[removed]
I would also thank the neighbor for being kind and going to you first.
Yeah. My neighbor called animal control straight away.
I would definitely talk to any neighbour that seemed halfway normal if I ever had a noise concern, but people tend to react negatively and take issues personally, so I can understand why some people would avoid confronting the issue directly.
My neighbour’s children would shout and bang on the walls until 1 or 2am some nights (shared wall). I wrote a polite letter and put it in their mailbox, only to find it crumpled up in my own mailbox the next day. The kids started making even more noise (deliberately screaming late at night whilst hitting the wall), and the neighbours started throwing garbage into my backyard over our shared fence. Any past experience like that might lead someone to choose a non direct way to solve the problem in the future.
Agreed. My neighbours filed a complaint with our building when we first got our pup without speaking to us once, and it was not a great feeling. Coupled with the fact that we'd been tolerating their extremely noisy children at all hours of the night for over two years without complaint. Our landlord was super kind about it, but it still sucked.
should have complained to landlord about the kids afterwards
When he was letting us know about the complaint, the landlord actually said "they don't think their kids bother people???" We debated being petty, but we were moving out within the month.
“Hello good day. Everyday your KIDS are barking from morning to night…”
“They sell parenting books on Amazon….”
Hahahahahaha!!! No one ever complains about me or my kids barking! Ever! We bark a lot too!!
at my old apartment a lady complained about my dog for barking at her dog... who was also barking and started the confrontation. turned out she didn't even live in the complex, just liked to visit her friend who lived below me and would always bring her dog. and my dog was never even on the patio unless i was home anyways, she probably had my dog bark back at hers maybe twice? before trying to file a complaint
I once got a complaint for my dog barking but I work from home and she wasn’t barking at all… no one at the office believed me and just said “well, if your dog wasn’t barking, you have nothing to worry about, right?!” I just rolled my eyes. We were moving to a house with a dog door and yard the next month and now she DOES bark at the neighbor dogs who bark back lol
Same. When we moved into our current place the people who lived next door (we’re an end unit townhouse so thankfully just one neighbor) complained to management about barking instead of coming to us. They did not have a history of barking so we really didn’t know. About a week after the move they finally settled down and I think the dogs were just probably confused about moving, so they barked. We did get on friendlier terms with the neighbors and then they eventually moved but I was very annoyed they didn’t come to us to talk about it.
There was woman upstairs from us who would always give us dirty looks because my dogs would bark whenever they saw her kids.( Tiny dachshunds tend to not care for loud large kids who ran at them screaming) we lived on the ground floor and would leave the blinds open a little so they could watch people.
One night around midnight my SO is up playing COD and was startled by loud banging on the window. He jumps up and runs out there and it’s the two boys.
We checked the cameras. Those kids were banging on our window while we weren’t home. After that, when those boys saw my SO they would run back into their place.
I’ve also read some posts about people checking footage from cameras from a few months prior to after owning the dog for a few months, only to find the ‘seemingly understanding neighbor’ coming next door to harass the dog. Only causing separation anxiety to deepen into their dog. Hopefully this neighbor wouldn’t do sick shit like that.
I have a neighbor in back of me that tries to get my dogs going, she sits out there making barking noises & laughing at my dog- caught her twice because she didn’t know I was out there & called her a cunt. Silence after that. We call them the crackheads,not only, because they were putting Christmas decorations up in underwear (freezing here) in the middle of the night
I'm just imagining being idiotic enough to sit there barking at a dog and antagonizing him like that, and then one day to hear "cunt" out of nowhere 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
You would feel like King of the Idiots, what are you even going to say? Lol.
Gold.
Truly a decent human being. Asks for a good compromise before taking to "the man."
Yeah. I would've baked them cookies or something to show I'm grateful. Nowadays people are going straight to the person in charge of the building. I've seen it happen many times in the one I live in.
I agree. I still try and take that approach. Problem is damned if you do and damned if you don’t with some people.
This. I had a neighbor file a complaint immediately. Same day they (or someone else) left a nasty note on my door in the apartment building I’d just moved into. First day at work and I come home to that note and get a complaint in the mail shortly thereafter.
Then ask if the neighbour would like some company during the day, in the form of hanging out with your dog
Second, I would tell the neighbor to type that shit up. That handwriting is horrible lol
This is very difficult because I understand both sides of the issue. I once lived in an apartment where the person on top of me had a dog that barked all day long. I work from home and it caused a lot of problems on my conference calls. I felt so bad, that I told her that I would keep the dog during the day to keep it company. The dog was really old and had dementia, but I took it in during the day while she went to work and I took care of the dog for her. That was my only solution and it worked out for us, but I know not everyone can do this.
You are an amazing person to do that for her and that poor dog.
You’re kind. The dog needed care and I was working from home anyway. It worked out.
You are an amazing person.
Holy shit I did not know dogs could develop dementia
Yes it’s kind of common. I volunteer at a senior dog rescue and some will just walk in circles all day.
Or get stuck in corners or closets. Then they bark because they trust you'll find them. The only way to keep the calm is to have them with you all of the time. You can tell they just can't understand certain things anymore. Really highlights what dogs do understand and we take for granted.
I compare it to puppyhood in a sense. They unlearn what they should know and get really needy. It's so sad to watch.
This is exactly what happened to our old dog. She’d wander into a closet or bathroom and close the door with her but when she turned around in the small space. But she had also stopped barking at some point in the past few months leading up to this. One day she’d been stuck in our powder room for likely an hour or two before we realized
My sister worked at a vet clinic and an old lab chewed her own pads off. It was horrible. The family didn't want to put her down so her feet would have bandages all the time and a cone. The dog was suffering very advanced dementia.
I could not man. If it was me in that position I'd want to be put down. Dementia, alzheimer, schizophrenia, they terrify. They're the one thing I am truly afraid of in life.
That can also be a sign of a brain tumor. Just happened with my dog a couple months ago. His face got really swollen on one side & he would only walk in circles. He had a history of seizures so that was the conscience with both our vet & second opinion. We said goodbye to him before it got any worse.
My dog developed Alzheimers. Cognitive decline in old age is just as much a risk for dogs as it is for humans.
That’s a beautiful compromise
It’s not really a compromise. It’s seems more like volunteer work for your neighbor
Or an act of compassion for an ailing animal
It was a solution that worked for them, but unfortunately is untenable for every single situation.
I don’t think anyone particular person in this instance is in the wrong, but the owner of the dog should be taking more proactive steps in solving this issue.
Its really sad that compassion often gets labeled as being a doormat.
I apologize because I may have not worded things properly. I think u/loonachic is a total hero for support their neighbor and is nothing like a doormat, and I applaud u/Arsinoei for putting themselves forward in this way in the healthcare profession. I am merely arguing that OP isn't making any concessions in that scenario and this isn't what I would consider a "compromise." It's more semantics than anything else.
Rather as u/BooYourFace stated, I think OP should be more proactive.
Just so you know I didnt reply my comment due to yours. I didnt take it that way I mean.
I just spend a lot of time on /AITA and there compassion is seen as icky. So in general on reddit, compassion is often seen as being a doormat.
Very fair. AITA can often be driven by ultra-logic and what's "fair" while neglecting normal human emotions. Thanks for clarifying.
As a nurse, I feel this personally.
Compassion, empathy and kindness is the only way forward for the human race. However, these traits are quite often perceived as weakness. I’d rather be perceived as weak than change my personality and become hard and cold. It’s a delicate balance sometimes.
. I’d rather be perceived as weak than change my personality and become hard and cold.
Agree. I've seen some of the worst humanity can give and I CHOOSE to give back compassion, empathy and kindness. It's free. If someone takes advantage of that, well thats a reflection of them not me.
That’s exactly right.
This is so heartwarming! What a sweet compromise. I know this doesn’t work for every situation but what a kind and understanding way to handle what could’ve been a shitty situation for all involved. Kudos to you!
Thanks! Sometimes it takes that to solve a problem. It wasn’t the doggies fault.
I admire your kindness. Our downstairs neighbor's dog barks all day, every day, and my wife and I both work from home. We've thought about doing what you did (we have a puppy and thought maybe they could entertain each other) but then we hear the tenant downstairs come home and scream like a psychopath at the dog (and into her phone) and slam doors, so we're just not willing to step into the situation. We had to go with complaining to the management company.
Yeah… every situation is different. You have to do what’s best. Some people don’t deserve to have dogs.
This is my favorite story today. You are awesome.
Awww… thanks!
Yeah, I had a dog in an apartment and my downstairs neighbour offered to go check on my puppy if she was getting really barky. She only had to go in once or twice, but it was still reassuring to know someone was watching out for her!
Wow, you’re a wonderful human and that was a crazy compassionate solution.
Thanks! The poor dog was old and really didn’t know where it was. It just needed company. And treats! :)
Truly a beautiful thing you did, for the dog and for the dog’s family. Just completely kind and generous.
You’re a better person than me.
Some people just really like dogs. When I wasn't able to have a dog of my own I was always thrilled to look after my neighbour's dogs. They thought I was doing them a favour, but they were really doing me a favour.
Hire a trainer to work on the separation anxiety.
If he hates being locked in his crate, then try not locking him in. Put up a baby gate, let him roam a little more and keep the counters and floor clear so that he can't get into anything.
Try leaving for short periods of time and then come back and treat for remaining quiet. Gradually increase the amount of time you are outside and get him used to you leaving and confident you'll come back.
I don't know if this will help, OP, but its exactly what we do for our dog. He has his own little room (used to be my room, but thats dog ownership) that he stays in. We used to have the crate in there, but found that he always slept on the armchair, so now the crate is gone and the baby gate is up. Anything we leave in that room we can trust him with. We've also recently opened it up to the dining room, so now he has more access, though I doubt he uses it. He would hate being locked up in the crate all day, too.
Thank you! This idea may work for me having him in my home office and then expanding to the rest of the house. He’s always so destructive it just worries me.
Dogs get destructive due to boredom.
And separation anxiety.
If your dog is being destructive, he isn't getting enough exercise, & that means both physical & mental. You live in an apartment & you got an extremely high energy breed that wasn't the best choice for apartment living. If he isn't in puppy classes, enroll him immediately. Also, start taking him on longer walks. The bare minimum is 45 minutes. Ideally, he would get an hour walk twice a day. A good dog is a tired dog, & that is especially true with herding breeds.
Thank you. I recently moved into an apartment after living in a house with a large yard my whole life, I didn’t expect it to be this difficult. I understand now I def have to put more effort into exercising if I want his behavior to be better.
Don't discount mental stimulation as well, whether it's a puzzle game with treats, or a Kong, Lickpad, or something similar with frozen food/yogurt/peanut butter in it that will occupy him for long periods and prevent him from using his mouth for barking. This helped for me (in combination with giving him more space to roam safely and longer walks in the morning. My pup is an aussie mix and high energy and we do lots of exercise (long walks and/or flirt pole play) before he needs to settle, it's a combination of things but you need to tire him out.
I just got some lickpads yesterday! thanks for advice.
I have been struggling to get my high-energy Lab mix enough mental stimulation without breaking the bank. Wrapping up kibble in paper or even an old rag and then putting it in a cardboard box is a cheap puzzle game that is fun and takes the edge off for him. Plus, the game changes with ever Amazon delivery and he can shred the paper and box as long as he’s interested!
Good advice here, OP. Mental and physical stimulation and you'll find it gets better.
Can you get a dog walker to take him out during the day and tire him out?
I didn't mean to be so harsh--your dog can absolutely thrive with apartment living even if he isn't the ideal breed for your current living situation. If he gets proper exercise & starts to learn new things from obedience classes, he will become much easier to live with, especially as he gets older. Ideally, you can find a local class that uses positive reinforcement & has levels from puppies all the way to Canine Good Citizen (if you are in the US). If in person classes aren't possible for whatever reason, look for videos on YouTube.
As far as specific advice: you said that you will put him in the crate with a treat or Kong that he will finish, & then start barking. While you are home, put him in the crate with his usual snack. As soon as he finishes, and most importantly, before he starts to whine, let him out. He needs to learn that you will come back. Gradually increase the time by a minute once he starts to catch on that he gets to leave the crate whenever he is quiet. Eventually, his anxiety will lessen because he will know for sure that you do come back & he isn't going to be stuck there indefinitely.
I had to take mine to daycare every day. Extremely expensive but I got to keep both my apartment & dog that way. She had separation anxiety from me day 1. She didn't have the best first few months of life so understandable & an anxious breed on top of it. Just glad I got her out of her bad situation.
I understand you. I work from home and my dog goes with me everywhere. The other week I exercised him all day did some training and went to a super bowl party for 3 hours and left him in his crate. From what I heard from my grandma he was an absolute mess. So ever since then I’ve worked on leaving him alone in his crate while I’m there. Start with 10 minutes or 5. If their quiet reward and treat. Do it again. Make it harder leave the house stand outside the door. Wait it out a couple minutes come in and calmly open the door and praise them. I also started making sure that every time I took him out of his crate I wasn’t overly excited. Otherwise he got too wound up in his crate waiting for the party that was outside of his crate. It takes time and effort it’s not a quick fix. But you’ve got this.
Thank you so much. It makes me feel so much better to see someone in the same situation. I’ll definitely take this advice.
I have been the person with the neighbor who has a dog that did actually bark all day long and it drove me crazy. An hour to three can in fact feel like all day.
Thank your neighbor for speaking to you first and acknowledge that you are working on it. Then go to the vet and find a good trainer to work on separation anxiety. In the meantime do research on appropriate training methods to help curb this as well as any destructive behaviors if you do not yet feel comfortable leaving him out of his crate. Do not leave your dog alone until it gets sorted out. If you’re going out drop him off at daycare or find a sitter. It is your responsibility to figure this out ASAP and it is not something that he will just grow out of over time. My understanding is that Aussies can be highly anxious and routine focused.
Your neighbor has a right to a quiet living space.
What is your dog's job? What does it do every day that keeps their mind engaged? At 9 months, it should be possible to have the dog crate trained.
You got a dog that was bred to independently herd sheep for weeks at a time. Mini aussies have all those same genetics but have just been bred to be smaller (I suspect a cross occurred but that's another story). Aussies are cute, sure. But they are NOT going to naturally take to apartment life.
Your neighbor is being nice. Start by crating the dog and walking away for a minute or less...when the dog pauses its barking to listen for you, enter the room and reward. Crate training takes time when the dog is at this stage so now you must counter condition and work harder to make the crate a rewarding place to be. They don't grow out of it because you've set your dog up to fail. It associates the crate with being away from its greatest resource...you. The crate should be a resource where good things happen.
People get high energy dogs and then are surprised when they don’t want to be stuck in an apartment all day
Right? It might seem harsh or "unfair" but.. not everyone has what it takes to keep em calm and happy. Why not chill companion dogs??
chill companion dogs for apartments
Genuine question: Any breeds come to mind? One that gets on with cats?
Loads of options depending on some of your preferences for training, size, and grooming. Take your pick of any well-bred toy breed. Chihuahuas aren’t typically demonic, they’re sweet, loyal, and silly. Greyhounds are popular because they want to have one or two high octane zoomies a day, and after that job is well done, nap times. Bostons, newfies, Tibetan spaniels… but it will always come down to the individual temperament of the dog. Find an adult to adopt where you know their temperament, or find a responsible breeder that will match you to a puppy with the appropriate temperament.
I would also recommend Great Danes. Fabulously lazy dogs. Obviously you still need to take them out and let them stretch a bit, but my Dane is the laziest dog I have ever met. All she wants to do is snuggle on the bed all day. We go to the dog park and she just hangs out with me for the most part. If she gets an hour of exercise she is will basically sleep the rest of the day away. Lol.
I had the pleasure of training a male Dane from 9 months to 1 year old. I know he was young, but he was anything but lazy. I was always worried about his legs/acls… dude would jump like nothing you’ve seen a Dane do before. Clear over a full sized Rotty and GSD lol
Dachshund! Most loyal hound and loooooves the couch. Smart as a whip as well
Greyhound + cats is a generally shit idea.
I've got an 8 year old Newfie with the energy of a golden pup 😂 highly recommend adopting adult dogs where you know what their temperament and needs will be.
Chihuahuas aren’t typically demonic
I haven't met one that wasn't...
edit: I get it, not all chihuahuas are demonic. I'll never judge a dog based on previous interactions with the breed, and I'm sure that there are lovely chihuahuas out there, just like there's lovely pit bulls. I just have never met a chihuahua that wasn't demonic.
You should meet my two! They’ve converted quite a few people into chihuahua people (including my fiancé, and my bull terrier loving cousin).
They’re excellent dogs when raised right.
At lot of people raise them terribly because they think it’s cute or funny. Also I had a deer-head chihuahua growing up, and I think they fare better than the apple-heads.
I promise that they’re not supposed to/don’t have to be. Sadly few people get to meet well bred ones, and there are less responsible breeders than irresponsible ones. From their standard: “General Appearance: A graceful, alert, swift-moving compact little dog with saucy expression, and with terrier-like qualities of temperament. … Temperament: Alert, projecting the 'terrier-like' attitudes of self importance, confidence, self- reliance.”
I met one chihuahua that did agility and talent competitions, and it was one of the best trained dogs I have seen in my life. I also know a chihuahua that never received beneficial training and was taught to bite hands because the family thought it was cute to see an aggressive small thing since the dog couldn’t really harm people… I think small dog behavior, especially chihuahua, comes down to whether the owner takes the time and attention to raise a friendly dog or if they let behavior that does NOT fly with big dogs thrive because their dog is little and thus not really dangerous if aggressive.
Thought so too, until I met a sweet one that asked for pets a lot and wanted to cuddle.
Havanese... Couch potato breed.
And high on the hypoallergenic scale.
Mine is a havanese and he is anything but a couch potato. It feels like a full time job keeping him entertained lol.
My havanese is ridiculously lazy. She would sleep in bed until noon each day if I let her. But when she is down to have fun, she's super active. Great tempment and super fun companion dog.
I can only speak from personal experience, but I am a HUGE advocate for shih tzus. They just roll w whatever you got on the daily; happy to relax, also happy to go on a hike (but maybe bring a tote haha). Mine got along great w my bff's cat. Idk, I'm generally hesitant to recommend any breeds though, as there are always outliers that break the "rule of chill" lol
I was going to recommend Shih Tzus as well. Mine loved to go hiking, camping, kayaking but she would also sleep all day if there was nothing to do.
I second shih tzus! I grew up with them, they’re lovely and chilled out little dogs. I also have two fat lazy chihuahuas, and while one is a little anxious, they’re also great apartment dogs (we live in a 1 bedroom in cramped Brooklyn).
Shih Tzus are excellent dogs. Prone to health issues tho, esp eyes and skin. My mom is on her 3rd Shih Tzu, a puppy around a year old. That dog will play fetch nonstop for six hours and then cuddle with you for six more.
I have mastiffs. Great with 3 cats and enjoys lolling around all day
Ahh mastiffs are some of my favorite dogs ever!! My previous apt though (and a lot of apts in the area--DC, USA) didnt allow mastiffs :( prob just bc of the size though
I've got a french mastiff so one of the "smaller" breeds. So its a little easier to overcome those rules....
Ooh youre giving me ideas for my next dog ;)
Try to have an apartment that doesn't require lots of stair climbing. Mastiffs can get joint issues from what i heard
Lol, because Bordeaux's are pretty rare in North America they often are not recognized as a mastiff! I've had 2 and there great. Happy to be lazy but also willing to hike for a couple of hours.
I have a Cavalier King Charles Spaniel which is known as the cat breed of dogs and the perfect apartment dog. He spends most of the day chilling next to me or napping in our apartment when we aren't out and about. He gets three 10-20 minute potty breaks (sometimes only 1 minute if the weather is not to his liking lol) and one 30-45 minute walk per day. He is very easy to care for and perfect for our apartment lifestyle. However, he does need to be groomed every 6 weeks and brushed regularly which can be a deal breaker for some
Keeshonden (Dutch breed, it’s why the word is Dutch)
Greyhound, well, maybe not so nice with cats. But they are pretty chill.
Maltese
Edit: also golden retrievers, if you are up for more walks and giving them a job to do in the afternoon. But they need the extra mental stimulation every day.
I have a golden puppy now, and there's no way I would try to have her in an apartment unless that apartment had a fenced yard. She's only 14 weeks, and she needs at least 20-30 minutes of play after every meal. She does nap a lot, but I'm anticipating her playtime to get longer to get the amount of napping we get now.
I have a Newfoundland puppy and he's wayyyy more chill than even a lot of adult dogs I've had in the past. Of course it depends dog to dog and isn't all just breed-based but Newfies are amazingly calm and chill. He gets along great with my cats too.
I live in an apartment and have a frenchie! She loves going to the dog park and long walks on active days, but she is also equally just as happy spending 3 straight days on the couch.
She gets along with my cat but i wouldn't say my cat is the biggest fan of hers lol
Yeah my friend has 2 frenchies in an apartment and they are the biggest couch potatoes. They'll play with her for 30 minutes or so when she gets home and then they chill the rest of the time
I have a greyhound/pitbull mix and he’s the chillest dog ever. Unless people come over then he’s hype until they sit down and let him get in their laps. Then it’s back to chilling.
People feel entitled to working breeds because they want the looks, and then want to turn them into couch ornaments. Tragically common with the herding breeds because of the damn blue Merle obsession people have.
Two breeds we never wanted when searching for puppies to adopt is Aussies and Huskies because of how high energy they are. Turns out our puppy is part Aussie. So now we go on 1.5-2 mile sniff walks every morning with lots of training, along with a puzzle toy, and she gets a frozen Kong or goughnut when we leave. We adjusted to meet her needs as a high energy dog, because that's what responsible pet ownership is. Ours is conked out the entire time until her dog walker comes.
When my partner and I were looking for a dog to adopt, he wanted a cattle dog mix because they're cute and small. I absolutely did not because those dogs need someone with the time and energy to let them run and run or have a job to do. I take care of new dog the majority of the time and I just would not have the time or energy for a high-energy dog like a cattle dog.
There are always outliers to be fair. We got our blue heeler when she was 2 and the rescue told us she would be suitable for apartment life. Thankfully they were right. Every dog is different.
Because people spread misinformation that dogs don't have inheitable behavior traits and all you need to do is train them right.
As long as you're exercising them properly sleeping in an apartment rather than a house isn't a big difference. Like I get your point, but there are a lot of people that completely think they can't have a breed/dog they already like because they have to live in an apartment. My pup doesn't get most of his exercise from just chilling in my backyard. I still have to engage with him and take him out.
the dog barks morning to night and OP said it’s crated that whole time, dog’s spending whole days in a crate, i feel like crate training is kind of out the window, it’s likely the crate now just triggers the dog everytime. as another comment said, it’s probably time to ease the dog into free roaming
OP said elsewhere they work from home so it’s not that long (1-3 hours at most). They could be lying but they don’t really have a reason to. I said in my comment exactly what you are saying that counter-conditioning is now necessary because they set their dog up to fail.
He is not in a crate all day. He is in a crate when I leave 1-3 hours to run errands. Some days I do not leave at all. He is only crated at night to sleep. He voluntarily goes into his crate when I say “in” but does not want to stay in when I am not home.
So then why is the neighbor saying your dog barks morning till night?
an exaggeration in the midst of being upset.
Rude
When my dog was young we had to put a blanket over her crate or she'd bark constantly. She let us know when she didn't need this anymore, by shredding it :)
LOL same
Have you practiced leaving him in a crate while you are home for microscopic amounts of time. Let him out a minute later and give him a treat so he knows you will return and he will be rewarded. Such a hard issue. My rescue also struggles while alone and we live in an apartment and it makes me paranoid. So I usually take her with me or doggy day care.
This is a really good idea, I’ll try this today for sure.
And it’s important to note that this will not be something you can fix in a day. It takes repetition and dedication. You have a smart breed that absolutely can be trained.
My understanding is that you shouldn’t treat when you return (or release) as it reinforces good things only happen when you are there. I give my dog a kong or throw some food in her crate when I leave to reinforce that good things happen when I’m gone or if she’s in her crate.
You’re right about that. I don’t treat my girl when I get home either. I stroll in like nothing happened
I'm genuinely not trying to be rude here, but this "really good idea" of starting with very small increments of time in the crate and reinforcing that and working up to longer time is crate training 101. That's a big chunk of what crate training IS, usually. Same concept for going away from the house without the dog. Small increments that get longer.
So if I'm clear, you're putting him in a crate and leaving for a couple hours, without the dog ever actually having been through an incremental crate training process or alone training? If so, that's probably a large part of the issue here. Being ok alone and/or ok in a crate is a skill that needs to be learned, not something that comes naturally. You start from where their comfort zone is, and you slowly slowly push it and expand it in bite sized steps. You want to put him in the crate, and then bustle around in the same room, ducking away out of sight and back in, so long as he can remain calm. Change the increments of time by literal seconds at a time at first, then minutes, then tens of minutes as he gets better at it. Give great yummy things in the crate. And definitely do as much reading as you can on this subject.
Best of luck!
If you work from home, try crating him when you are there and using positive reinforcement training to be quiet.
If you let him out when he’s barking he is learning that barking gets him what he wants. Never ever let him out if he’s actively barking. If you only let him out when he’s quiet he will learn the opposite behavior gets him what he wants.
There are some great online resources for exactly this situation that worked for me and my pup.
Many dogs with separation anxiety also have confinement issues. Crating will likely make it worse
Yep. My dog was not crate trained when we adopted him and I found out the hard way - he went in the crate but when we closed the door he immediately had severe anxiety and was crying and desperately trying to get out, so this might not be an option for OP
I have a 1.5 year old dachshund who has SA. I’ve been trying to crate him since we got him at 8 weeks old, but my partner likes to keep him in bed with us at night and that has made the crating so hard. He pants when he is in there for awhile, and gets especially drooly/anxious when he figures out we’ve left the house. Sometimes, he’ll even start to dig up the corner of his bedding in the crate. Partner keeps insisting that we should just leave the crate door open and just keep him confined to our bedroom (that’s where we keep the crate anyway). But I’m worried that this will just allow him to pull up the carpet at the door, just like he does now with his bedding. What do you think? What’s your recommendation?
Our rescue had confinement issues from being abandoned but would hurt herself/ destroy things if she wasn't crated.
We were lucky enough to work from home during this time so we could take it super slow with crate training and let her practice walking in without ever having a door shut. Then a momentary door shut, then a door shut for 30 seconds to a minute while we walked away but stayed in the room, etc.
It took months! But she can be safely crated now without upset and oddly enough the same training made her less destructive outside the crate so now she only gets crated while we eat and if we will be gone for large periods of time.
Have to say though, letting the pup sleep in your bed is probably contradicting the crate training. We've always treated bed sharing as something our dogs graduate to and not something they should take for granted or demand. Not saying you should too, but maybe an alternative to consider.
Do you have any links?
I always start with the akc site and then google sections that I want more detail on.
This is where I started with separation anxiety and crate training.
https://www.akc.org/expert-advice/training/leaving-puppy-alone/
https://www.akc.org/expert-advice/training/how-to-prevent-your-dog-from-barking-when-home-alone/
Thank you!
If you let him out when he’s barking he is learning that barking gets him what he wants. Never ever let him out if he’s actively barking. If you only let him out when he’s quiet he will learn the opposite behavior gets him what he wants.
You can't reinforce an emotional response.
Sounds like your dog has separation anxiety/isolation anxiety.
It’s vocalizing because it can’t emotionally handle being alone. Lucky for you, it doesn’t sound super severe because he can be distracted from his emotions by food treats, but as soon as the foods gone, it’s just him and his emotions and he can’t handle it.
The more you leave him, the worse it will get, and could escalate to self injury if he tries to chew out of/dig out of his crate.
There is a simple short book called “I will be home soon” you should pick up and work through, that I would guess works for most minor cases. If that doesn’t work, probably want to consider a separation anxiety trainer.
I would highly recommend not leaving him alone for longer than he is ready for, implementing a training plan, and building alone time duration before it gets worse.
Thank you! Will definitely look into that book too
Once you make a plan I’d also recommend talking to your neighbor & letting them know what you’re doing to solve the barking, that it might take a bit of time to completely resolve, and thank them for their patience in the meantime.
how long do you leave him alone? what did you do to get him used to being alone? have you talked to your vet about meds (like fluoxetine?)
Leaving the TV on and something I've worn on the bed seems to have worked for our Melissa. A Thunder Coat didn't work for her, but it's worth a try.
Our dog also calms better with white noise - rather than TV we use the “Calm My Dog” app played through Alexa. It works well!
My dog hates the TV and barks incessantly whenever it's on. 😅 We've tried getting him used to having something on the screen by playing Spotify on it though, and that seems to work a bit better (no giant, moving pictures).
Is he crated when you leave? I would let him free-roam in a room he is most familiar with where he hangs out with you when you are home, but remove anything he may be tempted to destroy. Make sure to really tire him out before you go and leave a densely packed frozen kong for him on his place.
This is what we did with our dog when he was around the same age. Prior to this he had major separation anxiety and cried and became destructive, but once we started doing this he became really comfortable by himself. We also slowly increased time away from him. Starting with walks around the block, to doing grocery shops, and now we can be gone for 8 hours and he just sleeps.
Edit: also completely ignore him for a few minkes when you first get home, and other than giving him the kong, don’t say or do anything when you leave. And add in sessions where you leave when you don’t have to go anywhere (i.e. put on coat and shoes and grab your keys) and then come straight back in again a few minutes later. It helps them understand it isn’t a big deal and you will always come back, and sometimes it may be very quick
He is crated when I leave. Going to start trying to ease him into being let out while I’m away. Thanks for the advice!
Doggie daycare?
Lots of exercise, dog daycare, puppy play dates, music on when you leave. I tried crate training my puppy in an apartment, tried everything didn’t work so I let her have the place and she did great. Got a wyze camera so i could see her. Trial and error and patience! I also did solliquin for awhile when she was young and I think it helped. Keep windows closed so se can’t get wild up from outside views.
Thank you! I have seen a lot of people speaking on cams. I think it would be helpful for me to understand his behavior when I’m not here.
This likely isn't a problem you can solve overnight - so OP please make sure you're updating your neighbor on what you're doing to minimize the likelihood that they go to management.
Not only does it let them know that you're taking their complaint seriously, but it's nice to know that there's some updates - "hey, we're trying XYZ and we were told by a trainer to give it X amount of time to see if it works. We're also trying PRQ..." It'll let the neighbor know that you're not ignoring their complaint even if it does take some time to fix.
Maybe also offer to buy ear plugs or something small - just to hold the neighbor over until you're able to resolve the dog barking issue.
so i have a mini aussie that’s about the same age (1.5 years). what i did when i’d go to work is leave him with the radio on near his cage. when i first got him i also wore an old shirt for a long time (like 3 days, usually to sleep or something) and then put it in the cage with him so he’d smell me. i never had any noise complaints or anything of the sort
Thank you for this advice!
Your pup is a high energy working dog. They were bred to never tire out. You cannot tire them out solely from exercise, there needs to be mental stimulation as well, but the best thing to do is to train them to enjoy being calm and relaxed.
My high energy blue Heeler enjoys sleeping at my feet all day after a morning walk, a frozen kong to settle with afterwards and maybe some ball play in the afternoon.
The Relaxation Protocol is one of the best training protocols for high energy dogs. It teaches them how to switch off, calm down, relax and enjoy it.
https://journeydogtraining.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/ProtocolforRelaxation.pdf
https://championofmyheart.com/relaxation-protocol-mp3-files/
Start the training and you should notice a difference quite quickly, within a couple of weeks (mine picked it up within a few days). She is still a high energy, excitable girl but will happily rest at my feet or in her open crate or on her bed for most of the day now.
Best of luck!
What about a play pen with a roof attached to his crate so he has a bit more space and doesn’t feel locked in?
I am considering that or giving him full access to one room in the house. Thank you for this suggestion.
Yeah puppy proofing a room is a good idea!!
First, thank your neighbor and tell them specifically what you are doing to fix the issue as they have a right to a quiet living space and more than 15 mins of continuous barking from a dog is a violation of that.
Then hire a professional trainer. Separation anxiety is a big issue and hard to train out of. This is not something you can tackle on your own because if you dog barks 1-3 hours constantly then the damage has already been done and is beyond your skill level.
If you cannot put in the time/money do that then you should talk to your landlord about breaking your lease and move to a single family home where your dog can bark all day long without disturbing others.
Best of luck.
Find a doggie daycare/sitter/walker. It’s not good for them to be alone all day 😞
I recommend doggie daycare 2-3 days a week. My husband and I also work from home but it gives us a chance to run errands, nap, focus on work without disruptions.
For the pup, it’s socialization, exercise, mental stimulation, and helps them detach from you a bit since they are learning to have some fun without you.
In regards to the neighbor, I would let the neighbor know that you are working on it and appreciate the note. There are still going to be some louder days than others while you are working on training your pup and see if there are days or specific hours that they really need quiet time. They could potentially also be working from home and it turns out that your errands hour happens to be during their important weekly call so it feels like all day.
Edit to add: from my research doggie daycare runs from $25-50 a day depending on your area.
That’s the thing! I work from home. I am home all day!!! It’s the pockets of time where I leave for 1-3 hours that he hates.
Then take him with you or do something with him during the time that you’re away. Sounds like your dog has separation anxiety. Time to do some training.
You can’t just always take a dog with you when you need to leave the house.
I think that’s the whole point of this post, to reach out for option and ways to help with separation anxiety.
I do take him whenever I’m able to. But it isn’t always realistic. I do think I will have to look into training schools.
The taking the dog with him suggestion. You mean if the OP is doing outdoor activities or drive thu, right? Because I'd be nervous about the OP thinking you're suggesting to leave the dog in the car while he goes to do errands indoors.
Have you tried DogTV? I know sounds crazy but my dog use to bark like a nut too when left alone so I've put on DogTV on for her and now she doesn't bark as much, now she just lays there and watches the ducks and squirrels run around - you can find it by looking up DogTV on youtube.
Edit: I saw you say you leave the dog in the crate - me too so I put an ipad stand outside the crate so she can watch it from inside the crate. Usually when I crate her she tears up peepee pads and barks but with the iPad there for her to watch she's been more chill.
The IPAD is such a great idea. I have an old one I don’t use. Thank you!
Doggie daycare. Or a dog walker that comes to the house. You may need to get up earlier and provide more mental and physical stimulation before you leave for work, so the pup gets tired.
I have an Aussie (not mini) and I have spent a lot of time training her to be calm. The trainer we’re working with recommends teaching them to do a down/stay for increasing lengths of time until they learn that they can be calm even when other things happen. We have done the same thing with teaching her to stay in her crate and bed (small amount of time that increased). Aussies are not a naturally calm breed. They are ready to go at all times and they have to be explicitly taught how and when to be calm. If I were you I would start over at the beginning and get your pup to stay calm for short bursts of time (minutes) and increase the time only as long as your dog is successful. I’d also recommend looking into the 3Ds (distance, duration, and distractions). Your dog might be able to do one of those better than the other but trying to teach two at once is hard. So leaving for an hour is two skills (you being away and the time you are gone). I suspect your dog struggles with distance the most so that’s what I’d work on first. Good luck!
This is a very respectful thing for them to do. You’re lucky to have someone be so understanding. I would talk to them if you know who it is, and let them know you’re going to do everything you can to resolve it. and thank them as well. Best of luck, I’m sure you’ll be able to work it out :)
My dog is older than yours and admittedly not a barker, but I always exercise him before crating him. I also work from home so it's not often, but it makes me feel better to know he's tired and will just sleep the whole time (he'd do this anyway, but I do think it helps, haha). I would also practice crating while you're home for small time increments. You can put the crate by your work space, then get up and leave the room for a few minutes, stuff like that. Only reward/let them out when they're being quiet and ignore otherwise.
Get a certified separation anxiety trainer (cast). Google Malena de martini
Thank you!
You have a herding breed that wants to spend all of their time with their humans. Is he being crated in the same room as you, where he can see/hear you? What is his job? He needs to be mentally engaged so he can feel fulfilled and settle down. Look into agility, nosework, barn hunt, something to let him use the intelligence he was gifted with. Exercise is good but that only makes them stronger, they need homework.
He doesn’t cry in his crate if I am home - but he also is rarely ever in there while I am home unless I am vacuuming or something. He cries in the crate when we leave 1-3 hours a day - which I don’t always know the severity of since I’m not home.
Thanks so much for this comment. I’ve seen a few people asking what his job was. I’ve never taken into consideration he needs more tasks and mental stimulation. I grew up around dogs who didn’t need that as much - so I definitely have to think about this through a different lens.
If that were me (the neighbor), I'd offer to puppy-sit. ( I've had herding breed dogs. I get it.)
Let's think about this for a moment. Herding breeds were bred to work with the shepherd to accomplish a job.
So when you're not close to your dog, especially as a puppy, they're a bit lost. Some dogs do OK with this, or learn to do OK with this. Some dogs do not. Yours apparently doesn't, or isn't quite there yet. And that's not a slam, it's just what is.
My best advice is to find a puppy daycare with drop in half day rates for the times that he can't be with you.
Doggie day care, for a start?
Is he inside when you’re not home?
I’ve done a tiered approach with dogs. Obligatory not a trainer, but I’ve fostered dogs and my dog has developed some separation anxiety since working from home.
1.) get a webcam to see what triggers them, how they settle etc I do not engage with her because that might start a round of barking. I figure out when she notices things/perks up.
2.) Try them getting used to you not being around. Daycare once a week might help or hanging at a friend’s house for the day.
3.) a log of separation anxiety build up starts a lot earlier than the act of leaving. Work on it not being a big deal. Make the mundane tasks related to leaving a good thing.
Jangle some keys. Give them a treat. Put keys back. Go back to couch Grab your coat, give treats, put coat down. Go back to whatever you were doing. Etc
Leave for 30 minutes on an errand, come back.
4.) my dog would bark when I would return, I ignored her until she stopped barking in her kennel. When she stopped barking is when I released her. I tried not to give overt praise because being kenneled isn’t a punishment. It just is what it is for her safety.
Thank you so much for these tips. I really appreciate it
Owner of a 2-year-old Mini Aussie here. Isolation distress is something very normal for Aussies, unfortunately. They’re called Velcro dogs for a reason.
I wouldn’t recommend medicating because that doesn’t fix the behavior and that can be very traumatic depending on how frequently you have to go out. We used to have to medicate our pup whenever we took her for car rides because she would constantly vomit in the car, even during 10-minute drives. She now knows and runs away whenever we reach for the medicine. We were actually able to mostly train this out of her by showing her that car rides are fun. We’d take her to the park often in the car, take her to puppy play dates in the car, and she eventually started to equate the car with good things. You could actually try something similar when you leave the house too, but that’s a longer term solution.
Now, back to your specific issue since we have dealt and are currently still dealing with the same thing and have seen improvement. There are two things that I would recommend in the short-term:
First, this may seem counterintuitive, but it may be worth teaching your dog to “speak”, which you can then use to teach your dog “quiet”. Sounds harder than it actually is. I guarantee your dog will respond to the sound of someone knocking, so you can use this to your advantage. Knock on something (door, countertop, etc.) and say “speak” immediately afterwards. When your dog barks, say “yes” immediately (within 1 second) and then treat. After a little bit, they should be able to bark on cue (for an extra challenge, you can also teach “whisper”). Aussies are absurdly smart, so I bet yours will pick it up as quickly as mine did. Once they get a hang of that, teach “quiet” by doing something similar. Tell them to speak, say “quiet”, wait for them to stop, and then say “yes” and treat. You can also do this whenever they are barking unprompted. Also up the rate of reinforcement while they remain quiet, basically bombarding them with treats every half second or so). Once they get a hang of “quiet”, this sets you up for the next phase.
Second, buy a Nest cam, Furbo, or something similar with a built-in speaker and audio capture depending on your budget. The built-in speaker and audio capture are important though. The camera will allow you to keep an eye on your dog while you’re away (I’m sure you’ll eventually leave the pup out of the crate when you go out) and the audio capture will allow you to hear if they’re barking. With the speaker, you can give your “quiet” command remotely to get them to quiet down. If you buy something like the Furbo, you could even give them a treat remotely when they respond appropriately to your command.
Long-term, you can condition your dog to feel more comfortable when you’re away, like I mentioned in the paragraph about the meds. You could also try leaving the television on for your pup when you leave, if you’re getting desperate—we’ve found that helped a lot when ours was still a puppy. All of these things have helped us with the exact same issues you’re going through. We got lucky with our dog because after a week or two of having her, she happened to quiet down whenever we’d say “knock it off”. So once we got the Nest cam, we’d always just say that over the speaker and she’d quiet down for a bit. Training “quiet” has helped even more.
Good luck and I’m glad your neighbor is being fairly reasonable with this!
Thank you immensely for such a well written and insightful post. Thankfully he is over his car fears and gladly hops into the car to take a nap while I drive. The only thing I probably have down 😂
The advice in this thread is all over the place.
- Crate training is NOT the answer to separation anxiety. In fact, most separation anxiety trainers will recommend moving to a free-roam situation to alleviate any potential confinement anxiety which can exacerbate the symptoms.
- More exercise, while helpful in many cases for enrichment, is also not the answer to separation anxiety. Your dog will be tired and anxious instead of just anxious. You will have to do progressively more exercise to tire out your dog to the point of exhaustion as they get fitter, making this a very ineffective long-term strategy.
- Gimmicky cures like thundershirt, leaving the TV on etc may help some dogs, but honestly most of the time make absolutely no difference.
- Treats are not typically used as a component of separation anxiety training, we generally follow a strict step-by-step desensitization protocol. Food is problematic as it distracts the dog from the trigger (dog doesn't know you're gone until food runs out) and it adds value to the snack feeder who we are actively trying to phase out.
OP - first thing to do is test for Separation Anxiety (attachment to you specifically), Isolation Distress (needs a warm body in the room with them to feel safe) and Confinement Anxiety (panics when confined). It may be a combination of these problems. If he's fine left with another person, it's isolation distress. If he's fine left loose in the home it's confinement anxiety. If he's NOT fine whenever you're gone (even loose with another person) then it's separation anxiety. Know your problem, it changes the training plan and management strategy. Anybody giving you a specific plan is making too many assumptions at this point.
For treating either SA/Isolation Distress the book "treating separation anxiety in dogs" by melana de martini price is my gold standard recommendation for the budget self-study option. It's extremely comprehensive as it's aimed at trainers whilst also being accessible to pet parents. Hiring a CSAT (Certified Separation Anxiety Trainer) or taking the online course is the best route over all, as it provides accountability and support in addition to the knowledge you need.
Get up early and take home on a 3 -4 Mile walk even when it's cold or bad weather just dress appropriately. I do that with my dogs (two labs) and after that they are down for the count until around 2 or 3. They never had the barking issue but I never gave them the chance. I started walking shorter distances as puppies and worked my way up as they grew.
I’d tell them thanks for letting you know and that you’re sorry that he’s still a puppy and you’re trying your hardest to train him from separation anxiety. they make heart beat animals for pets, anxiety meds for pets, and anxiety vests too. You can try leaving the television on too.
I respect that your neighbor sent you a note. I am curious of the effectiveness of this note. I am in the same situation and I know that if I wrote a note to.my neighbor they would explode.
My neighbors are a middle aged couple that feel like they're very entitled and that everyone owes them something.
We have had issues with them in the past over property lines and they are just way too intense to deal with...because...as I said they are a entitled humans.
Curious as to how to approach the same situation without a fight...I'm thinking of getting a dog silencer and mounting it to the nearest tree of their fence and signal it everytime their dog barks. I guess I could hook it to a raspberry pi and everytime it recognizes a dog bark engage the dog bark silencer. That way I'm on auto...
One solution ive found for dogs with seperation anxiety is to wear them the f*%$ out.
Usually i can fix the issue with multiple long walks. Im typically working with larger Bulldogs, but ive seen behavioral improvements with chihuahuas as well.
For a mini Aussie, youve really chosen a SUPER high energy breed, so it wont be a quick plug n play solution. We are looking for improvement over time, not a quick fix. And that breed is SO ENERGETIC, youre going to have to probably do a couple 45 minute to one hour walks a day, everyday, to start noticing the improvements.
This will be on top of normal play time and training. Once the dog gets used to, "Owner not home means its sleepy time" for a couple months, the habit should stick.
Just let your neighbors know that you are actively working on it, what you are doing to improve the behavior, and beg for patience as you finish the pups training.
You should:
1) Thank your neighbor for being so understanding and not calling animal control immediately
2) Make sure your dog is not left alone from morning to night (a 9 month old aussie needs to run a lot outside), and hire a trainer to help you with the separation issue.
Is anyone else a little put off by the immediate suggestion of a bark collar? I get that some non-owners may not see the issue but it still bothered me idk
Seems like this is more of a vent then you wanting advice based on your responses to others. You really need to talk to your vet and get a trainer if you ACTUALLY want to solve this issue. I did so and now my dog is much happier and can be alone as needed without disturbing others.
I’m sorry you interpreted it that way. I’m super appreciative of all the advice I’m getting.
Before replying please read the sub rules and guidelines.
This sub does not support or recommend any type of corrective collars.