction on most is the same as gen. There are gaskets. I'm in FL, an ex-diver and wouldn't keep a rep I couldn't swim with. Just have them pressure tested first. Rinse with fresh water asap after pool/ocean use.
I go swimming all the time with my reps. Those from high end factories are essentially as waterproof as you will ever need. Unless ur a professional scuba diver.
Thank you both for your responses. It definitely makes me consider reps even more knowing that they'd be sound in the water. That was kind of the one big thing holding me back from considering a rep diver.
Np man. I never checked reps for water resistance. Beforehand, worked just fine out of the box. Never had one of clean, vsf or c+ fail me.
get your rep to go thru pressure test, after that you can just enjoy playing water with your rep
How about the $1200 service every 5 years?
Fortunately that's a non issue for me since I do that for a living, but its a great point. Worse, if you don't need a service, just something small. I needed the AR redone on my breitling many years back. The forced a mandatory service, and put the part I needed behind a $1,000 paywall. The Swiss luxury watch companies have really dismantled the luxury feeling of owning their timepieces. I know many rep owners go gen or have both and I believe in supporting the original creators of these wearable pieces of art, but they make it REALLY hard.
I'm on year 7 with my Gen AT8900. Still runs at +1/day.
The whole you need to service it at fix intervals are just nonsense.
Ashamed to say that I’ve never had my DateJust services in the 20 years I’ve owned it. Lol! Still keeps great time. No issues at all.
Further proves the fix interval baloney. According to Rolex, that would've been a $6k service lol. Almost enough to buy an entirely new watch.
You're the idiot. He's the guy with a gen Rolex.
Unless he played the Rolex "game" and bought a bunch of nonsense. Then he's the fucking idiot.
Had an acquaintance that paid $50k for a Daytona. Can't help but laugh at him everytime I see him.
I’m the idiot getting ready to retire comfortably soon while he has a gen Rolex lives in a rental, is buried in cc debt and will work until he drops dead. But he’ll have a genuine Rolex - actually 2 - to leave his kids.
Yikes. Your friend sounds like a mess. He's in no position to own two Rolexes.
But saying you're smart because you buy reps instead of gen is really cringe.
lol no kidding. I didn’t even mention the Audi 🤣
Dude's a perfect case study for "how not to do with your finances". JFC
I hope it's not any of Audi's hybrid. If it is....good lord.
Great post!!!
They won't admit it but this is the big reason rolex makes their own metal, to add to the Swiss expenditures. It has nothing to do with quality. The best metal shops are constantly scrutinized by the industry and their clients. Who at rolex is going to tell the head of metals at rolex that his product is shiite compared to industry?
Wisdom
I’m 100% an idiot
But ain't it fun tho.
Yes and the AAAAAA scam etc etc..all these articles are just so fukn dumb
EXACTLY
werd...
a lot of people don't seem to know this, but majority of the parts FROM SWISS MADE watches are all from China, that's how they can achieve what they can with reps.
As long as 60% of the watch is made in Switzerland as far as parts goes, that's the minimum
This Is exactly how I felt when I went to the AD to try on some watches. “Never meet your hero’s” is exactly true, literally I was almost trying to get myself to justify some grey dealer prices. As I put it on I’m like these feels REALLY close to my VSF sub.. let alone my VSF omegas which didn’t feel 10x better. I’d be babying my gen, I’m glad I can actually enjoying wear these tools on my wrist
If you ask ChatGPT , I know crazy, how much it really cost to make a Rolex you will prob want to puke.
People are going to say ChatGPT isn’t a reliable source of info but I’m in manufacturing and the figure seemed a reasonable estimate.
You want to just give the estimate or
$4k
Whatever helps you feel better
Sounds like a reptime orgy at my place tonight.
🤣🤣🤣
You wouldn't download a watch!
Obscure Reference - Sorry
I wouldn't steal a watch..
DeBeers tried to pull this when lab diamonds first became commercially viable. They were trying to hold on to their artificial monopoly and the argument was that fake diamonds weren’t as good as natural. And now there is De Beers “Lightbox”
i am looking to buy a few more nightmare proportion from anonymous unscrupulous entrepreneurs who are laundering money in global proportions. so i can poison my health, while waiting 2 years for a gen to maybe come in because so many jobs are lost. while i watch Scarface that i rented from the library for free.
Tell the Chinese to stop making knockoffs of the C17 and Blackhawk helicopter and see if they care.
** Please Wait : Loading Ross Ulbricht / Julian Assange starter pack. **
The Swiss & US government have declared all persons involved in replica watches as sex offenders, involved in soliciting “murder for hire” and / or pedophiles.
They will not stop accusations until everyone is destroyed.
As a practitioner in the watch industry, I can say responsibly that the reason why replica watches in China can be made so exquisite and mature is that many Swiss factories come to China to purchase parts, transport them to Switzerland for assembly, and then increase the price by thousands of times to sell them to customers. And the replica watch makers just find these parts and put them together. We can imagine how much a watch could have cost, except for the iron, copper and aluminium alloy and some rare precious metals and stones.
I'm certainly not denying the intellectual property rights of watch makers, but their technical content is far from the CPU. Buying a REP is not driving a fake car, we should just choose the accessories we like to wear at a reasonable price range.
Mmmmm easy ...stop being so fkn expensive....
we’re getting into bed with highly disreputable circles
Says the country that got into bed with Nazis during WWII.
Please keep buying our overpriced stainless steel automatic watches! Think of the poor multibillion dollar watch companies and their lost profits!
Meanwhile most watch cases are built in china and shipped to the Swiss for some Swiss made assembly.
What a load of shit lmfao.
I have yet to see any evidence that the watch rep industry is tied to some Chinese mafia groups.
It's just a bunch of talented Chinese watch makers deciding to take a shortcut instead of making their own brand.
The quality of these reps can't simply be built by someone who doesn't know what he's doing. Rep sneakers and T shirts, maybe.
You make an interesting point about talent. I’ve said the same thing before about those who blend cigars and “try” to pass them off for an authentic brand. Why not put the energy into creating your own brand? I could continue with my thoughts, but leaving the question open for discussion.
Shortcut. Like it or not, the hardest part is not making a nice watch, it is the ability to sell it and promote it.
I don't have hard data, but I'm willing to wager Rolex's PR budget is higher than their actual production running cost.
I wouldn't say none of them tried though. Again, this is basing off my intuition and is nowhere factual. Brands like Invicta, Pagani Design, Jinlery and even Haofa probably started as a rep factory that decided they wanted a piece of the glory.
Their watches punches way above their weight if you paid the actual MSRP. Not the over inflated scam prices you see on Amazon.
I mean, I paid $300 for a Jinlery Tourbillon lol.
Good answer!
There are 18 RM 052s in the world. 3 are in special collections and wont go on sale. 13/15 are on Chrono24 for sale. Now I hear there are some rich ppl crossing borders with them and word is the gens are involved with money laundering.
Disreputable circles? Which circle exacrly now?
The funniest part is where they say fake watches use toxic and harmful chemicals that put your health at risk. That might be true for the AAA worst gutter tier shitters, but for the reps we buy here that excerpt made me laugh out loud. The reps we get have the exact same steel. On reps like Subs and GMTs you’re getting ceramic bezels. I’ve lead tested mine and others have tested theirs to find nothing. These watches are really just as safe as the 90% Chinese Swiss watches you can buy normally.
I got a chuckle out of 'intellectual property theft ... Harms the environment'. Or that reps' endangers the health of consumers
You mean like Dior and their sweat shops?
Ah yes. The anti counterfeit bingo Mafia Child Labour Money laundering Terrorists organisations Illegal business Intellectual property theft
Maybe they should focus on producing watches so people can buy them instead of waiting on list for months. Or punish ad who just put new watches on the grey market.
Buy gen Seiko..
Theyre just upset that reps make 99.99% the same product at a 99.99% cheaper retail price
Congress making rep watches now?
if that Federation can stop R manipulating ADs and their supply control…
New here! Where can I buy a good 500 Bucks Rolex watch?
Reps are the new gateway drug. Next thing you know you'll be driving a kit car.