Neighbors Burning Garbage

discussion

I live in a rural area where it’s technically ‘legal’ to burn brush etc and they keep claiming its brush, but you can see tires sticking out of the burn pile. My neighbors are not amicable to stopping even with me helping haul away garbage instead. The smoke is wafting onto my entire property and even inside my house like a cancerous evil fog. What can I do to remediate the dioxins etc from the smoke that is actively seeping/settling onto my land? Mushrooms? Hemp? Scrape it and toss it? Thanks in advance for any helpful replies!

Edit: so yeah I’ve been in communication with Sheriffs office, Public Health, and the EPA but not much can be done other then threatening letters because the local municipality doesn’t have any enforcement.

Edit 2: Ok y’all, to reiterate, I’m curious about anyone’s experience with bioremediation of heavy metals, plastics and other various pollutants. What if I had a landfill? How would I go about making viable land out of a landfill? I know everyone’s hot on getting my neighbors to stop and believe me, I would love that. I’ve had to abandon the property for the time being and hope that in a couple years time that things will improve in my municipality and enforcement of local ordinances will occur and stop it eventually. When that time comes, I’d like to bring my property back to a healthy status without all the muck inhibiting me from growing and building a nice wallapini. Thanks again in advance! And thanks for all that are concerned and wanna smack my neighbors for me, I personally wouldn’t mind running them off their own property but alas I need to get along with them for the time being. Thanks everyone!

in Permacultureby bananachomper

69

89%

15d

15d

Gullible-Minute-9482

50

15d

Real assholes.

I'm sure the local environmental conservation enforcement would fine the shit out of them if you report it with enough evidence.

OP

25

15d

Been doing that, and supposedly threatening letters are on their way but I don’t know if they really care. Rural area, lack of town enforcement and small sheriff’s office.

angelicasinensis

4

14d

go to a higher agency, more at state level. I had to find a higher up agency in my small town but they will drive out here to cite people.

OP

2

14d

I’m collecting lots of footage and sending it all in but they don’t seem to be willing to drive down to my shitty tiny town to investigate.

angelicasinensis

2

14d

keep trying more agencies

Personal-Command-699

18

15d

Top list of hyper accumulator plants used for abandoned mines:

https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Jesus-Peco/publication/352246662/figure/tbl1/AS:1032687561232386@1623223309810/List-of-hyperaccumulator-plants-that-could-be-used-for-phytoextraction-Asterisks.png

OP

3

14d

Whoa awesome link! That’s what I’m talking about, thank you dude!

24

PNW Urban Permaculture

15d

You’re going to want to wash all your fruit and veg in white vinegar to make sure the ash comes off. Buy it by the gallon when you’re in town.

OP

9

15d

Ok that’s a good comment. Thank you. I am not actively growing on this property anymore now because of this but I want to prevent leaching of dioxins into my produce for the future, and of course help the property too in the long run.

11

PNW Urban Permaculture

15d

It’s been tested for lead dust, as well as combustion soot, but not I don’t know about dioxin.

The common wisdom has shifted back to more lead “in” fruits and vegetables being surface contamination rather than soil uptake, and vinegar is more effective than “vegetable soap” at removing dust and soot.

OP

6

15d

That’s good to know! I know that my property is in an old (non-working) mine town so I have those issues to deal with too. It’s far from pristine, and large amounts of garbage have been scattered on it for many decades. Cleaned up, trashed, cleaned up again, old septic etc. so that’s why I came here because I’d like to remedy all of it and see what people may have done already to help their soil culture thrive again.

ISmellWildebeest

2

14d

Do you dilute the vinegar, or use it straight?

Personal-Command-699

11

15d

To answer your original question that isn’t being answered:

Google Dr. Elaine Ingham. Follow her books to a T build amazing Compost and apply Compost tea, build an excellent environment of red Wiggers and earthworms in the soil through sheet composting and other methods like manure. (Yes this can have down sides as well manure that is*) the mucus in the worm castings from what I understand will actually chelate heavy metals in the soil. It’s not perfect, but it locks them up and makes them less bioavailable, you can also plant deep rooted crops and bio accumulators like Hemp etc. chop and drop/remove. Rinse lather and repeat.

Wait for neighbors to eventually overdose, buy their property on the cheap and remediate that too. Then build a big fence. 😎

*If garbage is being burned then it will leech into ground water eventually. Your best hope is having a clay subsoil or “hard pan” that hopefully doesn’t migrate things too far in a linear fashion. Hope 🫤

OP

3

14d

Finally, thank you for the direction. Excellent advice thank you!

20

15d

My area is plastic grocery bags filled with disposable diapers. The county trash tag is $10/year and there are three dump sites within four miles of town. It gives me a headache and wonder what it does to my farm animals

OP

19

15d

Dioxins are bad yo. Damn that’s terrible. I’ve had to vacate my property entirely and am just planning on waiting it out at this point. I figure a big giant fence will be nice soon and planting things that will take that shit out of the soil.

sagebrushgrouse

8

15d

Mushrooms, especially oyster mushrooms, are sometimes used in bioremediation, and would produce a lot of lovely biomass. You'd still need to dispose of them, but that's way easier than hauling soil away. Personally, I just wash veggies heavily and try to have healthy, microbe filled, aerated, soil when I'm worried about typical contaminants, and I test the soil for lead.

OP

2

14d

Brilliant, I appreciate the solvent advice. Someone else commented about mushrooms, do you think oysters are better in that regard for heavy metals in general?

sagebrushgrouse

2

14d

I think oysters are popular because they're studied the most. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5504202/

Different species definitely could have different effects, but it does seem oyster mushrooms have a good track record. If they don't grow well where you are, I think other mushrooms are probably fine to use.

OP

1

14d

Ahh well that’s still a good thing because of the track record. I’ll do texting along the way to make sure that the uptake is occurring but it’s good to have more research behind it. Based on the comment above, I think I’ll need to have a slew of fungi and plants to manage the remediation but it’s positive to me that it changes the composition of the pollutants so that it’s more inert, that’s what I’d like most to see instead of furthering landfill /watershed pollution by just moving it around. Plus I can inoculate my local landfill too. ;)

6

15d

put a really big fan, or a series of big fans on the property line to blow it all back.

OP

7

15d

Hahaha I love this. The sound would probably annoy them too 🤣

3

14d

Hide some fireworks in their next pile

OP

3

14d

🤣🤣🤣🤣😅

4

14d

Paul Stamets did very interesting research about mycoremediation. I found his book, Mycelium Running, very interesting when I worked on an illegal dumpsite project (sadly, the project failed before I was able to test his concepts firsthand).

OP

1

14d

Awww that’s sad to hear. But I appreciate the direction! I’d forgotten about his book, I forgot he also did research about that and not just the magic kind lol.

2

14d

I’d forgotten about his research on the magic kind lol. My partner and I were hired to propose an alternative solution for the remediation of the dump site but Environment Canada wanted the people responsible for it to send all the waste material to official waste treatment/recycling plants. It seemed justified. I learned a whole lot throughout the process so I still feel like it was a positive experience.

I wish you the best with your remediation endeavour!

OP

1

14d

Thank you! Wow, that’s amazing. Sorry you couldn’t see it to the end, but glad to hear positive things like that are going on. I would love to learn more about implementing these things in all the horrible Enviromental cleanups I know we’ll be facing and even be involved in that stuff as a job in general, how did you get into that project?

1

13d

My husband/partner was involved in a plastic recycling initiative. The person responsible for the site contacted him about the plastic waste on site and our involvement ended up growing to be offering a holistic solution for the whole site (a huge illegal dumping site for construction waste). We were young, ambitious and a bit naive lol

28

15d

Call the police.

OP

23

15d

I have. They directed me to Public Health, who then directed me to Sheriffs office who then directed me back to PH then I called EPA and they are sending them threatening letters. They’re local tweakers so they really couldn’t give a shit.

22

15d

Post on r/unethicallifeprotips for advice on how to deal with your neighbors.

OP

8

15d

Ooh I do like this idea.

4

14d

DEA?

OP

1

14d

lol oh they know about them. It’s about catching them at the right time and they frequently have warrants but as soon as they’re on that property nobody can touch them. I am starting to wonder about some of the latest activity however. I just keep snapping photos etc and working with my local agencies. They want license plates from my cameras but I don’t like having to do their job for them lol.

12

15d

And/or sheriff. And see if there are state agencies to call.

OP

18

15d

Yup see comment above. EPA is hopefully on their ass but I don’t know if they care. They frequently have warrants and they just wash through the system. The local township (it’s in town) doesn’t have enforcement officers so 🤷

🍰

6

15d

Follow up with a civil suit, but you might have more to lose here than these losers, drawing a target on your back n stuff.

OP

3

15d

Exactly. They could cause me a lot more trouble then I can cause them.

9

15d

Do a bit of googling and contact your state's department of natural resources or the like. Pretty sure they would get them to quit.

7

15d

Dealing with same things 😪

OP

7

15d

I’m so sorry. It really does suck.

9

15d

What can I do to remediate the dioxins etc from the smoke that is actively seeping into my land?

Before you panic about random chemicals, have you actually tested the soil to confirm your worries?

OP

4

15d

Nope, I’m just assuming by the way the smoke spreads across the land in a low and creepy cancer ridden cloud that it’s probably leaving stuff behind. Plus my land has had a bunch of history to it, not exactly pristine, so I figure that it’s something I should learn how to remediate before I build gardens.

angelicasinensis

2

14d

hey, are you in arkansas? I went through hours on line to find the person but its illegal to burn trash and if you call the right agency/guy they will drive out there and look for burned trash and then cit ethem and threaten to fine them, if they continue they will fine them.

OP

1

14d

Nope lol, but this area could definitely be a cousin to Arkansas for sure! God I hope something happens with the EPA. They better do something because they don’t even technically have a house anymore, just a bunch of rvs because the main house burned down.

angelicasinensis

1

14d

shit I feel for you. Keep calling different people. I called a LOT of people before I found my guy. I could give you his info and you could call and see if he knows who to call in your state maybe?

OP

1

14d

Yeah I know thank you so much. Sure that would be awesome. They all work with the federal agencies so it might point me in a useful direction for sure. PM me the info for sure! 👍

2

Homesteader

14d

Is there a ‘no burn’ happening in your area? We are being advised not to burn 🔥 because of the air quality.

OP

1

14d

Oh I’m in a high wildfire risk area lol. But nope, sheriffs won’t do anything about it unless it’s an open fire, which they do occasionally but those are small open brush fires that they put out in an hour, and then their garbage is in a 100 gal metal barrel…..

2

Homesteader

14d

You would be calling the fire department not police to handle. If you report they are using accelerant like fuel or some combustible material they are required to come out.

One time I was sitting in a park, just chilling while my husband did a work thing. Anyways… noticed this house just throwing things into a pile across the street in the lawn. I see them throw a match on this pile and then spray with accelerant. It was less than 20 feet from a structure as well. I called 9-1-1 and explained I was at the park and don’t know what the address was but it would be fairly obvious and on the south side of the park, they pinged my phone location as I honestly didn’t know where I was. As the fire department was a block out my husband picked me up.

OP

1

14d

Oh totally, I’ve called them too. Ironically, this property is directly across from one of the local fire departments….but because it’s in a burn barrel and even with high fire risk, they won’t do anything unless there’s flames shooting in past the rim of the barrel. And anyways, they would just light it later in the middle of the night instead because they’re up at all hours. He definitely also uses accelerants, but they’re smart and only light it for a couple hours at a time and usually nobody is around.

4

15d

Get a fire hose and big pump and spray their fire out from your property. What are they going to do? Call the police to come out and let them have an illegal fire?

foodforestranger

6

14d

This is how things escalate to violence. These people probably have guns.

OP

4

15d

I wish that was the case. Ironically the fire dept can see the fire from their station but they won’t do anything because it’s in a burn barrel. Even if they make them stop right then, they’ll just do it later in the evening.

2

15d

Sell and buy elsewhere. You can’t fix other people, but you can control yourself

OP

2

15d

Yeah I have definitely considered this. I’m not in the best position to do it at the moment but I’m concerned about getting a good price for it considering my neighbors. Thanks for the advice.

SensitiveAd5331

1

15d

Burn your own crap right beside their property and blow a fan at them lol. Make sure it reeks to high heaven with some elemental sulfur tossed on the fire. Blare Rick Astley and William Shatner's spoken word poetry 24/7, too. And setup high powered lights to shine in their bedroom windows at night. Then negotiate from a place of strength.

OP

1

14d

Edit:Aww come on ppl, don’t downvote this comment, it’s excellent advice lol!!

🤣🤣🤣Ahhhhh man I cracking up so hard now. That’s perfect, thanks for the comic relief. Great advice man, I like your style. We’ll see if I mess with the tweakers. But I think you’ve got good middle road solvent advice. 😂

2

15d

Smoke has likely been hitting your property for a long time before you were there.

When you move to the country, you're there with country people doing things like this. It's just one of the things you need to accept

OP

5

15d

Well that’s why I’m asking a different question that no one seems to be answering here; how do I remediate the land then? And ironically, I’m not in the country. Municipality actually. But rural yes. I would be more accepting if there were acres between us but sadly it’s right next door in busy town.

-1

15d

Why do you think you need to remediate the land? Some occasional smoke likely has zero impact.

OP

6

15d

Hmm maybe, maybe not. But I’m gonna harken back to my original post question. Large long history with this property, definitely been abused for a 100+ years and I’m curious about viable options for bioremediation.

-15

15d

Snitch

OP

8

15d

Oh totally. There just doesn’t seem to be much recourse unfortunately. So I’m looking for long term soil remediation information to fix the problem eventually. They’re old and gonna die soon so I just have to wait it out.

-4

15d

That’s why I said to SNITCH!!!

OP

5

15d

lol I did! Nobody will do anything. Sheriffs office, Public Health, EPA etc. Supposedly there’s threatening letters with fines headed through the mail but I don’t know if they care.

endoftheworldvibe

7

15d

Deserves snitching if asking doesn't make it stop.

0

15d

That’s why I said, SNITCH!

8

15d

Ah, you meant "snitch" as a verb, like OP should snitch on the neighbors. Context is important.