How would you rate my plant choices around the mailbox?
Advice Request - (Insert State/Region)10/10
However, every mailman I've ever talked to hates to have bees and other insects flying around them while they're delivering your mail. Considering either a low ground cover like creeping phlox and relocating these further from the mailbox
I have a yard full of bee balm - I'm sure OP will get some bees especially with the liatris. But I don't know if I'd ever say my yard was "Swarming" with bees.
I'd be more concerned about the height of the plants and they might flop over onto the driveway / sidewalk.
It's more of a respect thing than worrying about a swarm. You never know if your mailman is allergic to bees or wasps. They shouldn't have to be scared reaching into your mailbox. Although I think it's irrational for some people to have fear of bees, unfortunately a lot of people do.
This was my thought as well, especially with the goldenrod that close. I'd opt for maybe some low ground covers or grasses/sedges for habitat and then put a flowering bed nearby.
Fr Fr. Every time I see it I’m like, man that sucks for that postal worker.
you got room for like 100 more plants in there
more plant > less plant
i’m planning on letting the plants spread, i don’t want to over crowd them. hope it doesn’t take too long though
just to be clear, i'm not trying to tell you what to do. your garden, your rules. however, i do want to say that all of those plant species evolved together "shoulder-to-shoulder". the reason many new native gardeners have issues with plants flopping over is because those plants never had to support themselves on their own in the wild. they leaned on the plants next to them.
all of that to say: it's really hard to overcrowd native plants
I find this so strange btw. Growing up and when I first started learning about gardening, everything is like ‘make sure you have 18” between plants’ and I’m like but nature doesn’t do that.
I’ve convinced my wife that we need density now, because we had very few plants spread over a large area.
So much of the horticultural world is about working against nature than with it. That’s why you see big English style formal gardens and think, wow that’s a lot of work. Well, yeah, because you’re fighting what plants want to do (and often the plants aren’t even adapted to here)
I've always preferred the English cottage style gardens anyway. Happy that prairie style gardens are starting to catch on across the country.
I'm making a cottage style garden with natives. There's tons of natives in my area that look just like their European counterparts. Heck, they are sometimes literally the same species (genus? Obviously not the exact same species). Had someone rude tell me it wasn't cottage style with natives. Well screw them under my wisteria laden arbor.
Dude, screw that person. I bought a house with a cottage garden and I'm redoing everything in natives, and the areas that are popping off look even more cottage garden-y than they did before! It's a really great way to use natives.
When you say english style formal garden, am I correct when I picture a bunch of garden pansy separated by 24” in an overly mulched garden from the covers of Better Homes and Gardens?
That’s exactly what I mean! And those super pruned boxwoods ahah
Haha, yeah. That’s what I imagined.
Sometimes it can help save money, at least. There’s no need to plant phlox super close, for example—it’ll fill in on its own.
For some reason I didn’t realize what a rock star spreader phlox is! This year it’s all over and I am DOWN (needlessly feel the need to say that down is slang for glad in this context(pushes up glasses and backs out of the room))
Yeah, it’s genuinely amazing how good of a ground cover it is. It completely shuts out everything else that wants to grow up from underneath it.
Which kind of phlox are you talking about? I’ve got woodland phlox (aka wild blue phlox) and garden phlox in my garden and they’re growing well but not spreading outwards a ton
I also found moss phlox (phlox subulata) in my yard recently and it’s got grass growing through it to the point I’m worried it’ll be difficult to transplant it into my garden. Moss phlox isn’t actually native in my state, but I love phlox in all its forms and I’d be happy to use the moss phlox as a living mulch in my garden, but with how it’s acting so far I’m not sure it will actually block other plants out. I’ve seen people in other states with moss phlox that’s like an impenetrable carpet, but it doesn’t seem to be working like that here
I’ve been growing phlox subulata. If it’s not actually native to your state, I probably wouldn’t grow it there, though.
Definitely true!
Tell that to the Perky Sue that’s currently eating my short variety opuntia.
How about some sedge and packera aurea to fill the empty lower space. Your chosen plants are taller and it will look more natural if you fill out your lower plane as well.
That's a good point. Packera aurea is awesome too, because it'll bloom very early when none of these other plants are in bloom. It gives nectar to bees early in the season.
I'm looking for plants that dogs won't kill. People walking their dogs then peeing all over has killed most everything I've planted around my mailbox.
Maybe the trick is a tiny fire hydrant or other interesting thing next to the mail box for dogs to pee on?
I make cages for plants using dark green coated hardware cloth and securing with earth staples. That might work. I need to make more. My dogs peed on and killed one of my obedient plants. I've found the cages also keep slugs off my veggie plants.
I'm planning to plan Russian Sage for this exact reason.
I’m a bug loving mailman who condones this, however, I’d talk to your specific mailman who may not be as enthused as I would be lol. I’m constantly taking regal jumping spiders out of mailboxes and relocating them, as well as dodging the paper wasps trying to build new nests inside boxes.
Omg, we had ants in our mailbox for some reason when we first moved here and my spouse put diatomaceous earth in it, and I was like, no. The mail carrier could think it’s anthrax or cocaine, lol
I’d say plant more plants to fill in the space more, but also maybe find some smaller growing plants so your mailman won’t be struggling with bees and bugs in their face as they drop off your mail?
Ecologically, good choices, 10/10. In public facing areas like this though, the people care element should also be prioritized, which it doesn’t appear to be. We want folks to see native plantings in areas like this and think woohoo, that’s awesome! It’s pretty easy to plant natives in a way that makes people dislike them, unfortunately. Someone mentioned feng shui in another comment; I’d suggest a planting with more visual flow, this looks pretty hodge podge. As others suggested, plant more densely, starting with a one foot matrix of a low ground cover. Intersperse the gaps with flows/ groupings of 2-3 species depending on the species behavior (is it a clumper/colonizer/etc). I already forget what all species are on the photo as I type this besides Liatris and Eryngium, which are clumpers. You did good selecting for things that are an appropriate height for the space. Definitely nix the S. nemoralis, putting it next to the mailbox is the opposite of people care.
What does this space measure? Also are you somewhere that salts roads in winter? Because that will make a big difference in what will and won’t be happy here. Can’t make any specific species suggestions without a location.
Just here to agree with the people who are warning you about the poor delivery person who has to deliver to a swarm of bees... I feel like you are ignoring those comments? Lol, I was scared of bees until recently, and I think people underestimate what that fear is like
i’m definitely thinking about switching out what i planted for something more mailman friendly, but i’m not sure what to plant instead if i do switch it out.
FWIW Gray Goldenrod should stay well below the mailbox, which is why I put some at the base of mine just this week, along with butterfly weed. The liatris might reach up.
I can’t imagine being a mailman and being afraid of common environmental factors outside like bugs.
That's fine, we are all different 👍
Y’all need to stop worrying about this hypothetical mail carrier.
Is there anything I can do to improve it?
Go with three instead of two Rattlesnakes is my only thought, the whole feng shui thing, odd numbered plants is what I have always see suggested in garden planning, but it is of course up to you. Love the Rattlesnake Masters, think I have 7 in my yard, they get hammered by wasps when in bloom.
would crowding be an issue? i have a larger rattlesnake master i might transplant into there.
Not an issue generally. Prairie plants like these grow suuuuper tightly in the wild
I cram as many as I can in, you may need to widen it a bit if you add a third Rattlesnake Master. Mine are a couple feet across each, I have them clustered pretty close together.
YES, YES it will be. Rattlesnake master is an obscene plant that will grow big enough to smoosh out everything else you got there- just one. They turn into watermelon sized plants. If you want more watermelon sized plants, just don't clean up their seed heads. I've got literally thousands.
I don't know what everyone else is doing, but to me, ALL of the plants are WAY too close to eachother. I'm dividing like crazy, giving away plants, and trying to force my babies on everyone I meet. And I'm not a foot of mulch around each plant kinda person- they expanded to shoulder to shoulder, no room for me to get in to weed.
You'll be thinning out this garden in no time with the tiny babies you currently have.
Talk to your mail person to see if they have plant allergies. Goldenrod can be bad if they do.
Edit: Sorry to be wrong, everyone! Happy to learn something new.
goldenrod does not cause allergies. its pollen is sticky and dispersed by insects. you're confusing goldenrod with ragweed.
Goldenrod is pollinated by insects, not wind, so it's actually hard to trigger a goldenrod allergy without touching the plant directly. Usually, a "goldenrod allergy" is actually a ragweed allergy, which blooms at the same time and even grows alongside goldenrods so the showier plant gets the blame. Ragweed pollen is spread by wind, so it's all in the air when they're blooming.
Good to know! I’d always heard it was bad for allergies. Didn’t mean to spread misinformation.
You have your plants too close together. The golden rod will shade and then eventually eat the liatris.
That’s not true. These plants evolved together.
Ok, maybe my experiences in WNC are different. I have been building habit and playing with natives for 25 years, but maybe it's my environment. Here, without careful weeding, the goldenrod is aggressive both at the root and through seeds. Sometimes the liatris is happier, but usually the goldenrod is more suited to many environments and takes over.
Oh some kinds of goldenrod are very aggressive. Canada goldenrod is a no-no for small spaces. But showy goldenrod doesn’t spread aggressively. Sorry for the snappy tone 🙃
Sorry for the misinformation!!! Thank you for the new information!
Also, tired. Good reminder to remember to fully read and be quiet on days like this. 😝
I’m like that 99% of days lol
I'm glad today was a good day for you. I needed the teaching moment 🙃. Sorry OP!!!
I would say avoid plants that attract pollinators (bees) out of respect for our mail delivery folks. That’s a regulation in my neighborhood.
All due respect, they visit once a day for about 15 seconds. So for 99.983% of the day, they aren't there.
But if everyone did it....
In other words, plant nothing?
Grasses instead of flowers, etc. Again, it’s just an additional effort to be courteous to USPS folks sticking their hands in/around those areas. Of course there’s risk, but we can certainly choose wisely to help mitigate.
Just wondering if that spot is as damp as the rattlesnake master is going to want...
I have mine in a dry-ish spot, and they seem to do ok (this is year three for mine, so they are established but not for very long).
They’re drought tolerant once established so
Just make sure the soil there is well-drained as all of those species trend towards drier habitats.
Bees aside, as someone who has a thick patch of tall prairie plants (including rattlesnake master), that tall stuff really quickly flops over and never stands back up straight. What used to look like a compact garden will look like it got stepped on by a giant. It's important to keep that in mind. You could chop them back and they might recover with straight regrowth again but it also might not appreciate being chopped in the middle of a hot summer.
2/2
Commenting because I'd like to know. I'm also looking to plant native around my mailbox
I planted a bunch of shorter natives by mine and the one thing that REALLY loves being out by the road is Hairy beardtongue. I wanted to plant a couple taller species but didn't want the mail person to worry about wasps or bees, plus I was worried about my plants flopping into the road, so the tallest out there now is Hoary vervain and royal catchfly.
do you have a skittish mail carrier who might be a bit bug-phobic? Gray Goldenrod seems like a bee magnet: A wide range of insects visit the flowers for pollen and nectar, including long-tongued bees, short-tongued bees, Sphecid and Vespid wasps, flies, butterflies, moths and beetles. Bee pollinators include honey bees, Little Carpenter bees, Halictid bees and Plasterer bees.
It is, but it's a little guy who won't reach the mailbox.
I have had more luck planting 3 of one plant per location- they seem to go with “when 2 or 3 are gathered, we’ll grow” - it looks like you get plenty of sun, so I would go with just 1 of the plants that you have
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